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electric guitar modding
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bbinkovitz



Joined: Jun 12, 2006
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 27, 2007 10:22 pm    Post subject: electric guitar modding
Subject description: in case i get sick of the happy meal toys
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i have an electric guitar that i got when i was like 13. i've taken it all apart and put it back together, but other than introducing myself briefly i've never really gotten to know its insides. anyone have any hot ideas about modding an electric guitar for a relative n00b? the more un-guitar sounds it can make the better.
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Mohoyoho



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PostPosted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 6:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Moog's Freq Box and/or Ring Modulator will change its sound drastically.
http://www.moogmusic.com/detail.php?main_product_id=21052
http://www.moogmusic.com/detail.php?main_product_id=6

And you could add a Roland guitar synth/midi converter to it. Then you could play through any synth or use their own system.
http://rolandus.com/products/productlist.aspx?ParentId=53

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smokris



Joined: May 22, 2004
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 5:32 pm    Post subject: Re: electric guitar modding
Subject description: in case i get sick of the happy meal toys
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bbinkovitz wrote:
anyone have any hot ideas about modding an electric guitar for a relative n00b? the more un-guitar sounds it can make the better.


Though it's not technically "modding", I'd recommend experimenting with taking the output of the guitar into a Nord Micro Modular. For around the same price as one of the Moogerfooger pedals, you get a design-your-own-arbitrarily-complex-processing-rig system --- which you can use to do ring modulation and oscillator sync and tons of other stuff --- and save totally different rigs as presets which can be instantly recalled. For me, this price-to-flexibility ratio is a huge win.

Check out the NM Classic Subforum for ideas about what to do with it. (Also try searching just that subforum for the word "guitar".)

And the red-and-black constructivist box is totally hot.
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AnaBliss



Joined: Jun 26, 2007
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 9:14 pm    Post subject:
Subject description: hot mod your guitar -how far to go?
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This is one of my favorite thought experiments , bbinkovitz. And feel free to tune out if this answer is off the mark, or too long; this is the never ending cliff-dive for me, as I am an avid electronic guitarist.

Before you get into any modifications at all, is the guitar of any sentimental value to you? Does it actually sound good by itself? Would it be a crime to tape things onto it, drill or rout the body, deface the finish? Must everything be neatly tucked away? Does it have space inside (large routed cavities to hold spare electronics)? In short, how crazy can ya get with this thing?

Just like with drag racing there is usually a link between how cool your ride is, and how much you can spend, but not always. I *do* like the Moog stuff mentioned by Mohoyoho (I have 9 in a rack, but heavy/expensive!, and no Freq Box yet!), also the Roland pickups/interfaces mentioned are good, too: they actually track pretty well these days.

The Clavia Nord answer from smokris is intriguing: smaller, more flexible and efficient, but I never tried it. Almost bought in to that solution a few years ago...

In this category of 'mods' as add-ons or external FX processing, I would suggest the Korg Mini Kaoss Pad, an x/y effects controller, perhaps neatly bolted on to your axe. Not too elegant looking perhaps, but a killr sound, 100 FX, including simple loop sampling. Easy to get up and running, very intuitive, etc. And your moves will look good when you are using it Cool

Yet I sense that you may not wish to spend a lot, or even less than not a lot. Sometimes the coolest hot rod is the product of hard work, but little money, or just good luck, and determination. So if you can solder, you might consider building a couple of "pedal effects" into the actual guitar itself, which can sound quite wild, and make for an interesting performance, too. Cannibalizing your old disused pedals is one way to go about it, or if you really want to spend the time, take a look at Craig Anderton's book, Electronic Projects for Musicians (and no I don't work for a music store or sell any of this stuff Smile

And did you know that Gibson produced an RD guitar line in the 70s which contained circuits designed by Bob Moog ? (a 'compander' preamp, if I remember right) You would be in good company, there.

And then there are physical modifications to the guitar which actually influence the way it generates sound. You could add drone strings (a guitar tech may be needed for this), or an add-on resonator such as the tines of a small music box placed in a strategic location. This stuff can get pretty endless.

How I do go on: hope this was at all helpful. Must sleep now.
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bbinkovitz



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PostPosted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 9:27 pm    Post subject:
Subject description: hot mod your guitar -how far to go?
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AnaBliss wrote:
This is one of my favorite thought experiments , bbinkovitz. And feel free to tune out if this answer is off the mark, or too long; this is the never ending cliff-dive for me, as I am an avid electronic guitarist.


hawt!

Quote:

Before you get into any modifications at all, is the guitar of any sentimental value to you?

yes!
Quote:

Does it actually sound good by itself?

no!
Quote:
Would it be a crime to tape things onto it, drill or rout the body, deface the finish?

too late!
Quote:

Must everything be neatly tucked away?

not particularly
Quote:
Does it have space inside (large routed cavities to hold spare electronics)?

not large.
Quote:
In short, how crazy can ya get with this thing?

extremely!
Quote:

Just like with drag racing there is usually a link between how cool your ride is, and how much you can spend, but not always. I *do* like the Moog stuff mentioned by Mohoyoho (I have 9 in a rack, but heavy/expensive!, and no Freq Box yet!), also the Roland pickups/interfaces mentioned are good, too: they actually track pretty well these days.

Quote:

In this category of 'mods' as add-ons or external FX processing, I would suggest the Korg Mini Kaoss Pad, an x/y effects controller, perhaps neatly bolted on to your axe. Not too elegant looking perhaps, but a killr sound, 100 FX, including simple loop sampling. Easy to get up and running, very intuitive, etc. And your moves will look good when you are using it Cool

so what will this actually do?
Quote:

Yet I sense that you may not wish to spend a lot, or even less than not a lot. Sometimes the coolest hot rod is the product of hard work, but little money, or just good luck, and determination. So if you can solder, you might consider building a couple of "pedal effects" into the actual guitar itself, which can sound quite wild, and make for an interesting performance, too. Cannibalizing your old disused pedals is one way to go about it, or if you really want to spend the time, take a look at Craig Anderton's book, Electronic Projects for Musicians (and no I don't work for a music store or sell any of this stuff Smile

i'll look at the library!
Quote:

And did you know that Gibson produced an RD guitar line in the 70s which contained circuits designed by Bob Moog ? (a 'compander' preamp, if I remember right) You would be in good company, there.

i didn't! that's pretty cool.
Quote:

And then there are physical modifications to the guitar which actually influence the way it generates sound. You could add drone strings (a guitar tech may be needed for this), or an add-on resonator such as the tines of a small music box placed in a strategic location. This stuff can get pretty endless.

woah, yes!

thank you!
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smokris



Joined: May 22, 2004
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 9:29 pm    Post subject:
Subject description: hot mod your guitar -how far to go?
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AnaBliss wrote:
or if you really want to spend the time, take a look at Craig Anderton's book, Electronic Projects for Musicians


Yes! I recommend this too.

Nicolas Collins's "Handmade Electronic Music: The Art of Hardware Hacking" might also be good for this purpose (haven't read it yet, but it's on the list).
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bbinkovitz



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PostPosted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 9:31 pm    Post subject: Re: electric guitar modding
Subject description: in case i get sick of the happy meal toys
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smokris wrote:

Nord Micro Modular. For around the same price as one of the Moogerfooger pedals, you get a design-your-own-arbitrarily-complex-processing-rig system --- which you can use to do ring modulation and oscillator sync and tons of other stuff --- and save totally different rigs as presets which can be instantly recalled. For me, this price-to-flexibility ratio is a huge win.

well since we already have one, wouldn't it actually sort of be free to play with it? or do you plan to charge me rent to use it?
Quote:

Check out the NM Classic Subforum for ideas about what to do with it. (Also try searching just that subforum for the word "guitar".)

awesome i'm on it.
Quote:

And the red-and-black constructivist box is totally hot.

truth!
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smokris



Joined: May 22, 2004
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 9:37 pm    Post subject: Re: electric guitar modding
Subject description: in case i get sick of the happy meal toys
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bbinkovitz wrote:
well since we already have one, wouldn't it actually sort of be free to play with it? or do you plan to charge me rent to use it?


This was primarily intended for the benefit of our television audience.
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AnaBliss



Joined: Jun 26, 2007
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 29, 2007 10:36 am    Post subject:
Subject description: hot mod your guitar -how far to go?
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Quote:
so what will this actually do?

...you mean the Mini Kaoss Pad? It's basically a battery powered DJ tool (toy).

Use it instead of a wammy bar to destroy your sound with touchpad x/y control of FX parameters. Or maybe just destroy your budget. It's $200, and you would need other support circuitry.

But. Now that I see you have access to the Nord, go for it. And you could always add a MIDI joystick for crazy parameter control.

Love to hear about what you build!
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kvnvk



Joined: Aug 27, 2006
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 04, 2007 8:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

how about this for a guitar mod?

Posted Image, might have been reduced in size. Click Image to view fullscreen.
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bbinkovitz



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PostPosted: Wed Jul 04, 2007 9:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

kvnvk wrote:
how about this for a guitar mod?

Posted Image, might have been reduced in size. Click Image to view fullscreen.


woah, hot! explain, plz!
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deknow



Joined: Sep 15, 2004
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 04, 2007 3:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

...imho, one of the cooler things you can do is install a hex pickup, and wire it for separate outputs....this means that each string has it's own output, and can be proscessed separately (or in groups). the micromod has 2 inputs???? mix the top 3 strings into one input, and the other 3 into the other, and do differant things with them.

deknow
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kvnvk



Joined: Aug 27, 2006
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 04, 2007 7:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

bbinkovitz wrote:
kvnvk wrote:
how about this for a guitar mod?

Posted Image, might have been reduced in size. Click Image to view fullscreen.


woah, hot! explain, plz!


one of the early modified guitars of Japanese noise artist Solmania (Masahiko Ohno), there's the standard guitar configuration then he's added what I've seen described as "bass drone" strings w/ bass pickup, along with a cheap vocal mic, and an additional pickup mounted at the nut, all with individual outputs for seperate processing.
anyway, years ago when I had this extra, kind of junky guitar, I had thought about mounting a contact mic or acoustic guitar pickup on it to use in combination with its magnetic pickups. the hex pickup is a good idea as well. other than actually physically modding the guitar, you could use different objects and materials to manipulate the strings, weave strips of paper or thin wire through the strings, take a small radio or other device with its own speaker and play it into the guitar's pickup, really just try various approaches and see what works.
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deknow



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PostPosted: Wed Jul 04, 2007 8:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

...remember that even when "modular synthesizers" were out of fashon, guitar players were using them...as networks and chains of pedals. you can do much of this with the micromodular, and can use the ins and outs to add pedals (and feedback) to the chain inside the micromod.

also, an ebow always comes in handy when messing with a guitar.

deknow
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deknow



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PostPosted: Wed Jul 04, 2007 8:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

...another thought.

the anderton circuts are wonderful (some are fantastic...the "super tone control" for instance). that said, if you have access to a micromodular, it is a lot cheaper/faster/less frustrating to use this to figure out what you want before building a bunch of hardware.

deknow
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bbinkovitz



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PostPosted: Wed Jul 04, 2007 8:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

yes, these are all great ideas! i think i will stick to doodling around with the nm1 that's sitting next to me right now. i wasn't familiar with it until i started using it to process the guitar sound, at smokris' suggestion. however, i do like the physical mod ideas too, and might do these or similar ones someday.

thanks!
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deknow



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PostPosted: Thu Jul 05, 2007 6:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

...when talking about guitar pedals, i was trying to remember the company that makes the cool feedback pedals (i had the idea for this, and found out it already existed). this is what can pull together a mess of pedals into something amazing.

http://www.musictoyz.com/guitar/pedals/e13.php has a list

the company seems to have been shuffled around as of late, and according to the forum, they will not be making any more loop matrix pedals (which is a shame)....on the bright (diy) side, someone said they would post instructions to make one (stay tuned, the post was just a few days ago):

http://deviever.com/forum/topic-402-0-15.html&sid=c168320e69a13fecb27cdac58a368f3f

...also worth noting (although i don't think it matters) is that the person that makes these pedals (devi ever) is (or appears to be) female....which i didn't know when i started this post.

deknow
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