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 Forum index » Clavia Nord Modular » Wish List
Matrix modulation
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Should there be a modulation matrix?
Yes
57%
 57%  [ 8 ]
No
42%
 42%  [ 6 ]
Total Votes : 14

Author Message
pstnotpd



Joined: Apr 09, 2004
Posts: 31

G2 patch files: 3

PostPosted: Wed Aug 18, 2004 12:11 pm    Post subject: Matrix modulation Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

The only way I can think of right now to allow for 'patching' while only using the G2 (keys) itself is creating a modulation 'matrix' in the parameter pages using a huge load of mixer modules. (ref. my matrix 'performance').

As this takes a lot of editor space, but not a lot of patchload I would like to see a modulation matrix which allows for mapping to the parameter pages, with the switch being on/off and the knob being the amount of modulation.

Again, to get the idea check out the expirimental 'matrix performance' on this site.

http://electro-music.com/forum/topic-1834.html

Last edited by pstnotpd on Fri Aug 20, 2004 6:52 am; edited 1 time in total
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mosc
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 18, 2004 1:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

How about a link to the performance you are talking about?

Thanks...
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pstnotpd



Joined: Apr 09, 2004
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 20, 2004 6:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

There you go Embarassed
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mosc
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 22, 2004 6:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

OK, thanks for posting that link. I remember that patch quite well. I learned about the global pages with that one.

So, what exactly would the Matrix module look like?

8 in and 8 out with 64 knobs?
8 in and 8 out with 64 switches?
8 in with 8 level controls with 64 switches?

I guest there are more combinations. This kind of thing is very powerful, but gets complicated pretty fast. I can't help but think that the patch cords provide almost infinite flexibility making this kind of thing unnecessary, but then again I'm certainly missing something.
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Rob



Joined: Mar 29, 2004
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 22, 2004 8:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

mosc wrote:
OK, thanks for posting that link. I remember that patch quite well. I learned about the global pages with that one.

So, what exactly would the Matrix module look like?

8 in and 8 out with 64 knobs?
8 in and 8 out with 64 switches?
8 in with 8 level controls with 64 switches?

I guest there are more combinations. This kind of thing is very powerful, but gets complicated pretty fast. I can't help but think that the patch cords provide almost infinite flexibility making this kind of thing unnecessary, but then again I'm certainly missing something.


Something like this but all in one module?

Hum, I sort of imagined that the mixers were specifically designed so to be able to easily patch matrixes oneself. By omitting senseless connections, e.g. the control output of an Env into its own audio input, or the filter output into its own input, its easier to omit redundant and senseless connections when building up a matrix oneself.

I guess I should do a VCS3 this afternoon. Smile


8x8 Mod Matrix.pch2
 Description:
Bare bones 8x8 modulation matrix with knobs and buttons.

Download
 Filename:  8x8 Mod Matrix.pch2
 Filesize:  3.18 KB
 Downloaded:  1015 Time(s)

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mosc
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 22, 2004 10:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Yes, that's a nice 8X8 matrix mixer.

The VCS3, that's a Synthi I assume. As I remember there were not variable connections, just switches controled by the little push pins.

Those were great fun to play, not to patch, if you know what I mean. The ten turn pots on the oscillator frequency controls were great fun.
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pstnotpd



Joined: Apr 09, 2004
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 23, 2004 11:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I must admit it has been a while since I did this one, so I'm trying to figure out what I've done here. Embarassed
What I was trying to achieve was routing flexibility using only the knobs and buttons on the G2 frontpanel as I see myself lounging in a studio some day where I don't want to be bothered with LCD screens.
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cappy2112



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PostPosted: Thu Apr 28, 2005 1:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

mosc wrote:
OK, thanks for posting that link. I remember that patch quite well. I learned about the global pages with that one.

So, what exactly would the Matrix module look like?

8 in and 8 out with 64 knobs?
8 in and 8 out with 64 switches?
8 in with 8 level controls with 64 switches?

I guest there are more combinations. This kind of thing is very powerful, but gets complicated pretty fast. I can't help but think that the patch cords provide almost infinite flexibility making this kind of thing unnecessary, but then again I'm certainly missing something.


Why only 8 ?
If Clavia IS listening lets go for the gold.
I was wondering how I could model the Xpander (or Matrix 12) on the NM or G2. It is surely lacking a mod matrix. The Xpander & M12 have something like 24 mod sources and 42 destinations, with a total of 20 mods per patch. Trying to emulate the sources & destintations alone on the NM, without ANY oscillators or filters, would surely fill the screen, and make further constructive patching a nightmare.

I would suggest 16 ins & 16 outs.

Last edited by cappy2112 on Sat Nov 26, 2005 8:25 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Rob



Joined: Mar 29, 2004
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 28, 2005 4:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Just my two cents, I usually wire up a matrix like this:

Posted Image, might have been reduced in size. Click Image to view fullscreen.

On average 8 x 9 or 8 x 10 is sort of in balance with the amount of modules that together fit in 100% and leave some space in the patch panel for knobs on other modules. But note that I do make sort of EMS Synthi models that I can tweak through an enormous range of timbres.

Personally I'm not really in favour of the "many in, many out" matrices with "limited amounts of crosspoints" approach. I guess these would be impractical on the G2, as such a module needs lots of inputs and outputs. E.g. 42 destinations means 42 outputs and this would eat relatively much memory percentage, over 30%. And when using a pin crosspoint matrix it is easier to learn what the crosspoints do and goes well with the panel knobs. In fact I think that using the mixers like in the picture is quite efficient, as one can deal with redundance in an easy way by wiring up the rows and columns one self.

Aah well, this setup works fine for me. Though in general I use a limited amount of 'modules' that each consists of several modules to get the right sound for me. E.g. many times I roll my own filters or PM oscs.
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mosc
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 28, 2005 5:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I'm with Rob here. The existing mixers and switches offer a good toolkit to build your own matrix.

I've found that having huge matrixes is difficult to play. Shocked

_________________
--Howard
my music and other stuff
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Blue Hell
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 28, 2005 6:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Rob wrote:
I usually wire up a matrix like this:


See ... me not staying with Rob in the Hague but driving back home instead was a good idea ... for the forum .... :-)

*mode = OT* **1)

Truth is that I got fed up a bit from the big city not being able to find a parking place & thought I might as well drive home iinstead of keeping circling around the blocks for ever, in the rain. Ah well Wout had a good party on the beach & he was a happy man tonight being just maried & the wether earlier today was like summer, on the beach, out of the wind.

It's good to be not working and not patching, tomorrow I'll have another car drive & the day after I'll be on this ship , for nine days sailing the dutch waters. I'll try to make some pictures.

*mode=OT*

Anyway, I think there is not much use for matriices , as Rob pointed out earlier in this thread - it's more convenient to tailor the tweakabillity to personal taste by using mixers.

It may seem to be appealing to be able to emulate a synthesizer which has a mod-matrix, but I bet people actualy having and using such a synth would rather have the mechanisms available in the NM.

All IMHO,

Jan.

**1) OT can be either On Topic or Off, this is an example of entanglement, when the observer observes the system the quantum state colapses and the outcome of nthe observation will be known to the obeserver.
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jksuperstar



Joined: Aug 20, 2004
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 29, 2005 3:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Quote:
this is an example of entanglement, when the observer observes the system the quantum state colapses and the outcome of nthe observation will be known to the obeserver.


Doesn't entanglement imply that there is another, non-local state that is forced to collapse simultaneously resulting in the same observation at the same exact moment?

I think I had that observation for a moment, but then forgot what it was.

Smile Smile
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