Author |
Message |
waveplant
Joined: Apr 26, 2011 Posts: 7 Location: Chicago, IL
|
Posted: Sat Apr 30, 2011 12:42 pm Post subject:
why so many VCAs? |
|
|
One opinion I hear amongst modular synthesis veterans on these forums is that you can't have too many VCAs.
Would someone mind explaining to a newbie like myself why that is? And perhaps citing a really simple example where a VCA isn't just the last step in an audible signal chain? |
|
Back to top
|
|
|
blue hell
Site Admin
Joined: Apr 03, 2004 Posts: 24075 Location: The Netherlands, Enschede
Audio files: 277
G2 patch files: 320
|
Posted: Sat Apr 30, 2011 1:29 pm Post subject:
|
|
|
You can put a VCA before a modulation input for instance and so make the modulation amount voltage controlled.
For instance when you start a note you might want deeper vibrato that dies off slowly. This can be done by adding a VCA between the vibrato LFO and the FM input of the oscillator and controlling the VCA from the ADSR that you cantrol the volume with as well.
Or in general, it allows you to modulate the modulations, this can give you a more lively sound. _________________ Jan
also .. could someone please turn down the thermostat a bit.
|
|
Back to top
|
|
|
cbm
Joined: Oct 25, 2005 Posts: 381 Location: San Francisco
|
Posted: Sat Apr 30, 2011 1:37 pm Post subject:
|
|
|
In addition to the dynamic modulation that Blue Hell mentions above, which is really important, a VC mix of signals is totally useful, if you have VC resonance in a filter, that's done with a VCA. Counting VCAs that are built into other modules like oscillators, and filters, I probably have 40–50 VCAs in my system
(that said, you can have too many VCAs) _________________ Chris Muir
http://www.eardrill.com <– My jobby (more than a hobby, less than a job) |
|
Back to top
|
|
|
elektro80
Site Admin
Joined: Mar 25, 2003 Posts: 21959 Location: Norway
Audio files: 14
|
Posted: Sat Apr 30, 2011 3:25 pm Post subject:
|
|
|
What they said...
And yes.. there is probably a VCA saturation point.. at some stage.. _________________ A Charity Pantomime in aid of Paranoid Schizophrenics descended into chaos yesterday when someone shouted, "He's behind you!"
MySpace
SoundCloud
Flickr |
|
Back to top
|
|
|
blue hell
Site Admin
Joined: Apr 03, 2004 Posts: 24075 Location: The Netherlands, Enschede
Audio files: 277
G2 patch files: 320
|
Posted: Sat Apr 30, 2011 4:47 pm Post subject:
|
|
|
elektro80 wrote: | And yes.. there is probably a VCA saturation point.. at some stage.. |
Thats where virtual modulars shine, no wasted rack space for too many xxx modules
(and patch cables are free too!)
But anyway, the point is that control signal handling should not be undervalued - often I build patches with just one oscillator and tons of control signals and control modulations and delays and feedbacks and modifiers, and such can sound like an orchestra .. or like mud
(blub b) _________________ Jan
also .. could someone please turn down the thermostat a bit.
|
|
Back to top
|
|
|
cbm
Joined: Oct 25, 2005 Posts: 381 Location: San Francisco
|
Posted: Sat Apr 30, 2011 5:18 pm Post subject:
|
|
|
I often use VCAs as effects sends to external delays & verbs. Being able to have a delay send controlled by a lfo/envelope/sequencer/random/whathaveyou is really fun. _________________ Chris Muir
http://www.eardrill.com <– My jobby (more than a hobby, less than a job) |
|
Back to top
|
|
|
elektro80
Site Admin
Joined: Mar 25, 2003 Posts: 21959 Location: Norway
Audio files: 14
|
Posted: Sat Apr 30, 2011 6:04 pm Post subject:
|
|
|
cbm wrote: | I often use VCAs as effects sends to external delays & verbs. Being able to have a delay send controlled by a lfo/envelope/sequencer/random/whathaveyou is really fun. |
Yup, I also use VCAs for mixing delays, reverbs and what have you. Serious fun. _________________ A Charity Pantomime in aid of Paranoid Schizophrenics descended into chaos yesterday when someone shouted, "He's behind you!"
MySpace
SoundCloud
Flickr |
|
Back to top
|
|
|
waveplant
Joined: Apr 26, 2011 Posts: 7 Location: Chicago, IL
|
Posted: Sun May 01, 2011 4:44 am Post subject:
|
|
|
oh, of course - it's the same thing as the filter envelope amount knob on a hardwired synth. or [*~] in maxMSP. should've realized but with all this new information, my brain wasn't processing the details.
appreciate the clarification!
so is that the same thing attenuators are used for, albeit with the knobs calibrated in the opposite direction and without the added flexibility of serving as an output stage? |
|
Back to top
|
|
|
cbm
Joined: Oct 25, 2005 Posts: 381 Location: San Francisco
|
Posted: Sun May 01, 2011 11:01 am Post subject:
|
|
|
Yes, a VCA is a multiplier. Love this analog computing thing. _________________ Chris Muir
http://www.eardrill.com <– My jobby (more than a hobby, less than a job) |
|
Back to top
|
|
|
Antimon
Joined: Jan 18, 2005 Posts: 4145 Location: Sweden
Audio files: 371
G2 patch files: 100
|
Posted: Mon May 02, 2011 2:43 am Post subject:
|
|
|
waveplant wrote: | oh, of course - it's the same thing as the filter envelope amount knob on a hardwired synth. |
You don't need a VCA to implement a filter envelope amount knob, that's just simple attenuation. Sometimes VCFs have a knob next to the CV frequency input, that would be a filter envelope amount knob, of you've hooked an ADSR there.
But if you want the filter envelope amount to change over time automatically, that's a job for a VCA + modulation source.
waveplant wrote: | or [*~] in maxMSP. |
That's a better analogy I think.
/Stefan _________________ Antimon's Window
@soundcloud @Flattr home - you can't explain music |
|
Back to top
|
|
|
Eric G
Joined: Mar 07, 2007 Posts: 19 Location: Sweden
|
Posted: Wed Mar 14, 2012 3:34 am Post subject:
|
|
|
Also, what about layering???
Of course you would like to have two or more different sounds layered. So you need more VCA:s. |
|
Back to top
|
|
|
|