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The Threeler
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Argitoth



Joined: Jun 24, 2008
Posts: 152
Location: Gilbert, Arizona
Audio files: 3
G2 patch files: 6

PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2012 2:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

http://www.alps.com/WebObjects/catalog.woa/E/HTML/Switch/Rotary/SRBM/SRBM140800.html

I'm trying to find a small rotary switch. Would the above switch work for the Threeler?

Last edited by Argitoth on Tue Sep 25, 2012 6:14 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Argitoth



Joined: Jun 24, 2008
Posts: 152
Location: Gilbert, Arizona
Audio files: 3
G2 patch files: 6

PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2012 2:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

wiring diagram for SRBM140800 switch
Posted Image, might have been reduced in size. Click Image to view fullscreen.

Last edited by Argitoth on Tue Sep 25, 2012 6:16 pm; edited 1 time in total
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fluxmonkey



Joined: Jun 24, 2005
Posts: 696
Location: cleve

PostPosted: Mon Mar 12, 2012 10:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

i used this one from mouser: 690-C5P0206N-A, works great. outstanding module!

initially i used an undocumented switch from the spare parts bin--but the first few times i dialed it, there was a catastrophic short that blew fuses and shut down modules. I assume it was a shorting rather than break-before-make switch, but I didn't check, just pulled the thing out and threw it away before it did any serious damage!

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numbernone



Joined: Aug 16, 2006
Posts: 477
Location: new york city

PostPosted: Mon Mar 12, 2012 5:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

LOL ground and the negative rail always make trouble when they meet LOL

I finally got mine going as well. Dont remember how... I think Q3 ws burned. My oven hot OTAs survived thank god, and this thing just RIPS.

LOVE
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pdub



Joined: Jun 08, 2007
Posts: 14
Location: california

PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2012 5:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Hi Group

I just finished the Threeler today. Man it's very cool! Smile It will take me some time to fully get the scope of it. It is very wicked though!

Right now it's starts self oscillating around 11 o'clock on the Res pot. Compared to other filters I have this seems rather early in the rotation. Does this sound correct for this filter? I know it works a little differently and even requires some resonance to pass audio from Output 3.

I used the Bridechamber parts kit and I am running the module at 15V with the suggested resistor changes.

Any help would be greatly appreciated!

Thanks, Charles
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frijitz



Joined: May 04, 2007
Posts: 1710
Location: NM USA
Audio files: 54

PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2012 6:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

pdub wrote:
Right now it's starts self oscillating around 11 o'clock on the Res pot. Compared to other filters I have this seems rather early in the rotation. Does this sound correct for this filter?

Hi Charles --

Yep, that's exactly right. The reason is that there is lots of nonlinear and chaotic action above resonance. Play with the higher resonance settings with the input level fairly low and you should see what I mean.

Ian
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pdub



Joined: Jun 08, 2007
Posts: 14
Location: california

PostPosted: Thu Mar 29, 2012 8:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Thanks for your response Ian.Yes I see what you mean, I got to spend a lot of time with the filter in the studio today. It is really a fantastic filter! Great job on the concept and design.

It will be one of my favorites for sure.

Thanks, Charles
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egodzillal



Joined: Oct 05, 2007
Posts: 10
Location: paris

PostPosted: Fri Apr 20, 2012 5:27 am    Post subject: docs ? Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Hi,

just received my threeler pcb + parts but can't find build docs anywhere :p
any hint ?

cheers
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thermionicjunky



Joined: Dec 07, 2006
Posts: 71
Location: san francisco

PostPosted: Fri Apr 20, 2012 7:27 am    Post subject: Re: docs ? Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

egodzillal wrote:
Hi,

just received my threeler pcb + parts but can't find build docs anywhere :p
any hint ?

cheers


They should be emailed with purchase, but sometimes Scott needs a reminder.
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davebr



Joined: Jun 09, 2007
Posts: 181
Location: portland, or

PostPosted: Wed May 09, 2012 11:02 pm    Post subject: Threeler filter Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I just finished building my Threeler. I really like this filter. I did a few tweaks on mine and my own front panel design using FPE. Details are on my Threeler page at http://modularsynthesis.com/bridechamber/threeler/threeler.htm

Dave
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egodzillal



Joined: Oct 05, 2007
Posts: 10
Location: paris

PostPosted: Tue Jun 05, 2012 9:40 am    Post subject:   Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Hi

i'm almost done with my threeler.
the things is about that R36a again.. sorry i red all i could about it but my english seems bad enough i don't understand it.
Bridechambers says :

Quote:
Q1/ Q2 are the matched pair, in this case the 2SA798. It can go in either direction, in the five pins. After that, put the tempco in R36a, leaving the legs long enough so that the resistor goes over the matched pair, so that you can pull it tight w/ some thermal compound between them, making a good physical connection.


so you put a798 first then R36a and stick the R36a thing to the top head of the a798 ... if that's what i understand what is it for ? thermal something ?
or does it have to do with a special way to sold the legs behind the PCB ?
i'm sorry you answered this question like 10 times already but it's really because i'm afraid to miss some english words


other question about the construction part.
i see on davebr's picture that he has a metal plate to hold the PCB.
i don't have this plate is it missing from my kit or did davebr built it himself ?
http://modularsynthesis.com/bridechamber/threeler/djb-theeler_rear.jpg
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davebr



Joined: Jun 09, 2007
Posts: 181
Location: portland, or

PostPosted: Tue Jun 05, 2012 10:00 am    Post subject: Threeler tempco Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

egodzillal wrote:
Hi

i'm almost done with my threeler.
the things is about that R36a again.. sorry i red all i could about it but my english seems bad enough i don't understand it.
Bridechambers says :

Quote:
Q1/ Q2 are the matched pair, in this case the 2SA798. It can go in either direction, in the five pins. After that, put the tempco in R36a, leaving the legs long enough so that the resistor goes over the matched pair, so that you can pull it tight w/ some thermal compound between them, making a good physical connection.


so you put a798 first then R36a and stick the R36a thing to the top head of the a798 ... if that's what i understand what is it for ? thermal something ?
or does it have to do with a special way to sold the legs behind the PCB ?
i'm sorry you answered this question like 10 times already but it's really because i'm afraid to miss some english words

I put in the 2SA798 unsoldered and then formed the leads of the tempco so it would fit tight against the 2SA798. This required bending the leads both inward and around in order to fit properly against the side of the 2SA798. Then I soldered in the 2SA798 at the proper height. Then I removed the tempco, applied heat sink grease on the side of both the tempco and 2SA798 and installed and soldered it in.

Here's how mine looks.
Posted Image, might have been reduced in size. Click Image to view fullscreen.

Dave
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frijitz



Joined: May 04, 2007
Posts: 1710
Location: NM USA
Audio files: 54

PostPosted: Tue Jun 05, 2012 11:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

egodzillal wrote:
other question about the construction part.
i see on davebr's picture that he has a metal plate to hold the PCB.
i don't have this plate is it missing from my kit or did davebr built it himself

If you are using the Bridechamber kit you do not need a bracket. The board is supported by the pots.

Ian
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davebr



Joined: Jun 09, 2007
Posts: 181
Location: portland, or

PostPosted: Tue Jun 05, 2012 11:20 am    Post subject: Threeler
Subject description: bracket
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egodzillal wrote:
other question about the construction part.
i see on davebr's picture that he has a metal plate to hold the PCB.
i don't have this plate is it missing from my kit or did davebr built it himself

I choose to use a bracket on any module I build so I fabricate one for all DIY modules. I have 0.050" sheet aluminum that I use. It's thin enough to mount behind potentiometers and jacks and easy to form.
Dave
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egodzillal



Joined: Oct 05, 2007
Posts: 10
Location: paris

PostPosted: Tue Jun 05, 2012 12:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Quote:
The board is supported by the pots.

NICE ! thx both for explanations. hope i can find some "heat sink grease" at the store :p

oh btw special hello to Argitoth who gave me the will to do that wonderful threeler with his soundcloud demos !
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davebr



Joined: Jun 09, 2007
Posts: 181
Location: portland, or

PostPosted: Tue Jun 05, 2012 12:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

egodzillal wrote:
NICE ! thx both for explanations. hope i can find some "heat sink grease" at the store :p

oh btw special hello to Argitoth who gave me the will to do that wonderful threeler with his soundcloud demos !

RadioShack does sell heat sink grease.
http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2102858

Dave
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egodzillal



Joined: Oct 05, 2007
Posts: 10
Location: paris

PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2012 6:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Posted Image, might have been reduced in size. Click Image to view fullscreen.Posted Image, might have been reduced in size. Click Image to view fullscreen.Posted Image, might have been reduced in size. Click Image to view fullscreen. and it's a success Posted Image, might have been reduced in size. Click Image to view fullscreen.Posted Image, might have been reduced in size. Click Image to view fullscreen.Posted Image, might have been reduced in size. Click Image to view fullscreen.

wouhou ! sounds great. really happy to have that in my synth and all the nice options on it.
now .. what should i do with my ms10 Posted Image, might have been reduced in size. Click Image to view fullscreen.
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egodzillal



Joined: Oct 05, 2007
Posts: 10
Location: paris

PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2012 9:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

... euh was happy to fast Razz
i have something i don't understand.
it seems to work all fine for filter and reso on these positions :
2LP/HP
LP/2HP
3HP

but on the 3LP the resonance goes weird :
output 1&2 = no significant reso like it does on the other MODE sounds almost like if it was 0% reso
output 3 = same but reso acts like a volume. when set to0% it cuts the sound. :X
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frijitz



Joined: May 04, 2007
Posts: 1710
Location: NM USA
Audio files: 54

PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2012 9:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

egodzillal wrote:
but on the 3LP the resonance goes weird :
output 1&2 = no significant reso like it does on the other MODE sounds almost like if it was 0% reso

The first and second stages are a bit weaker, but you should still see a definite resonance. Make sure you don't have the input up too high.

Quote:
output 3 = same but reso acts like a volume. when set to0% it cuts the sound.

Correct, it has to be part way up.

Don't know why you are not seeing resonances. Are you sure the resonance control is up far enough?

Ian
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egodzillal



Joined: Oct 05, 2007
Posts: 10
Location: paris

PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2012 10:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Quote:
Make sure you don't have the input up too high.

yeah that was it ! it's working normal when input level is lower
it sounds terrific. my favorite filter by far thx for make it !
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davebr



Joined: Jun 09, 2007
Posts: 181
Location: portland, or

PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2012 2:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

frijitz wrote:
Quote:
output 3 = same but reso acts like a volume. when set to 0% it cuts the sound.

Correct, it has to be part way up.

Ian

I biased my resonance control slightly on so I always have an Out3 signal. It didn't take much and seems to work quite well without having any significant effect on the resonance.

Dave
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ShyK



Joined: Jan 06, 2008
Posts: 8
Location: Israel

PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 5:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Ian, I just logged in to say that your filter is the best I've ever used. A big statement and yet completely true.

I've been a fan of 3-pole filters for a very long time. My opinion is that a good 3-pole design provides a more balanced and musically useful result than either 2-pole or 4-pole in most cases. This particular implementation does this and is also the best sounding one, and getting no muffling whatsoever of the high frequencies is great.
The combination of 2-pole LP or HP with 1 LP or HP is also a really great idea, finally making things like "band-pass" sweeps more "musical" than ever.

I've attached a simple little example to show people how awesome it is.

I got the filter from Scott / Bridechamber and I have to mention it was very nice to deal with him.


shy-threeler-chord.flac
 Description:
Chord from 3 sawtooth oscillators (Q106), Threeler VCF in 3-pole low-pass mode, output 2.

Download
 Filename:  shy-threeler-chord.flac
 Filesize:  5.48 MB
 Downloaded:  323 Time(s)

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frijitz



Joined: May 04, 2007
Posts: 1710
Location: NM USA
Audio files: 54

PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 5:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

ShyK wrote:
Ian, I just logged in to say that your filter is the best I've ever used. A big statement and yet completely true.

Thanks! Glad you like it.

Quote:
I've been a fan of 3-pole filters for a very long time. My opinion is that a good 3-pole design provides a more balanced and musically useful result than either 2-pole or 4-pole in most cases.

Yeah, I wonder if the reason is the same as why a lot of folks like 3P for speaker xovers?

Quote:
I've attached a simple little example to show people how awesome it is.

Thanks for putting that up -- sounds great!

Ian
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brother303



Joined: Nov 02, 2010
Posts: 139
Location: ruhr-area/germany

PostPosted: Tue Jul 03, 2012 7:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Hi Ian,

finished my Threeler yesterday using a Bridechamber part-kit. Flawless build, everything worked as expected from the first switch-on.

Added one mod stated by Dave Brown, just one more resistor (1M5) on the tl072 to keep the reso up a little bit, so all outputs work perfect in every mode without turning up the reso-pot.

This vcf is absolutely amazing, breathtaking and outstandig! Highly recommended to everyone using modular synths!! I´ve never heard a filter screaming like this (in an absolutely positive way), and yes, turn up the resonance and you´ll know why there is a fine-tune pot in addition to the cutoff-pot... Very Happy

In other words : G R E A T !!!

Cheers
Greg

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ShyK



Joined: Jan 06, 2008
Posts: 8
Location: Israel

PostPosted: Fri Jul 06, 2012 6:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

frijitz wrote:
Quote:
I've been a fan of 3-pole filters for a very long time. My opinion is that a good 3-pole design provides a more balanced and musically useful result than either 2-pole or 4-pole in most cases.

Yeah, I wonder if the reason is the same as why a lot of folks like 3P for speaker xovers?

I think that somehow it generally resembles resonance properties of things in nature more than 4-pole which may be too steep in comparison. Instuments, voices, structures. For example, I'm sure you know how the character of your filter in the second output is surprisingly voice-like, no multiple filters and no special tweaks, just a single 3-pole filter with some resonance. I think the "vocal" quality of it is not really vocal quality, but simply natural quality, but we just naturally tend to associate it with voice.

On another note, there is a lack of demos so I've attached a trippy acid/trance sample for anyone who wants to hear what a super tough 3-pole filter can do in a production-ready setting.


shy-threeler-acid.flac
 Description:
Q106 VCO -> Threeler VCF -> KSP8 -> HVTP2 -> PL-2

Download
 Filename:  shy-threeler-acid.flac
 Filesize:  5.78 MB
 Downloaded:  227 Time(s)

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