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Analogue ? the old debate........
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Patchmouse



Joined: Sep 27, 2006
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 09, 2012 5:40 am    Post subject: Analogue ? the old debate........ Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Some time ago I posted on here about buying a large analogue synthesiser, I still.......haven't done anything about it. I thought about what it is that I do musically, the experiences I've had in the past when analogue was the only choice, and the things I can now do with computers. The thought of spending around 4/5 thousand pounds on a new instrument had to be justified big-time, what would it do for me that my computer and my stable of virtual instruments couldn't do ? the answer was.......nothing, apart from provide me with a nice looking talking point in my studio, and a few nostalgic moments. I have listened extensively to the non-stop demo's on Youtube, of people doing the same old dance riffs and sequences on machines that cost an arm and a leg, sounds that could have been done on a MicroKorg. My take on things so far, is that technology has definitely moved on, that's an obvious statement, but sometimes we kid ourselves that we are missing something, when actually, we aren't. I can appreciate the need for a "live" instrument, something that is yours, for ever, an "object" but whenever I go to gigs these days all I see are lap-tops and mother keyboards.
If anyone can suggest an all in one live/studio solution, a keyboard that is small, lightweight, portable, and that is capable of giving me all of the sonic potential of my beloved Reaktor, then by all means point me in that direction, but I can't find anything right now, and the sonic possibilities of large analogue systems are very limited in my opinion without the aid and support of a studio around them. I am sure that there are lots of people here who would disagree with me on the above points, but it all comes down to what type of music you want to do, and one size doesn't fit all, but if I really thought that spending £5,000 would help me make "better" music I wouldn't bat an eyelid, I'd just buy it, but in the meantime I'll just rely on what I always do, and that's wait for some inspiration and ideas !
But sometimes technology can spur us on, it can actually inspire us, having a new box of exciting unexplored sounds, but software seems to be where the forefront is at the moment, and what inspires me most. I have been making music for the past 46 years, and it's only until recently that I feel that I've done "my" best work, without Reaktor and my computer I would still be struggling with hardware failing to do what it is that I want to do, I think if I was faced with an analogue synth and a hardware studio now I would be totally lost, I really can't see the point. Analogue synthesisers are extremely beautiful things to behold, works of art in fact, and they do hold a lot of nice memories for me, but that's it.

Patchmouse.
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Blue Hell
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 09, 2012 6:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

That was my reasoning to go Nord Modular and Kyma ... still for some types of patches analog would be different from digital, such patches would be exploring the boundaries of the technology ... it's artifacts, be it aliasing or noise or stability .. when you are searching your sounds in those areas it could be worthwhile to have both system types ... but analog is bulky and needs maintenance more.
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Patchmouse



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PostPosted: Sat Jun 09, 2012 6:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Blue Hell wrote:
That was my reasoning to go Nord Modular and Kyma ... still for some types of patches analog would be different from digital, such patches would be exploring the boundaries of the technology ... it's artifacts, be it aliasing or noise or stability .. when you are searching your sounds in those areas it could be worthwhile to have both system types ... but analog is bulky and needs maintenance more.


Yes, I like to use "artifacts" sometimes, my old DX7 was good at that ! But I find that there are a lot of sounds that I can get using the computer, and a wide range master keyboard that sound interesting in this respect, but where do you stop ! I think in the search for never ending possibilities we are in danger of loosing ourselves in confusion and un-productiveness. I think I have enough sound generating possibilities in my software now to last me for an infinite number of lifetimes Smile ! Talking of lifetimes, I'm not getting any younger, so my main priority now is to make as much music as possible with the minimum of hassle !

Thank's.....

Patchmouse.
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Cynosure
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 09, 2012 8:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I never understood why musicians are usually all one side or the other. Both analog and digital instruments have their advantages. So why limit yourself to jsut the one option? My studio has a nice mix of both technologies.

Also, you don't have to spend 4-5000 for a good analog synth.
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Patchmouse



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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2012 12:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Cynosure wrote:
I never understood why musicians are usually all one side or the other. Both analog and digital instruments have their advantages. So why limit yourself to jsut the one option? My studio has a nice mix of both technologies.

Also, you don't have to spend 4-5000 for a good analog synth.


I have one hardware synth, that's all, and in my post here about the Rhodes piano I would also like to have one of those again, I agree, why not take advantage of everything, if it offers you something, then use it. My point was very much to do with "bang for the buck" I'm always envious when I hear a really great acoustic guitarist, or a solo vocalist, they can move me to tears, and overwhelm me, and with what ? 6 strings and a piece of wood ! and the solo human voice, well, the most minimal of instruments and the most powerful. So when I walk into a studio and see rack upon rack of equipment, lots of electronics etc, and sometimes the music isn't all it should be, I think, MY GOD ! you could have done that on anything really. I'm always a bit suspect when someone turns up here with racks and lots of flight cases, whereas if they just have a carrier bag and one instrument, they are more likely to know that instrument inside out, and the technology isn't the issue, they just get on with the musical side of things.
After talking to a few people that have great professional careers, the "tools of the trade" are the last thing they seem to want to talk about, they are so over brimming with ideas it's sickening ! they could achieve what they do with virtual any old piece of kit. I like discussing the differences between one instrument and another sometimes, it can be interesting, but I have a few friends who are artists, painters, and you never hear them talk about the relative merits of different brushes and art materials !
I may come across as some sort of a mainstream traditionalist, but on the contrary, my interests are mainly to do with contemporary classical music, abstract electronics, and avant-garde film music, but what I've said above tends to shape my opinion of other musicians, and helps me to get a handle on where they are coming from.

Thanks.....

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Keysandslots



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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2012 7:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Great thread, much more civil than I would've figured.

I'm on the other side of the fence, I prefer hardware instruments and am not a big fan of "playing" the computer. Some of that comes down to lack of knowledge, it just seems to take too many steps for me to integrate the computer into my playing space (as opposed to recording space). The iPad is somewhere between a computer and a hardware instrument 'though.

You've hinted that the tools are just tools and that's all, and I agree with that. It all comes down to the person actually using the tools. I also agree that much of what is being produced with modulars is really just a noodle, self-playing sequences, and there isn't much out there that is really using the power available. I'm not sure why that is. Can someone on this forum point us to some really interesting music that shows off an analogue modular?

I have an odd mix of stuff, a Rhodes, Kurzweil K2600XS, Korg Microstation and a pair of Shruthis. I have just added an iPad 2 to the stable. The Shruthis are really cool, great sound, small package, small price and very well supported. I'm also impressed with the iPad, although not as a tablet, but as an addition to the music arsenal. Animoog is great fun, and a surprise find was a guitar synth called "Shredder". It does some great mangling to the guitar sound but the really cool thing was that it outputs MIDI. Since all of my instruments (except the Rhodes of course) are plugged into a MIDI patchbay, we were actually playing the Shruthis from the guitar.

I would very much like to get some analog modules, just to learn more about them. I really didn't "get the hang" of the G2X but that was mostly due to laziness, it's a great instrument. I'll most likely never end up with a true analogue modular because I cannot justify the cost.

You're right about inspiration and exploration. It's not that the modular would suddenly help you make better music, it may just inspire a new path. Of course, anything could do the same thing. A particularly well-tuned block of wood can inspire a song. The one "disappointment" (perhaps too strong a word) for me is that I always come back to what I'm used to. I started taking piano lessons in 1964 and no matter how much I try to embrace other stuff, I always come back to the keyboard. Argh!

Randy
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2012 8:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I agree that if you are looking for an all in one device, then digital is the way to go. Although, I would tend to lean towards a dedicated workstation type of keyboard (Kronos, Motif, JP80) that is made specifically for producing quality audio instead of a controller and a laptop. Despite everyone hating on the new Jupiter synths, they actually make great analog synth sounds for a digital synth, plus they do all the traditional acoustic emulations.

I think that with analog synths it is better to get a few synths for specific types of sounds. For example, Prophet 8 or a Juno for pads, Minitaur for bass and a powerful mono synth for lead/melody. Of course, you shouldn't restrict each synth to just that purpose, but it would ensure that you have some variety and everything is covered.

However, I think that the main draw to analog for me (as with many others) is the control surface. It is intuitive, simple and gives you access to all parameters at your fingertips, which allows you to be more creative and expressive with your sounds and performance. An analog synth with amazing sound that requires your to scroll through an LCD screen for every adjustment would probably never sell. Even things like the DSI Mopho might be annoying for sound creation (although I have never tried one).

I also agree that a good musician can perform on anything, and that sometimes those limitations can actually be a good thing because they emphasize the performance instead of the technology. Also, knowing that one instrument inside and out is of great benefit. It allows you to better use it to its full potential, which helps with creative expression in music. This is one thing that I really like about making my own gear. Since I soldered it all by hand, I know exactly what is happening in the circuits and I have a better idea of how to shape the sound (although I am still finding new sound possibilities on a synth I finished building over 8 months ago).

As for the modular thing - I do not have one myself but from what I gather it has a lot to do with using the logic and patching to create patterns and rhythms that you would never come up with on your own. I agree that it is more turning knobs and plugging stuff in, more it is still a performance of types. Here is a good video clip of several modular performances:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w2lg4hwKAXw
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soundwave106



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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2012 10:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Keysandslots wrote:
I also agree that much of what is being produced with modulars is really just a noodle, self-playing sequences, and there isn't much out there that is really using the power available. I'm not sure why that is. Can someone on this forum point us to some really interesting music that shows off an analogue modular?


Done on, yes... best examples I can think of offhand come from the "space" genre, artists that use modulars (Robert Rich and Steve Roach for instance). I think there's a few industrial artists out there with modular stuff, usually to get deeper sounds or aggressive distortion (Trent Reznor's Social Network soundtrack for instance sounded like he used quite a bit of his rather extensive Eurorack system.).

"Shows off", OTOH, no. A piece of music is usually not done to demo off a piece of equipment, and in most cases, I'd imagine a modular user would use the appropriate tool for the idea he or she wants. That could entail a modular (which while able to be tamed is very good at chaos) or maybe some digital (eg digital pads). The Youtube modular show-offs are often rather poor at showing the potential musical uses, yes, too often focusing on raw tones and functionality.

I don't think I've seen too many professional electronic musicians that are 100% all analog, unless that's their specific schtick. The typical pattern is to start off with your DAW and some softsynths, and then add hardware (analog or not) from there. Some of course do end up leaning heavily on analog tones. However, I don't think a whole lot of musicians *totally* exclude digital. I don't know why so many flame fests turn into analog vs. digital, they both have their use. About the only thing I've done *personally* is gotten rid of my digital hardware in favor of software synthesizers, but I still want some samples / realistic sounds and digital pads in my arsenal of tools!
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Patchmouse



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PostPosted: Mon Jun 11, 2012 1:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Well, the i-Pad is interesting, and I may investigate, although, it may well be a long learning curve ! which puts me off a bit.
Yes, modular's and chaos ? they are very good at that type of thing, owing to separate modules, with different clocks all running at different speeds, that's one of my main gripes with computers, you only have one central clock ! unless you use multiple machines. But chaos is only one element in my music, I like the combination of "bitter/sweet" so I may spend ages creating an abstract chaotic sound only to use a little bit of it in a final mix, which brings me right back to my first post about value for money and bang for the buck.

That video clip is interesting, although even the "randomness" (Vostok) is cyclical, what I would ultimately like is the ability to completely move from one type of sound to another that is completely different, almost like a morphing of styles, rather than sounds, I have to do this on my DAW at the moment using conventional DJ style mixing effects, but to do that on the fly with a combination of sounds patterns and styles and also the ability to freeze "mid-morph" and go off somewhere else would be a real step forward. As for this type of flexibility on a synthesizer, well, we haven't even scratched the surface of this concept yet. I have read all the article that Brian Eno has written about this very subject, I find it extremely interesting, that one day the actual consumers of music may become the creators, using techniques like I just mentioned, but you will be able to do it on your mobile phone, frightening !

Thank's everyone......

Patchmouse.
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GovernorSilver



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PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 6:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Keysandslots wrote:
Can someone on this forum point us to some really interesting music that shows off an analogue modular?


"Interesting" can be a dangerous word, because what is interesting to me might not be to you and vice versa. Wink

"Silver Apples Of The Moon", composed and recorded by Morton Subotnick, is one of the classic works in the history of analog modulars. I recently saw him perform an updated version of this piece on a modern Buchla modular and Ableton Live. The original was performed on what is now considered a vintage Buchla modular. Modern Buchla modulars though are hybrid analog-digital systems - some modules are digital, some are analog.

I've been a fan of Robert Rich's stuff - to me he is one of the composers whose talents transcend the specific equipment he uses on a particular recording. He has some releases featuring his MOTM modular - others feature Yamaha FM synths, lap steel guitar, flute, etc. I suppose most people classify his music as "ambient" as opposed to Subotnick's which is "contemporary classical".

Some pop music was recorded with modulars - Vince Clark has used them with Erasure and other bands; Human League I read used a Roland modular, etc.

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 7:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I have a friend who has an analog modular, a Moog Voyager Old School, and an ARP (an AXXE I think). He writes pieces just for the modular, just for the Voyager, etc. So when he shows up at a gig, its with one of his synths, not his entire synth collection. As a solo musician, he has the freedom to plan his set howwever he likes, so he of course structures his set so that all the pieces he plays is for the synth that he brought that day/night.

So that ie one example of how a musician, whose primary instrument is synth (NOT "keyboard"), reconciles having multiple synths instead of having an all-in-one.

I do not "know" any of my synths as well a he knows his. But I am fine with that. I have been slowly trying to educate myself on how each synth works, but I'm still a "preset" kind of person in that I pull up presets whose sounds I like, and make music with them. I will probably never write my own brilliant synth patch, let alone patch together a real modular into something interesting and cool (to me). The G2 forum has particularly spoiled me, in that there are so many good patches for my G2X.

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Patchmouse



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PostPosted: Wed Jun 13, 2012 12:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

This morning I'm off to record some tracks for my next compilation, no synthesizers in sight, I'll be using a Fender Stratocaster, a Fender amp, and that's it, all recorded straight to stereo on an Olympus LS11, with no effects, and a clean guitar sound. It's good to not have to think about "patches" preset or otherwise, just get on with making one hell of a big noise ! I'm not a guitarist, as such, but I do like, and am influenced by the work of Derek Bailey, and my life was changed by playing on the free-improv scene for a few years, I can recommend it ! I can never listen to music in the same way as before, it really did have a major impact on my perception of what so called "music" is.
I now agree with some, that acoustically generated processed sounds are the most rich, and interesting of timbres, purely electronic sounds can be flat in comparison, and don't respond as well to processing, that's why I like to combine acoustic instruments and sounds into my work, even though my ability on some of these instruments is limited, it doesn't matter, these tracks make great raw material to play with later. I think it's best to not distinguish really, it's all sound, and it's all useful !

Patchmouse.
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GovernorSilver



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PostPosted: Wed Jun 13, 2012 5:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Patchmouse wrote:
This morning I'm off to record some tracks for my next compilation, no synthesizers in sight, I'll be using a Fender Stratocaster, a Fender amp, and that's it, all recorded straight to stereo on an Olympus LS11, with no effects, and a clean guitar sound. It's good to not have to think about "patches" preset or otherwise, just get on with making one hell of a big noise ! I'm not a guitarist, as such, but I do like, and am influenced by the work of Derek Bailey, and my life was changed by playing on the free-improv scene for a few years, I can recommend it ! I can never listen to music in the same way as before, it really did have a major impact on my perception of what so called "music" is.
I now agree with some, that acoustically generated processed sounds are the most rich, and interesting of timbres, purely electronic sounds can be flat in comparison, and don't respond as well to processing, that's why I like to combine acoustic instruments and sounds into my work, even though my ability on some of these instruments is limited, it doesn't matter, these tracks make great raw material to play with later. I think it's best to not distinguish really, it's all sound, and it's all useful !

Patchmouse.


Sounds like good fun! Derek Bailey's book "On Improvisation" has been an influence in my musical thinking ever since I read it for the first time.

So many options for processing acoustically generated sounds too. I continue to be astounded by the audio processing patches that Tim and others keep developing for the Nord Modular G2. I need to have my Cocolase fixed. This beast records incoming audio into 8 samples, which it will then play back like a normal delay, or backwards, or a mix of both; and the samples can be played back in random order.

Unfortunately, for those of us who are fighting off GAS for real modulars, a physical modular system is just as capable as an audio processing machine as the virtual modulars in my G2. There are modules for filtering of course, and ring mod, and so on... but there's also Make Noise's Phonogene sampling module and Echophon granulated delay module.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 13, 2012 9:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I view analog and digital as two different mediums. In the art world, one can choose between say, oil, acrylic, or water color -- the choice is driven by the artist's intention.

The last few years, I've found more inspiration from my analog modular than my digital synth (a K2600) however I don't regard analog to be inherently better than digital.

Also, you don't need $10,000 USD for an analog synth -- particularly if you are willing and/or able to build your own. Smile

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Patchmouse



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PostPosted: Fri Jun 15, 2012 1:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

kkissinger wrote:
I view analog and digital as two different mediums. In the art world, one can choose between say, oil, acrylic, or water color -- the choice is driven by the artist's intention.

The last few years, I've found more inspiration from my analog modular than my digital synth (a K2600) however I don't regard analog to be inherently better than digital.

Also, you don't need $10,000 USD for an analog synth -- particularly if you are willing and/or able to build your own. Smile


I am able, I think, to build my own, I can solder, and have a basic knowledge of electronics, but my eyesight is getting bad, and I just don't have the time or inclination anymore. If I did buy an analogue synth, hen I would like to get something that would be fun to use, and have lots of option's hence a large of-the-peg modular, which at £5,000 is the mid-bottom end of the ready-made market really ! for something decent and fairly reliable. In the meantime I'll just soldier on with what I have.

I love electronics and music, the discovery never ends, that's what got me into it in the first place, infinite worlds of new sound experiences.

Patchmouse
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 15, 2012 8:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Patchmouse wrote:
I am able, I think, to build my own, I can solder, and have a basic knowledge of electronics, but my eyesight is getting bad, and I just don't have the time or inclination anymore.


I have to wear a magnifier...

http://www.all-spec.com/products/DA-10.html?gclid=CJul59fA0LACFYje4AodO1NqMQ

...to do intricate work.

Of course, time and inclination is another thing! Smile

Since you want to go modular, you can build your system up over time and that may open up some options. And yes, the high-end synths (Buchla, Serge, etc) are pricey.

I agree that for your long-term enjoyment, you should acquire the synth that you want -- something high-quality that will give years of enjoyment.

All the best!

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 15, 2012 9:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Patchmouse wrote:
If I did buy an analogue synth, hen I would like to get something that would be fun to use, and have lots of option's hence a large of-the-peg modular, which at £5,000 is the mid-bottom end of the ready-made market really ! for something decent and fairly reliable.


If some magical being made all my gear disappear, then dumped a bag of money in my basement to replace the gear, I would probably start rebuilding the analog side of my synth rig with the Arturia Minibrute, which in the US sells for only $500 new. Over time I would build a modular system around the Minibrute.

My Minimoog Voyager has a seductive sound, but it really is overkill for my synth needs. The front panel looks simple, but the use of patch memory adds a hidden layer of complexity. One cannot tell what the control assignments are for the touchplate just by looking at it - one has to dive into menus to figure that out.

The most appealing analog synths to me have user interfaces in which every function/parameter has a knob or slider.

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Patchmouse



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PostPosted: Sat Jun 16, 2012 2:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I think some time this year I will make a positive move on this modular business. I'll go into it with an open mind, I really don't know what I'll do with it, right now, probably stare at it for a few weeks ! I'm more or less sold on one of the larger systems from either Analogue Systems, or Doepfer, both have good reputations, are reliable, and easy to service. I do like that little Vostok though, the portability, and the thought of it being my one and only instrument for some gigs, that's attractive, but it is expensive for what it is. I could get a new EMS AKS for more or less the same price here in England although there is a waiting list. I used to own an EMS back in the 70's, they are lovely, with a very distinctive sound, that really is like nothing else, very haunting. It will be interesting to see how my decision works out on a musical front, how it will affect what I do, that's the bottom line really. Still, nothing is set in stone, if I feel I've made a mistake I can just sell it and get something else.

Patchmouse.
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ashleym



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PostPosted: Sat Jun 16, 2012 4:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Interesting debate.

I am happy with hardware or software. They do different things well. I can get a good bass sound out of my SH101 very quickly and sculpt it to suit the track I am doing and keep adjusting the sound as I record. I have a MFOS Ultimate/Expander and I am just finishing a MFOS analogue sequencer- there is nothing better for me than a sequencer I can get my hands on.

But I am also addicted to my NI Reaktor and FM8, the latter gets programmed and used where my, also much loved, Casio VZ10M doesnt. All good and all fun.

Back to your issue, at the high end I would suggest Buchla or Serge to make sounds you might not get in software. In the real world Doepfer etc as you have already looked at. You can get a pretty big system for £2K. But modulars are big news now and there are a lot of manufacturers out there. Look at the Eurorack modules from:

http://postmodular.co.uk/home

London based and have a wide selection. No you dont get a uniform look but you do get unusual modules.

Finally you do get interfaces between a computer and modular.

http://www.motu.com/products/software/volta

again there is a UK based version of this whose name escapes me. These will give used computer based LFO, CVs and gates etc to sync correctly and to be more versatile than a simple ADSR of whatever.

Good luck, you are in a lucky position!!
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Patchmouse



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PostPosted: Sun Jun 17, 2012 1:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Thank's for the links, Ashleym, I have considered a Buchla, that's what I would actually really like, but the UK representative no longer handles them, and there is nothing in the rest of Europe either. This whole subject about importing from the USA is a thorny one, there is import duty, and our dreaded VAT to take into consideration, plus, if anything goes wrong in the shipping process, damage etc, it can be a total nightmare, that's why I'm more or less resigned to buying from a UK based company, or someone in Europe at least. Although, I was looking at the larger systems from synthesizer.com and they are very tempting !
Yes, I have FM7, and Reaktor, as a previous DX7 owner I had to have my sounds, and Reaktor is just sublime, I like to see how much I can do with just one instrument, it's such an amazing program. Someone else mentioned the i-pad here, and I'm definitely interested in computer/hardware crossovers, I built a light controlled six oscillator synth recently, and I would like to explore light control a lot more, I find it very expressive, it would be good to try and interface it somehow, with the computer.

Patchmouse.
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ashleym



Joined: Aug 20, 2009
Posts: 181
Location: uk

PostPosted: Sun Jun 17, 2012 3:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

To go off topic a bit, there are a lot of light control options. You have the Lunetta types, I have used MAX/Msp and I am going here to look at Super Collider with an Arduino interface

http://www.wegottickets.com/event/165751

Finally have a look at these people if you like the large modular format and want something UK based. You will find them over on Muffwiggler.com in the Oakley section

http://www.krisp1.com/

I will shut up now!!!
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Patchmouse



Joined: Sep 27, 2006
Posts: 140
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 17, 2012 4:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

ashleym wrote:
To go off topic a bit, there are a lot of light control options. You have the Lunetta types, I have used MAX/Msp and I am going here to look at Super Collider with an Arduino interface

http://www.wegottickets.com/event/165751

Finally have a look at these people if you like the large modular format and want something UK based. You will find them over on Muffwiggler.com in the Oakley section

http://www.krisp1.com/

I will shut up now!!!


Thanks, what I want to do nearer the time is to have a meeting with whoever I decide to buy from, to discuss the system, so it's clear exactly that I'm going to get what I want. I'm certainly not going to buy an expensive system over the phone, "on spec" so to speak, or mail order. I've gone and made a template at the Doepfer site, as a starting point, of all the modules that I think I will need, but as I said, I need to talk to the builder to make sure I haven't left out any important utility modules etc. Doepfer do a light control module as well, and a few other alternative control modules. I will also investigate Analogue Systems as they fill a few gaps that Doepfer miss.

Patchmouse.
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GovernorSilver



Joined: Apr 26, 2004
Posts: 1336
Location: Washington DC Metro
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 19, 2012 9:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Patchmouse wrote:
Thank's for the links, Ashleym, I have considered a Buchla, that's what I would actually really like, but the UK representative no longer handles them, and there is nothing in the rest of Europe either.


BTW, modern Buchla modulars tend to be hybrid digital-analog - they are not pure analog. Don't know if that matters to you - it doesn't matter obviously to Subotnick or the other modern Buchla modular owners out there.

From the FAQ at http://www.buchla.com/series200e.html

You refer to the 200e as an analog system. But your oscillators use digital techniques. What gives?


The common meaning of these terms (analog vs. digital) stems from historical association between user environment and supportive circuitry.

An analog synthesizer is one that uses analog elements, such as knobs and wires, for user interaction.

Now, production costs favor digital circuitry, and the proliferation of samplers demands it. The user interface has become digital for the sake of economy. A single switch can accomplish many functions; multi-level menus, data selectors, and LCDs provide a compact and cheap-to-build facility. These systems do not consider the user interface to be of paramount importance. Parallel access is impossible, alternative interconnection improbable, performance is dependent on MIDI controllers connected with preconceived notions on what each aspect of the controller should accomplish.

Now things have changed. It costs practically nothing to convert between digital and analog respresentations. The designer can provide the user with whatever interface he likes, and proceed to design circuitry that efficiently implements the desired functionality. The user need never know the circuit design, and should not be able to readily discern its premises.

We define the 200e synthesizer as analog. By that, we are describing the aspect that the user contacts as analog. The underlying circuitry is a hybrid mix, constantly flowing from one domain to the other - not even predictable from one module to the next - always designed for uncompromising performance - never for adherence to a design style.

For those who can benefit from further discussion, we shall present some of the design considerations that were used in designing circuitry for a few of the 200e modules. First, we'll consider the 225e MIDI Interface. This gadget has a single digital input (MIDI) located on the back of the system. On the front you'll find 20 analog signals, decoded with 20 digital to analog decoders (DACs). Inside the box are velocity conversion tables (digital) polyphonic logic (digital), assignment directories (digital), and other logic, all tasks best performed digitally. Outside the box - it's strictly an analog world.

Let's look at one additional module, the 292e Quad Dynamics Manager. This one has compelling reasons for digital control paths and analog signal paths. Digital control paths because of the necessity for patch storage and retrieval; analog signal paths for the following two reasons:
The enormous dynamic range and extremely low distortion that characterize this module demand specialized analog circuitry.

The peculiar non-linear combination of lowpass and amplitude functions also calls for analog circuitry. A digital implementation would have been possible, but far more complex and demonstrating no advantage.
The design approach used in the 292e is similar to that used in several of the 200e series modules. We employ digital techniques for control structures because of the ease of storing and retrieving presets; we use analog techniques in signal chains for optimal dynamic range and to satisfy various perceptual requirements. And, importantly, the user encounters an analog environment.

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GovernorSilver



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PostPosted: Tue Jun 19, 2012 9:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

BTW, yes, with unlimited funds, I'd get a Buchla 200e series modular too.
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Patchmouse



Joined: Sep 27, 2006
Posts: 140
Location: London

PostPosted: Fri Jun 22, 2012 2:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

GovernorSilver wrote:
BTW, yes, with unlimited funds, I'd get a Buchla 200e series modular too.


Well, I would, but importing one into the UK as I said, is difficult, if anyone has any ideas then I would be very grateful, but the UK importer no longer handles them.

Patchmouse.
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