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DIY DAW
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bachus



Joined: Feb 29, 2004
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 05, 2004 8:54 pm    Post subject: DIY DAW Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

The purpose of this thread is to detail the DIY construction of a complete PC DAW that will provide capabilities and performance hardly distinguishable from a professional system. The software we will be running is Sonar 3 under MS Windows 2000. You could probably substitute XP without significant difficulty. We will document and report in this thread more or less as the project progresses so you can experience our hopes and fears, our tragedies and triumphs just like on reality TV. This will also prepare you to expect the kind difficulties one is likely to encounter in such an undertaking. I should note that I am not a hardware guru but I have both built and upgraded systems in years past. If anyone sees me in error or about to be, speak up!

If you are the kind of person who just has to get their hands on the "stuff" before they read the manual, or if you are the type who feels a vague sense of unease when they take screwdriver in hand, forget this and go find another thread quick!

The indispensable tool for such a project is a functioning computer with a connection to the Internet. You will inevitably come to places where you have no idea how to proceed and where the answer can only be found on the Internet. A good reference book is also recommended, in particular, "PC Hardware in a Nutshell," 3rd Edition, to which I will refer the reader on a number of occasions.

If you have no experience in this sort of thing you are advised to avoid making substitutions in the selected hardware, or altering the assembly procedure. You should also read to the end of this thread before you begin your own DAW to make certain that no compatibility problems were uncovered in the assembly/software-installation process.

A list of the selected hardware follows with a description of the motivation for each selection.

========== CPU: Athlon Barton core 3000+ 400 MHz FSB

Athlon because there is a little more bang per buck. Also because the only reason CPUs are as cheap and as rapidly evolving as they are is that IBM has competition. Without AMD we would all be much worse off.

NOTE : AMD makes an Athlon Barton core 3000+ that has a max FSB speed of 333 MHz. Don't get that one.

========== CPU Cooler: Zalman CNPS6000-Cu

Quiet or completely silent, depending--details later. One of the side goals here is to build a machine that is very quiet.

========== CPU / CPU Cooler thermal compound: ArcticSilver Ceramique

Do NOT use the more expensive stuff, either ArcticSilver's or anyone else's. They simply don't work as well.

Since I wrote this I have found a more methodical set of tests performed with better controls. It indicates that Arctic Silver Ceramique under performs (the more expensive) Arctic Silver 3 by 1/2 a degree Celsius. It also shows a product unfamiliar to me Shin-Etsu G-751 to perform significantly better than any other compound. If you can get it I would definitely use that. Though it may seem insignificant the thermal compound between your chip and chip cooler is a critical element of your system.

========== Mother Board: GIGABYTE GA-7N400-Pro2

Gigabyte is a reliable maker of stable motherboards. My personal preference is for ASUS but they don't make one that has all the features I required, which follow:

400 MHz FSB
Serial ATA (SATA) 150 RAID HD IO (explained later)
Supports up to 8 ATA devices. (Has ATA RAID as well though that will not be used.)
4 DIMMs DDR memory sockets allowing 2 GIG of ram in four 512 meg DIMMs. (As a DAW 1 gig is probably enough but I have other apps that will run on this machine that will benefit from 2).
Uses nVidia nForce2 ultra chipset--very stable.
Has onboard USB2, Firewire and gigabit ether net.

========== Memory: 1 gig, (two) Crucial brand DDR3200 CAS 3, 512 meg

You could go with Kingston memory and or memory with a lower CAS value. But don't buy the cheap stuff.

========== C: Drive: Seagate ATA Barracuda 120 gigs 8 meg buffer.

The Seagate Barracuda's reliable and significantly quieter that any other. Do NOT get the 2 Meg buffer version of this disc.

========== RAID: Drives: (two) Seagate SATA Barracuda 120 gigs 8 Meg buffer.

We will use these two drives in RAID 0 configuration for increased through-put (for more simultaneous tracks).

========== CD/DVD: Sony DRU-510AK DVD-CD +-RW

Gets good reviews and has all the formats except DVD data.

========== Case: Antec PLUS1080AMG

Contains high quality 430 wt power supply.
Has front and rear USB and Firewire ports.
Has HD carriers that make installing and removing HDs a breeze.

========== Floppy: Sony

Samsung would do as well.

========== Video card: GeForce MX4000

The bottom of the line for a DAW. We're installing this card in the test setup but another will be used in our personal system. The video end of things will be discused in more detail later.


========== Audio / MIDI IO and Control surface: Tascam FW-1884 info here
There are better, but this is the best within my budget.

========== Approximate costs:

Computer parts: $1260.00 (newegg.com)
Tascam FW-1884: $1300.00 (musiciansfriend.com)
Win 2000 $140.00 (newegg.com)
Sonar 3 $300.00 (musiciansfriend.com)
shipping on all items 2/3 day service $100.00

total about $3110.00 (LESS VIDEO DISPLAY!)

========================================
With all the required parts in hand, plus
a set of screwdrivers,
a set of nut drivers,
91% Isopropyl alcohol,
4 or 5 very clean coffee filters,
a clean plastic baggie,
a length of wire and
an optional wrist-grounding strap
we are ready to begin.

Oh, you'll also need a 1 meg ohm resistor,
some aluminum foil and a small wire nut.

====================================

Next: assembly.


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Last edited by bachus on Mon Mar 08, 2004 9:19 am; edited 3 times in total
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mosc
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 05, 2004 9:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Thanks for posting this. Interesting. I edited your post because you had a really long URL pointing to the Tascam Control Surface information. I just used the [URL= feature. Hope you don't mind. Confused

Great that you are running RAID 0 which is striping for increased speed. Why don't you go with RAID 1/0 which adds redundant disks as well? Sure you'll have 4 disks instead of 2, but your get redundancy which can prevent much heartache. I'm running a system like that and sleep better at night knowing I can have a disk failure without losing any data.

Good move on the Zalman CPU cooler. The CPU cooler is usually the major source of noise in a computer system.
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mosc
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 05, 2004 9:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

If you want high-performance systems like this and don't want to go the DIY route, consider Clever Bison Computers. This is run by Daniel, one of our members. He builds all of my systems. He'll customize your computer so you'll get exactly what you need and nothing you don't.

Also, if anyone is going to be buying any musical equipment, please go to Musician's Friend via the link on our front page. They will help pay our bills via their affiliate program, but you must click through from the front page. (Sorry for the shameless plug).
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Cyxeris



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PostPosted: Fri Mar 05, 2004 9:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Not a plug. A strategic alliance!
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bachus



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PostPosted: Sat Mar 06, 2004 4:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

mosc wrote:
Thanks for posting this. Interesting. I edited your post because you had a really long URL pointing to the Tascam Control Surface information. I just used the [URL= feature. Hope you don't mind. Confused

No, thanks, just ignorance on my part.

mosc wrote:
Great that you are running RAID 0 which is striping for increased speed. Why don't you go with RAID 1/0 which adds redundant disks as well? Sure you'll have 4 disks instead of 2, but your get redundancy which can prevent much heartache. I'm running a system like that and sleep better at night knowing I can have a disk failure without losing any data.


Gees! Is THAT why I've been having trouble sleeping?! Very Happy The SATA RAID controller on this MB only supports 0/1 not 0/1/0+1. I agree that the lack of redundancy is an important issue as in mode 0 (striping only) you have twice the chance of HD failure. As far as I know, no MB currently supports SATA 0+1, so a controller card would be required, and you could add that to this system later. An alternative would be to go with the GA-7N400-L or similar MB (save ~$30) and put that towards the desired controller.

The GA-7N400-Pro2's IDE port supports RAID 0+1 (mirroring and striping) which would be just fine for audio and may be a better alternative for some. But I also play with Maya and video and felt the extra performance of SATA was worth the hassle of additional backup precautions. I'm planning to add another HD for that purpose but haven't decided on the details of that as yet.

mosc wrote:
Good move on the Zalman CPU cooler. The CPU cooler is usually the major source of noise in a computer system.


And as long as you brought it up now I will mention that the Zalman cooler is the first step in reducing system noise. Once the system is completed I'll get out my dB meter and make some decisions as to what all needs to be done. Replacing the Antec case fans with low noise models is definitely in the works and there are additional steps that might be taken as well.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 07, 2004 6:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

The greatest obstacle to a successful completion of your own DAW is not doing your homework--i.e. not reading your manuals and related sources. Probably the second greatest obstacle is ESD, electro static discharge. You must have an understanding of the hazard this poses to integrated circuits before you actually begin. "PC Hardware in a Nutshell" has a section devoted to ESD that is not as intimidating as the website linked to above. But it is not as thorough, and unlike the authors of that book I strongly advise using a wrist ground strap. These are available at any Radio Shack for less than $5.

So. Here we are. You've got the manuals for the case and the motherboard at hand. You've opened the case removing the door, and have removed the side panel opposite the door. This was easy because when you ran into a bit of trouble you stopped and examined contemplatively the construction of the reticent item and the true path revealed itself to you.

Now place the case on a table that you can access from at least three sides as in the image above. "PC Hardware in a Nutshell" recommends the kitchen table. I think this is a bad idea because--trust me--you don't want to feel any pressure to get this done by the next meal. Now breathe deep and get into a Tao/Zen state of mind.

First check to see if the IO panel on the case matches that of the motherboard. With the particular case and MB we are using, it will not. Remove the old IO panel from the inside of the case by inserting the blade of a very thin bladed screwdriver between the case chassis and the inner lip of the IO panel and twisting the blade to pry the panel inward. Begin this process at a top corner and proceed along the top till the panel is sufficiently loosened to be pushed in and fall free. Consider accomplishing this with grace and without cursing a test of your karma. In the box that contains the MB locate the new IO panel and pressing carefully but forcefully around its edges only, lock it into place. The next picture shows the new panel installed and the old one lying beside it. It also shows that I failed to pry up the optional Ethernet connection on the IO panel.


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 07, 2004 7:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Next, using a nut driver we install ALL and ONLY those brass pcb (printed circuit board) standoffs required by the motherboard. The case is predrilled and tapped for a number of different MBs. To make sure you are placing the standoffs where they belong place an edge of a piece of paper on the motherboard, one edge of the paper aligned with one edge of the MB at one of the rows of mounting holes on the MB. With a felt tip pen mark the edge of the paper at each hole. Place the paper in the case along the appropriate row of holes and drive in the standoffs. In this case only the center row of standoffs was difficult to locate, those are the marks on the crease of the paper in the photo below.


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 07, 2004 7:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Strip one end of your length of wire. Bend the last half-inch of one of the leads on the 1 meg ohm resistor back on itself and twist the stripped portion of the wire around this. Now screw on the wire nut. WARNING the next procedure provides a risk of electric shock if not done exactly as stated and shown or if your house wiring is defective.

Locate an electric outlet near the worktable and plug in and turn on a lamp. Throw off the circuit breaker associated with that outlet. You will know that you have the correct one because the lamp will go out. Remove the outlet cover, loosen the bottom outlet mounting screw and wrap once around it the free lead of the resistor. Tighten the screw. The photo below shows this connection though your resistor will likely look somewhat different. Replace the outlet cover. You may now turn the circuit back on, though that is not necessary.


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Last edited by bachus on Mon Mar 08, 2004 5:03 am; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 07, 2004 8:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Cover an area somewhat larger than the MB with Heavy-duty aluminum foil. Strip the free end of your length of wire. Tape it down to the foil near one edge. Following the practices outlined in the ESD link, remove the MB from its anti-static bag place the bag on the foil and the MB on the bag and raise the lever on the zero insertion force CPU socket as shown below.


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mosc
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 07, 2004 9:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Wow, that's one of the most colorfull mother boards I've ever seen!
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 07, 2004 10:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Poseidon, check the cooler on the chipset. My goodness...
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bachus



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PostPosted: Mon Mar 08, 2004 5:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

mosc wrote:
Wow, that's one of the most colorfull mother boards I've ever seen!
Thank goodness the case doesn't have one of those see through doors. Smile

Cyxeris wrote:
Poseidon, check the cooler on the chipset. My goodness...

Yea, that's kind of a sore point. I swore that I would never buy another MB with a fan on the chipset after I had to replace the one on my current machine--just another mechanical thing to fail. Gees what a guy will do to get four DIMM sockets! I hope it's noisy. That'll give me an excuse to replace it with an adequate passive heat sink. I can't tell at this point, the case fans are so loud. Got a dozen low noise fans on order.
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 08, 2004 7:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

We are now at the brain surgery stage. As described above you have raised the lever on the socket. The pins on the CPU are arrayed asymmetrically so that the CPU will fit into its socket only in the proper orientation. Note in the photo below that relative to the upper and lower corners on the right side of the socket the corners on the left are each missing a pin. Following the practices outlined in the ESD link, remove the CPU from its box holding it only by its edges. Examine the bottom to determine how to orient it with the socket and insert it there in. When the pins are aligned with the socket the CPU will simply fall freely into the socket. Never use any force to insert the CPU. If it does not fall in you have a problem. If you press it in you have a disaster. Some times only one side will fall in. Do NOT press in the other side. Instead, carefully lift up the side that fell in and let the chip fall in completely. Finally press the lever down making sure it latches into position.


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 08, 2004 7:42 pm    Post subject: Installing the heat sink. Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

The next step is to install the heat sink. For this you will need the high purity isopropyl alcohol, the coffee filters and the plastic bag as well as the Zalman heat sink and it's accessories. In applying the thermal compound it is essential that you follow the instructions specific to the product you are using. You will find detailed instructions for the ArcticSilver Ceramique here . Access to the Instructions for the Zalmin heat sink is located here . You should read through both these documents (slide shows) until you are confident that you know what you need to do. Now make it so.


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 11, 2004 7:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Alas I failed at anything like real-time reporting. The machine has been minimally functional for nearly a week. But newegg.com shipped 4 ATAs instead of 2 ATA and 2 SATA hard drives. The SATAs are now in hand and when time permits my part of the thread will resume. In any case, from past experience, if this is the worst difficulty one should be happy.
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 23, 2004 8:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

edit

Before installing the MB we need to insert the memory. To get DDR operation the memory must be installed in matched pairs. The orange sockets are the first pair and the blue the second. (In fact there are reasons for all the colors even if the choice of color has an adolescent character.) Note that there is an asymmetrically placed divider in socket. The memory board has a matching notch that allows it to be inserted in only the correct orientation. At the ends of each memory socket there are white latches. Open those on the orange sockets by pressing them away from the long axis of the sockets. Following the practices outlined in the ESD link, install the two memory cards in the orange sockets. When they are properly seated the latches will have returned to about 60% of their closed position and you will be able to snap them into their fully closed position.

Next we mount the motherboard in the case after grounding it with our wire as shown. At this point the grounding wire has been removed from the foil so be sure to touch the case just before you pickup the motherboard, or do as I do and clip your grounding wrist strap's wire to the metal frame of the case. The IO plate has prongs that are designed to press against the IO connectors on the MB to make ground connections by their spring pressure. These prongs will not let you freely align the mounting holes with their studs. When you put the MB in the case align only the corner hole that is at the bottom rear of the MB with its corresponding brass stud. Thread a screw into this hole but do not tighten. With the MB anchored at this bottom corner you can rotate the MB up against the IO plate and fix its position with a second screw threaded into the mounting hole diagonally opposed to the first. Now thread in the remaining screws tightening none till all are in. Then tighten all but do not over tighten.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 23, 2004 8:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

With the MB mounted in the case it's time to mount the drives. To do this we must remove the front cover of the case. The cover is attached by six pronged tabs. From the inside of the case locate the portion of each tab that protrudes into the case and press it inward while pulling outward on the cover. There is only one problem. The middle tab on the side of the case opposite the cover door hinge is obscured by both the upper removable drive carrier as well as the cables that are wired to the cover. So remove the carrier before you remove the cover and examine the area where the cables enter the case from the cover to locate that tab.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 23, 2004 8:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

In my system I mounted the floppy above the DVD recorder in a 5.25" carrier so as to free up another bay for a hard drive but we will assume that you are going to mount it in its usual position in the upper drive carrier just below the DVD. To do so you must first remove the perforated plate on the case by rocking it with a screwdriver as shown. I've trained my dog to do this for me but he is a bit ruff on the driver handles.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 23, 2004 8:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Now mount the drives in the carrier with the floppy in the upper most position. There are horizontal rows of holes that will allow you to offset the floppy so that it extends an appropriate distance into the cover. BTW all the hardware, screws, studs, etc, comes with the case and MB.


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 24, 2004 8:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Hmm... Looks like a pretty involved process.

But about this screwdriver. Do have a dog, or have you been nervous lately? Shocked Laughing

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 24, 2004 10:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I'll see if I can get a picture of Aubrey Dog at work.Smile Anyway, I'm a pretty hard-core DIY type and I didn't find it bad at all. I hope the detailed instructions will make it easier for others in their first time DIYDAW endeavor. I'm about to complete the third machine for my studio and the only real problem I've had was figuring out how to set up and configure the mad, short circuit LAN. (As I told electro80, my karma failed that test!). Problems with the LAN have been the cause of the extended delay in my work on this thread. BTW I am at present loading VSL onto the second DIY machine.

LAN: Local Area Network--not relevant to the DAW but for other uses I have for the machines.
------------------------
Edit
Spring has been more busy than usual here on the farm but I promise progress on this in the near term.


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 18, 2004 5:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I need to post the following warning:

I have been running the studio full out (all 4 machines fully cranked) only recently and have to report that the ZALMAN CNPS6000 heatsink/fan has been inadequate on one of the Athlon 3000s. Because it's OK on another identical machine I remounted it, but with no significant improvement. So I'm going to upgrade both the Athlon Barton 3000 machines to ZALMAN CNPS7000A-Cu sink/fans. The two other machines use Athlon Barton 2100 and 2800 CPUs and run perfectly cool with CNPS6000s.
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 18, 2004 6:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Sorry the Zalman didn't work out for you. Daniel has heard that from other people as well. Can't wait to hear you music.
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