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 Forum index » Instruments and Equipment » Kyma
Is the Kyma system right for me?
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robsol
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PostPosted: Thu May 14, 2009 4:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Well, I've decided to go for the Paca.

I will take a course in C programming (10 weeks) just to get in to the psyche of the friendly computer, even if I won't apply any of in practice in the end. I am simply interested in the field and I gather it will benefit me in using Kyma and computers in general.

I am also interested in taking Kyma lessons from Pete Johnston (of Bantu Sound UK), unless he lives too far away from me.

Thank you all for your input.

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PostPosted: Thu May 14, 2009 5:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

party!
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robsol
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PostPosted: Thu May 14, 2009 5:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Thank you Jan! This is going to be an interesting year! I have wanted a Kyma system for more than 10 years but simply couldn't justify the cost.

It is finally, really happening!

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bphenix



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PostPosted: Thu May 14, 2009 8:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

congrats!

my pacarana arrived today and I just spent he evening getting it up and going. sounds that used to max out my old 5 card system now barely use 5%. i can't wait to see what new ways of working with kyma this opens up.

there is certainly a curve in getting up and going so please feel free to ask away on questions as you move through the book.
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robsol
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PostPosted: Mon May 18, 2009 3:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I probably look like a bit of an idiot posting this now, but never mind..

@ Bobthedog - - I read your post in the "Strings and things" forum and I am now having second thoughts about buying the Paca. I must say I have big problems understanding what is going on from your post, and it has given me a reality check on the situation....

I see now that I need a lot more knowledge in the field of programming. The synthesis part is no problem, but the scripting... Would it help if I did a course in C/C++ programming, and perhaps some other courses?

I know that the Kyma system is up to the job, it's me I am worried about. Embarassed

I am really in two minds about this.

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BobTheDog



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PostPosted: Mon May 18, 2009 11:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Muied Lumens wrote:
I probably look like a bit of an idiot posting this now, but never mind..

@ Bobthedog - - I read your post in the "Strings and things" forum and I am now having second thoughts about buying the Paca. I must say I have big problems understanding what is going on from your post, and it has given me a reality check on the situation....

I see now that I need a lot more knowledge in the field of programming. The synthesis part is no problem, but the scripting... Would it help if I did a course in C/C++ programming, and perhaps some other courses?

I know that the Kyma system is up to the job, it's me I am worried about. Embarassed

I am really in two minds about this.



Well you would probably approach Kyma in a different way to me, I have jumped right into the scripting as I am comfortable with that sot of thing.

Scripting like this is not needed to use Kyma and is in the advanced section of the manual.

It also may look confusing to begin with but the manual is very good at explaining it but it would take you a time to grasp.

For me it will be the synthesis bit that will take a while to grasp as I have much less experience in that side.

The script you saw is written in Smalltalk which was originally designed to be learnt as a first language be beginners so if I where you I would keep far away from C and C++ and have a look at Smalltalk. Smalltalk was named this way because the actual language is very small and is therefore easy to learn.

Also the Smalltalk in Kyma is not as complicated as a full implementation of smalltalk.

Have a look at squeak which is an open source smalltalk implementation http://www.squeak.org/

I have some good smalltalk pdf books, PM me your email and I will send them to you.

Cheers

Andy
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BobTheDog



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PostPosted: Mon May 18, 2009 11:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

bphenix wrote:
congrats!

my pacarana arrived today and I just spent he evening getting it up and going. sounds that used to max out my old 5 card system now barely use 5%. i can't wait to see what new ways of working with kyma this opens up.

there is certainly a curve in getting up and going so please feel free to ask away on questions as you move through the book.


party time!
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buzzr



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PostPosted: Tue May 19, 2009 1:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

So, what sounds would max out your system?

5 capy cards is about what a paca is correct?
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robsol
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PostPosted: Tue May 19, 2009 1:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

The Paca is more like 8 cards on a Capy, or 21 processors, roughly. The Pacarama is twice that, at about 42.
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buzzr



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PostPosted: Tue May 19, 2009 2:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

There is an upgrade option apparently...after a year you can trade the Paca in for a Pacarana?
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bphenix



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PostPosted: Tue May 19, 2009 5:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

5 cards is about equal to 50% of a paca or a quarter of a pacarana. However, I think it works out differently in practice at times. A lot of my custom sounds deal with feedback loops in a polyphonic environment. This caused a few problems with DSP scheduling in a multi processor system that with fewer but far more powerful processors handle far more gracefully.

If you use Kyma as an instrument it was hard to create sounds that maxed out the system. If you used Kyma as a single effect processor, then you could get pretty far. Now, with the pacarana, I have options to create far more complex instrument systems then I did before. It opens up a new way of working.

As for upgrade, I doubt it is as straightforward as it used to be (insert more cards). The form factor is different by version. I'd ask SSC about trade-in upgrades.
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buzzr



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PostPosted: Tue May 19, 2009 6:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Ok, looks like I'm going to have to get a Pacarana....
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robsol
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PostPosted: Wed May 20, 2009 4:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Expanding could be even easier than on the Capybara, as there are some mysterious ports on the back of the Pacarana:

Posted Image, might have been reduced in size. Click Image to view fullscreen.


I assume that the Paca is identical.

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buzzr



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PostPosted: Wed May 20, 2009 6:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

That's just to link another one or two up if you need them.

I guess Smile
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BobTheDog



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PostPosted: Thu May 21, 2009 9:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

bphenix wrote:

As for upgrade, I doubt it is as straightforward as it used to be (insert more cards). The form factor is different by version. I'd ask SSC about trade-in upgrades.


Hi Guys,

I asked about this when I first started looking at the Paca/Pacarana. Here is the reply I got from SymbolicSound:

Cheers

Andy

-----------------------------------------------------------------------

We have a "trade-up" discount from Paca to Pacarana. In other words, if you were to get a Paca and then, within 12 months, decide that you'd rather have a Pacarana, you could trade in your Paca for a rebate towards a Pacarana.
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Antimon



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PostPosted: Fri May 29, 2009 2:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Also, ChucK. I come from a programming background and have started to realize that everyone doesn't like programming audio in ChucK (though I can't really understand it). But I'd recommend a quick look and experimentation round, preferrably on some clear project/goal. Or do it in SuperCollider or CSound. Give text-based programming a chance...

/Stefan

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robsol
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PostPosted: Fri May 29, 2009 6:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Thanks for the advice Antimon, it is much appreciated.

I am beginning to get into some basic programming, but it will be a while before I can do things that are already implemented in Kyma. I think programs like Supercollider and ChucK can live easily side by side with Kyma, and I am also looking into other programs.

The biggest problem I have is that there are so many alternatives, even amongst free software!



I love the process though, the search and the acquiring of new knowledge. You've got to love the process in this game! Very Happy

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buzzr



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PostPosted: Sat May 30, 2009 6:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I just got a Paca. It doesn't work with my main firewire port, it also does not work with my soundcard after the update.

I've emailed Kurt about it, but it would be nice to be able to use it...

I'm sure it will be fixed of course, it's just hard to wait..
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PostPosted: Sat May 30, 2009 11:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

buzzr wrote:
I just got a Paca. It doesn't work with my main firewire port, it also does not work with my soundcard after the update.

I've emailed Kurt about it, but it would be nice to be able to use it...

I'm sure it will be fixed of course, it's just hard to wait..


What is the problem you are seeing, maybe we can work it out before they get into work.

You have to be pretty careful with the firewire!

Are you on PC or MAC?

If on PC do you know your firewire chipset?

Cheers

Andy
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buzzr



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PostPosted: Sun May 31, 2009 5:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I have a mac. It only runs when plugged into the PCMCIA firewire slot, not when plugged into the regular firewire port. I have a pretty old powerbook but all my other firewire stuff works fine with the port.

But I cannot use the Paca right now as the current update makes my supported soundcard not hook up. It just returns to Silent Device.

I've generated a bug report also. They will get it resolved, it would just be nice to use my new kit Idea
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PostPosted: Sun May 31, 2009 6:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Have you got the sound device and the paca on the same firewire bus?
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buzzr



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PostPosted: Sun May 31, 2009 6:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Nope, it's on one of the usb ports.
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BobTheDog



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PostPosted: Sun May 31, 2009 7:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Ah.

Strange it would stop working with the new version. Have you tried the other usb port?

Also is it usb powered?
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robsol
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PostPosted: Sun May 31, 2009 12:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

What interface are you using Buzzr?

I suppose you already know this, but you can write audio to disk for the moment, so you can experiment, just not in real time...

Congratulations on the purchase in any case. Cool

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PostPosted: Sun May 31, 2009 2:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Congrats to the new Kyma users. I didn't see this topic. I would have jumped in before. If all you want is modular synthesis, the the G2 is the way to go except that it still lacks a fixed filter bank. doh

But if you want to do more, the Kyma is tremendous. Company support is the best you'll every experience. The learning curve is steep though.

Have fun and share you music with us, please.

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