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 Forum index » Instruments and Equipment » Modular Synthesis
A warning to those buying ASys modules in the US
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synthbaron



Joined: Oct 21, 2006
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 20, 2006 6:37 pm    Post subject: A warning to those buying ASys modules in the US Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

You will not be able to obtain calibration/service documentation if you need to fix a module. Bob Williams will not supply you with documentation, nor will Roger at Big City Music. You are forced to pay $70/hour to have BCM fix out of warranty modules. Buyer beware!
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v-un-v
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 20, 2006 6:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

That's an interesting point to raise. I suppose it's the difference between commercial and DIY. On the whole, the American modulars are built without compromise, but the Euro ones are built with cheapness in mind. If you compare an Cyndustries module to an AS module, the difference in build quality is clear.

With modular building, you have two choices. Either go the DIY route or spend hundreds on a commercial design. Okay there are exceptions (MOTM or Blacet for eg, both provide kits). Most Cyndustries stuff is made from KS's boards, and put in a nice box. KS's DIY stuff is very cheap, Cynthia's stuff not. But in order to 'make a living' those kinds of prices have to be demanded- otherwise you go broke, and we don't want that do we?

To be honest, I don't blame AS for doing this, as they don't demand the asking prices of the 'heavies'.

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synthbaron



Joined: Oct 21, 2006
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 21, 2006 5:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Doepfer is cheaper than ASys, yet they supply full service documentation and schematics (albeit in German). It has nothing to do with parts. Everyone uses the same parts (except MOTM and those damn $7 pots). I just fixed a Doepfer module with help from one of their empoyee's via e-mail. ASys (or their distributors) policy must be "we're going to make it cheaper just to buy a new one". Sad.
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elektro80
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 21, 2006 6:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Asys is these guys: http://www.analoguesystems.co.uk ??
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synthbaron



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PostPosted: Thu Dec 21, 2006 7:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Yes, Analogue Systems.
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REwire



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PostPosted: Sun Dec 24, 2006 11:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I saw your posts on Gas Station and here and have to chime in on the flaming.

I've bought a ton of AS modules from Roger at Big City Music and have had nothing but great luck and friendly service. The only problems I've had is blowing fuses in my AS cases (So easy to do) and the RS-310 Reverb/Chorus module was not working right. Roger directed me to Bob Williams and he showed me how to adjust the pots on the PCB to get it to work right. Send me a Schematic?? I don't think many electronics manufactures will do that. Ask Cynthia, Wowa or Peter Grenader if they will do that. I dunno. Never asked, never needed to and I have stuff from all of them. Dieter Doepfer may be so secure in his designs and confident in his status as a leading Mfg that he has nothing to lose in giving his secrets up.

Also, putting AS stuff in Doepfer cabinets is a risk as they don't blow like AS does immediately saving the Module. You gotta be careful as hell and I have 5 AS in a Doepfer rack with a homemade plug board and been lucky so far. If I'd fried them, my bad, my $.

Overall, I think you got yourself into a pickle that is not indicative of all the AS users in the US or abroad and those that have relied on Roger's excellent caring service and been satisfied. You may be rightfully miffed at these policies but they are not policies that infringe upon the average happy user and those seeking AS stuff in the US.

Dan

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v-un-v
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 24, 2006 3:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

REwire wrote:
I saw your posts on Gas Station and here and have to chime in on the flaming.


Flaming? There is no flaming here. We at electro-music.com are way too cool to fan flames Cool Very Happy
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seraph
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 25, 2006 1:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

v-un-v wrote:
We at electro-music.com are way too cool to fan flames Cool Very Happy

right on Exclamation Wink

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synthbaron



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PostPosted: Mon Dec 25, 2006 2:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Quote:
The only problems I've had is blowing fuses in my AS cases (So easy to do) and the RS-310 Reverb/Chorus module was not working right. Roger directed me to Bob Williams and he showed me how to adjust the pots on the PCB to get it to work right


I had not mentioned to Roger that I had blown the module. Bob sent me to Roger to obtain service information. So that's all I asked of him. This is the exact e-mail I sent to Roger:

"Hello,

I am in need of a service manual and/or calibration procedure for the Analogue Systems RS-110 Multimode filter. Bob referred me to you to procure them.

Thanks,
Jay "

And he replied with:

"Hi Jay. We do not supply service manuals for A.S. products. We do however repair A.S. products."

You can deduce whatever you want from that. I wish someone would have just told me what pots to tweak!

REwire wrote:
If I'd fried them, my bad, my $.


Oh, absolutely. This is ultimately my fault. And I fully support their right to blow me off and declare me fully incompetant and decide only to support me by taking it in for repair.

But I don't have to agree with that and leaving me no option but to pay $70/hour plus shipping charges to calibrate a module which may not even need it. You employ certain business practices, you should be prepared for the bad publicity. Espepcially dealing with someone who you know doesn't keep quiet.
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ndkent



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PostPosted: Fri Dec 29, 2006 1:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

It does seem to be a reality that especially with modern "boutique" manufacturers, you more often than not aren't going to get any sort of service docs unless you can buy a kit. That is, if they even exist in presentable printed form.

After they turned down a general "I need service docs" request, I myself would have followed up by asking a specific "how to" question regarding a specific calibration or repair you need. I'd think their response at that point would be far more telling as to their level of support.
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REwire



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PostPosted: Sun Dec 31, 2006 1:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

SynthBaron wrote:
You employ certain business practices, you should be prepared for the bad publicity. Espepcially dealing with someone who you know doesn't keep quiet.


Yes, however if that's what bad practices are then SONY and every electronics maker should get bad publicity for not providing you with ways to align the laser on your DVD player yourself. Go get 'em.

Perhaps you didn't ask the right question or maybe were rude, but hey, I have an RS-110 out of a case now and looking at the back of it, there are 4 pots on the back that could be adjusted, so what the hell got those out of alignment in the first place? Did this module not work when you got it? If not Roger would have exchanged it. If you messed with it and it stopped working, turning a few pots would not fix, but calibrate CV scaling, CV levels, temp and one other I can't tell. If you wrote, "My RS-110 does not scale 1/V Oct, help," maybe that would get a help. But "My RS-110 is not working, send me do it myself repair docs" ...........WTF?

So overall, nothing about Roger's or Asys policies are offensive or prohibitive to normal business and reflect the majority of manufacturers in the world.

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