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 Forum index » Clavia Nord Modular » G2 Patches - Completed » Lead
distorted lead
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ian-s



Joined: Apr 01, 2004
Posts: 2575
Location: Auckland, New Zealand
Audio files: 42
G2 patch files: 608

PostPosted: Sat Aug 21, 2004 2:16 am    Post subject: distorted lead Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Have been doing some research on distortion, interesting topic, surrounded in mythology and legend.
I am interested mainly in two areas. Firstly, subtle distortion introduced by such devices as valves, ota's. transistors etc. Secondly, full on deliberate feedback distortion (amp simulation).

This patch is a result of initial research into the latter. It contains some elements from an earlier post, the delayed feedback into the voice area.
The reason why real amplifiers have such a beautifully complex sound is because distortion of different types happens in different parts of the system. The built in Clavia shaper modules perform their functions well, but none has the nice 'valve preamp' even harmonic distortion that Rob showed us in his 36dbFilter patch (yellow modules, see fig1) the signal then has a little asymmetric hard clipping applied before going through a shpstatic module. Curve three is a good approximation of the distortion common in push pull style valve output stages (figure 2). Lastly, an EQ module is used to simulate the frequency response of the open back cabinet.

Anything but single notes, thirds or fifths can produce inter-modulation distortion (which some people don't like). Variation 4 has aftertouch sensitive harmonics.

BTW valves do not have a monopoly on nice sounding distortion, certain types of semiconductors reportedly have an excellent tone. Real systems valve or semiconductor, rarely contain exclusively odd or even harmonic distortion, usually a mix of both.


custom-asym.jpg
 Description:
Fig 1
 Filesize:  3.68 KB
 Viewed:  9011 Time(s)

custom-asym.jpg



ShpStapic-Curve3.jpg
 Description:
fig 2
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ShpStapic-Curve3.jpg



DistortedLead.pch2
 Description:
amp style distorted lead

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 Filename:  DistortedLead.pch2
 Filesize:  2.48 KB
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Rob



Joined: Mar 29, 2004
Posts: 578
Location: The Hague/Netherlands/EC
G2 patch files: 109

PostPosted: Sat Aug 21, 2004 5:54 am    Post subject: Re: distorted lead Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

g2ian wrote:
Real systems valve or semiconductor, rarely contain exclusively odd or even harmonic distortion, usually a mix of both.


Here's an example of a distortion that produces a mix of even and odd distortion. A knob sets the balance.

Its basically and old analog trick one could do with a ringmodulator, a VCA and a couple of mixers/signal inverters. The idea of even harmonic distortion is to set a VCA half open and subtract a little of the input signal from the control voltage. If this input signal is first ringmodulated by itself and subtracted one gets odd harmonic distortion. So, by crossfading between the inputs signal and the output of the ringmodulator you can set the even/odd balance.

The nice thing is that it will only produce the second and third harmonics of the partials in the input signal and basically it does not work with clipping. This produces the harmonics mainly in the middle range of the audio spectrum, which has the effect of increasing the 'presence' of a sound, which is caused by the mind's concentration going to the middle range of the audio spectrum and not to the highest range, like when clipping is produced.
The effect is subtle but definite. It's basically a psycho acoustic thing, like all this analog vs. digital babble that can in the end only be explained by how the mind processes the information it gets from the ear, and how that relates to personal preferences.

Posted Image, might have been reduced in size. Click Image to view fullscreen.

This is sort of the schematic for the even/odd harmonic distortion.

One nice extra effect is that it can make a filter, which is fed with a sawtooth wave, sound steeper. Or less steep if the sawtooth slopes the other way. (As when the 'second harmonic' generated from the resonance peak is in antiphase with the filter output it will suppress the harmonic found just above the resonance peak frequency.)

Plus a G2 patch. You can test for yourself at what setting it makes the filter sound steeper.


OddEvenDistortion.pch2
 Description:
Patch containing a warm distortion circuit with an even/odd harmonics balance knob.

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 Filename:  OddEvenDistortion.pch2
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Tim Kleinert



Joined: Mar 12, 2004
Posts: 1027
Location: Zürich, Switzerland
Audio files: 6
G2 patch files: 212

PostPosted: Sat Aug 21, 2004 6:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Ian & Rob,

When I read guys like you, I know again that I know nothing.

I know theoretically that this "digital/analogue babble" is a waste of time, and that one has to approach the issue from a psychoacoustic perspective. But as I'm not knowledgeable/experienced enough to apply such successfully, I get frustrated after a while and start to whine about wanting my analogue synths back again

Oh well Rolling Eyes

Looking forward to studying these patches of yours today! Smile

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Rix



Joined: Aug 08, 2004
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Location: Breda, the Netherlands
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G2 patch files: 25

PostPosted: Sat Aug 21, 2004 2:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Very useful patches Ian!
I dig the gitar-like distortions quite a lot.

Another way to make interesting distortions is by using mult-level or multi stage distortion.

E.g., when the signal is above a certain treshold you go to a certain kind of distortion, when above another level you add another type (preferable meaner) , etc..

Of course you can also use this to add different effects at each stage.

Richard
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ian-s



Joined: Apr 01, 2004
Posts: 2575
Location: Auckland, New Zealand
Audio files: 42
G2 patch files: 608

PostPosted: Sat Aug 21, 2004 4:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Thanks Rix, must try your suggestion.

And thanks Rob, nice elegant technique, sounds good too.
I can sort of hear some basic filter characters coming through at different combined knob positions.

Regarding the Clavia Sound, I don’t know what the other Nord products sound like so I can’t comment. The G2’s range of character is far wider than anything I have heard before, I still often get surprised by accidental discoveries. I am guilty however of ‘gear nostalgia’, I very nearly purchased Auckland University’s broken VCS3 recently. I would have, except that the technician said “not for sale, sorry”. I also couldn’t convince them that the Roland System 700 was getting a bit old and was probably due for retirement back in my studio (damn!).
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Wan



Joined: Mar 31, 2004
Posts: 255
Location: Netherlands, Ugchelen
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 22, 2004 5:22 am    Post subject: Another one Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Hi,

Nice patches are this!
I'm always searching for distortion tricks that make the sound more fluid. This thread made me review one of my patches and add some tricks to it. ie the amp feedback. Works out rather well, though at times it is rather wild and uncontrollable. Just like real feedback:)

Now i am nowhere near you're level of understanding all this things, so i made this more or less by ear and experimentation.

CAUTION: has to be played with a continuous controller pedal! The pedal controls the tone like a wahwah. Witout it it sounds rather dull or just plain ugly. With the pedal you can zoom in on the nice frequenties.

So:
Pedal = tone/wah
Wheel = vibrato
Aftertouch = amp feedback

The first three variations are more or less intentional, the rest are leftovers from previous versions and not completely finished.


HW lead V4.pch2
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 Filename:  HW lead V4.pch2
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ian-s



Joined: Apr 01, 2004
Posts: 2575
Location: Auckland, New Zealand
Audio files: 42
G2 patch files: 608

PostPosted: Sun Aug 22, 2004 7:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Great patch Wan, very heavy, I am humbled. Smile
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Afro88



Joined: Jun 20, 2004
Posts: 701
Location: Brisbane, Australia
Audio files: 12
G2 patch files: 79

PostPosted: Mon Aug 23, 2004 5:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Man these are some cool patches. Ian, I love variations 4 and 8, the aftertouch is fantastic! Your distortion is nice, it definately gives me the guitar amp and cabinet vibe.

Rob, once again you've proved to me that the G2 can indeed sound, for lack of a better word, analogue. That odd/even distortion, when set just before halfway sounds really smooth. I really like the way it simply provides character without being overbearing. Very nice.

And Wan, I feel like I'm playing guitar! I don't have a pedal, but shuffled the morph assigns around so the wah is on my mod wheel and it's hella fun to play!

Again I come here, download a few patches and feel a little self-concious of my patching skills, heheh. I mean that in a good way, you guys are really talented! It gives me inspiration for my new patches. Cheers Smile
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Wan



Joined: Mar 31, 2004
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Location: Netherlands, Ugchelen
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G2 patch files: 46

PostPosted: Mon Aug 23, 2004 11:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

g2ian wrote:
Great patch Wan, very heavy, I am humbled. Smile


No need for that Ian Embarassed Somehow i've got the feeling you know better what you are doing than i do.

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