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mother misty
Joined: May 13, 2004 Posts: 681 Location: Ghent / Belgium
Audio files: 82
G2 patch files: 130
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Posted: Tue Feb 27, 2007 3:04 am Post subject:
Midi-Latency |
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Hi all,
I've been experimenting with G2-sequencers to control external gear lately.
But everytime I've have a big latency when I try to send midi-notes to
external gear.
In this particular case I've tried a simple event sequencer connected
to a midi note send module to trigger samples on a kaosspad 3.
The kaoss pad is connected directly to the G2 with a midi cable
and still I've a huge latency. Is this normal? |
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ian-s
Joined: Apr 01, 2004 Posts: 2669 Location: Auckland, New Zealand
Audio files: 42
G2 patch files: 626
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Posted: Tue Feb 27, 2007 9:59 am Post subject:
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The total transmission time of a three byte note on message is about 1ms. The receiving device then needs a little time to process, then make the sound. What sort of delay are we talking about? |
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dasz
Joined: Oct 16, 2004 Posts: 1644 Location: victoria, canada
Audio files: 29
G2 patch files: 56
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Posted: Tue Feb 27, 2007 5:21 pm Post subject:
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I've noticed latency when controlling my dave smith evolver (cutoff) with g2 envelopes which connect to cc send. I think the problem is the dave smith's reaction time to control changes.
I'll look into this (sending midi notes to external stuff) when I get home.
/Dasz |
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blue hell
Site Admin
Joined: Apr 03, 2004 Posts: 24075 Location: The Netherlands, Enschede
Audio files: 277
G2 patch files: 320
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Posted: Tue Feb 27, 2007 5:46 pm Post subject:
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When sending continuously changing data it's easy to exceed the MIDI bandwidth. This can be avoided for example by inserting a s&h triggered from an LFO just before the blue input of the CC send module. Set the LFO to a speed that has to be a compromise between hearing steps and hearing latency. _________________ Jan
also .. could someone please turn down the thermostat a bit.
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dasz
Joined: Oct 16, 2004 Posts: 1644 Location: victoria, canada
Audio files: 29
G2 patch files: 56
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Posted: Tue Feb 27, 2007 5:54 pm Post subject:
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yeah ... i was thinking of this too. i need to spend more time at home than on the road ...
/Dasz |
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dasz
Joined: Oct 16, 2004 Posts: 1644 Location: victoria, canada
Audio files: 29
G2 patch files: 56
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Posted: Tue Feb 27, 2007 6:59 pm Post subject:
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you know, we should really use avatars based in MRI scans of our brains with some visualization which represents how much overlap we have between each other ...
ok -- just going on a silly tangent here
/Dasz |
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mosc
Site Admin
Joined: Jan 31, 2003 Posts: 18195 Location: Durham, NC
Audio files: 211
G2 patch files: 60
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Posted: Tue Feb 27, 2007 7:45 pm Post subject:
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Mother, I've done lots of MIDI sequence generation for external synth voices and haven't seen any objectionable latencies. I could see that some rapidly changing CCs would choke the MIDI stream. In cases where that is necessary, I try to chop the signal with the slowest clock rate I can get away with.
But you say it's MIDI Notes. _________________ --Howard
my music and other stuff |
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mother misty
Joined: May 13, 2004 Posts: 681 Location: Ghent / Belgium
Audio files: 82
G2 patch files: 130
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Posted: Wed Feb 28, 2007 6:53 am Post subject:
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Thanks for the replys guys!
Well, the latency is pretty big (check the attached MP3 for an example,
the kick is a machinedrum, the dub skank a kaoss pad 3.
The dub skank is placed on the beat but it doesn't sound like that...)
I've attached the patch aswell. Any idea's?
[Blue Hell: there is a better version of the patch here]
Description: |
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Download |
Filename: |
Latency.mp3 |
Filesize: |
196.85 KB |
Downloaded: |
1081 Time(s) |
Description: |
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Download |
Filename: |
KP3Seq.pch2 |
Filesize: |
1.46 KB |
Downloaded: |
1729 Time(s) |
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blue hell
Site Admin
Joined: Apr 03, 2004 Posts: 24075 Location: The Netherlands, Enschede
Audio files: 277
G2 patch files: 320
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Posted: Wed Feb 28, 2007 7:44 am Post subject:
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mother misty wrote: | I've attached the patch aswell. Any idea's? |
Nothing wrong with the patch ... got a MIDI loop somewhere maybe ? _________________ Jan
also .. could someone please turn down the thermostat a bit.
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blue hell
Site Admin
Joined: Apr 03, 2004 Posts: 24075 Location: The Netherlands, Enschede
Audio files: 277
G2 patch files: 320
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Posted: Wed Feb 28, 2007 7:46 am Post subject:
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Oh wait, the seq mod will give notes (trigs) at ranndom times I guess. Could that be it ? _________________ Jan
also .. could someone please turn down the thermostat a bit.
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mother misty
Joined: May 13, 2004 Posts: 681 Location: Ghent / Belgium
Audio files: 82
G2 patch files: 130
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Posted: Wed Feb 28, 2007 7:58 am Post subject:
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Blue Hell wrote: | mother misty wrote: | I've attached the patch aswell. Any idea's? |
Nothing wrong with the patch ... got a MIDI loop somewhere maybe ? |
Nope, the midi out from the G2 goes directly to the KP3 midi in.
The KP3 midi out is not connected. |
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mother misty
Joined: May 13, 2004 Posts: 681 Location: Ghent / Belgium
Audio files: 82
G2 patch files: 130
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Posted: Wed Feb 28, 2007 8:04 am Post subject:
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Blue Hell wrote: | Oh wait, the seq mod will give notes (trigs) at ranndom times I guess. Could that be it ? |
hmm, what do you mean with notes at random times?
(there's a RND trigger in the patch, but this shouldn't do more than let the trigger trough or not) |
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blue hell
Site Admin
Joined: Apr 03, 2004 Posts: 24075 Location: The Netherlands, Enschede
Audio files: 277
G2 patch files: 320
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Posted: Wed Feb 28, 2007 8:36 am Post subject:
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mother misty wrote: | Blue Hell wrote: | Oh wait, the seq mod will give notes (trigs) at ranndom times I guess. Could that be it ? |
hmm, what do you mean with notes at random times?
(there's a RND trigger in the patch, but this shouldn't do more than let the trigger trough or not) |
Hmm in the patch as you sent it does nothing, but when you use that switch mechanism by opening the mod pot in the switcher it might switch off from a note that is off to a note that is on (in the other event qequence) and this will happen at a random moment, unsynced to the beat. _________________ Jan
also .. could someone please turn down the thermostat a bit.
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3phase
Joined: Jul 27, 2004 Posts: 1183 Location: Berlin
Audio files: 13
G2 patch files: 141
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Posted: Thu Mar 01, 2007 1:59 am Post subject:
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I havent had a look to the patch...it sounds way to early to me.
I think you have to delay the G2 triggers...
what bluehell said might sounds like more weard patching...maybe your sequencers trigger on the falling edge of the pulse making them way off...
its defenetly not so much midilatency in the nord... |
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dasz
Joined: Oct 16, 2004 Posts: 1644 Location: victoria, canada
Audio files: 29
G2 patch files: 56
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Posted: Thu Mar 01, 2007 8:16 am Post subject:
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try taking out the rnd module -- is this still happening then?? I'd patch a 2 way switch to take the signal directly to the note out or through the rnd instead ...
/Dasz |
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mother misty
Joined: May 13, 2004 Posts: 681 Location: Ghent / Belgium
Audio files: 82
G2 patch files: 130
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Posted: Mon Mar 05, 2007 8:47 am Post subject:
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dasz wrote: | try taking out the rnd module -- is this still happening then?? I'd patch a 2 way switch to take the signal directly to the note out or through the rnd instead ...
/Dasz |
Even if I connect the sequencer directly to a midi note send module, the timing still isn't tight
Have you tried to sequence external gear with the G2 dasz? |
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mosc
Site Admin
Joined: Jan 31, 2003 Posts: 18195 Location: Durham, NC
Audio files: 211
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mother misty
Joined: May 13, 2004 Posts: 681 Location: Ghent / Belgium
Audio files: 82
G2 patch files: 130
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Posted: Mon Mar 05, 2007 9:24 am Post subject:
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Thanks mosc, I'll have a look at your patch tonight.
One more question, how is your kurzweill connected,
with a midi cable directly from the G2 or not? |
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mosc
Site Admin
Joined: Jan 31, 2003 Posts: 18195 Location: Durham, NC
Audio files: 211
G2 patch files: 60
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Posted: Mon Mar 05, 2007 9:37 am Post subject:
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mother misty wrote: | One more question, how is your kurzweill connected,
with a midi cable directly from the G2 or not? |
I go though this ancient beast called a Unitor8. Essentially it is an 8 in by 8 out MIDI router connected to the computer with a RS232 cable. The way I use it is pretty lame. I route everything into the computer and do the routing with MIDIOX. The Unitor8 has its own software that can do the routing internally, but I like the MIDIOX software better and haven't noticed any objectionable latency. _________________ --Howard
my music and other stuff |
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mother misty
Joined: May 13, 2004 Posts: 681 Location: Ghent / Belgium
Audio files: 82
G2 patch files: 130
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Posted: Tue Mar 06, 2007 1:24 am Post subject:
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Damn...
The starting points of my samples in my kaoss pad3 are a bit fucked up,
that's why everything sounds out of sync, I feel so stupid!!
I've changed the samples and it works fine now.
Thanks for your time anyway guys, this G2>KP3 combo is serious fun and gives alot of new options! |
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blue hell
Site Admin
Joined: Apr 03, 2004 Posts: 24075 Location: The Netherlands, Enschede
Audio files: 277
G2 patch files: 320
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Posted: Tue Mar 06, 2007 4:06 am Post subject:
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At least you found it. _________________ Jan
also .. could someone please turn down the thermostat a bit.
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grimley
Joined: Jul 07, 2004 Posts: 168 Location: Seattle
G2 patch files: 9
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Posted: Tue Mar 06, 2007 4:29 pm Post subject:
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mother misty wrote: | this G2>KP3 combo is serious fun and gives alot of new options! |
Couldn't agree more ... I recently upgraded from a KP2 and I'm addicted. I also love using the KP3 as a controller for the G2, especially the pad mode where you have 4 CCs.
-grimley |
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iPassenger
Joined: Jan 27, 2007 Posts: 1067 Location: Sheffield, UK
Audio files: 5
G2 patch files: 78
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Posted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 10:02 am Post subject:
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mother misty wrote: | Damn...
The starting points of my samples in my kaoss pad3 are a bit fucked up,
that's why everything sounds out of sync, I feel so stupid!!
I've changed the samples and it works fine now.
Thanks for your time anyway guys, this G2>KP3 combo is serious fun and gives alot of new options! |
Doh! how annoying.
It's like when you repatch yr studio to find out why a drum machine isn't producing audio, only to find that you have the channel muted. _________________ iP (Ross)
- http://ipassenger.bandcamp.com
- http://soundcloud.com/ipassenger |
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GovernorSilver
Joined: Apr 26, 2004 Posts: 1349 Location: Washington DC Metro
G2 patch files: 1
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Posted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 11:58 am Post subject:
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grimley wrote: | mother misty wrote: | this G2>KP3 combo is serious fun and gives alot of new options! |
Couldn't agree more ... I recently upgraded from a KP2 and I'm addicted. I also love using the KP3 as a controller for the G2, especially the pad mode where you have 4 CCs.
-grimley |
Our guitarist introduced his KP3 to us last weekend and we all had a hilarious good time sampling our voices and mucking with the samples.
How is the MIDI CC resolution on the Kaoss pads? Is both the LSB and MSB of the CC message supported? |
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mother misty
Joined: May 13, 2004 Posts: 681 Location: Ghent / Belgium
Audio files: 82
G2 patch files: 130
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Posted: Mon Mar 12, 2007 6:39 am Post subject:
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grimley wrote: | mother misty wrote: | this G2>KP3 combo is serious fun and gives alot of new options! |
Couldn't agree more ... I recently upgraded from a KP2 and I'm addicted. I also love using the KP3 as a controller for the G2, especially the pad mode where you have 4 CCs.
-grimley |
I've always wanted a joystick on my G2 but your solution sounds like a very good alternative! |
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