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 Forum index » DIY Hardware and Software
Buchla 160 - Need fresh eyes
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Snaper



Joined: Feb 28, 2014
Posts: 217
Location: Hungary

PostPosted: Fri Sep 05, 2014 2:38 am    Post subject: Buchla 160 - Need fresh eyes Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Hi Guys,

Just started to use LTSpice, and the first what I've tried is the Buchla 160 Noise source.
Actually, I can see different noise waveforms at the output, but they're week...just a few negative nanoVolts.

Could somebody check this?

(Schemo PDF and LTSpice files attached)


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gdavis



Joined: Feb 27, 2013
Posts: 359
Location: San Diego
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 05, 2014 9:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

If I'm not mistaken, that is an open collector noise source circuit which I don't think is a good place to start with spice. Spice simulation is based on mathematical models of the basic characteristics of circuit components within specifically defined operating conditions.

The use of a BJT as a noise source is outside the normal operating parameters, taking advantage of the underlying physical properties of the device, and not well modeled in spice.

If you want to learn spice, start with something more basic like a simple opamp circuit, basic filter or maybe a simple oscillator.

The thing you have to understand about spice in general is that it's "idealized". It handles the basic properties that define the majority of a devices operation and are easily modeled with simple mathematical equations (at it's core spice is relatively simple, just a calculator), but real devices have a lot of little quirks that can't be easily characterized or modeled. Some of these quirks have some limited modeling and there are tricks you can do if you need to introduce something specific into your simulation (someone might even know one for this noise generator), but that is more advanced, not beginner stuff.

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Snaper



Joined: Feb 28, 2014
Posts: 217
Location: Hungary

PostPosted: Fri Sep 05, 2014 10:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I see.
I dont like breadboarding, thats the reason why I made this up in spice.
If Im clear, it is possible that the circuit could produce good noise in the real world?
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blue hell
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Joined: Apr 03, 2004
Posts: 24079
Location: The Netherlands, Enschede
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 05, 2014 11:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Snaper wrote:
If Im clear, it is possible that the circuit could produce good noise in the real world?


Yes, but you may need to try several transistors - as you are using them in some out of spec mode ...

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Jan
also .. could someone please turn down the thermostat a bit.
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Snaper



Joined: Feb 28, 2014
Posts: 217
Location: Hungary

PostPosted: Fri Sep 05, 2014 11:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I see.
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Fernando



Joined: Dec 30, 2006
Posts: 286
Location: Barcelona & Emporda, Spain

PostPosted: Sun Dec 04, 2016 3:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Anyone built the 160 circuit recently?

Which voltage range at it's output? 1.22V or hotter?
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fluxmonkey



Joined: Jun 24, 2005
Posts: 708
Location: cleve

PostPosted: Sat Dec 24, 2016 12:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

i've built it, and have PCBs available: http://fluxmonkey.com/fluxmerch_gear.htm. I don't remember the output level measurement, but its designed for standard buchla audio levels, ie line level, which is i believe 1.2v.


Fernando wrote:
Anyone built the 160 circuit recently?

Which voltage range at it's output? 1.22V or hotter?

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Fernando



Joined: Dec 30, 2006
Posts: 286
Location: Barcelona & Emporda, Spain

PostPosted: Sun Dec 25, 2016 12:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Thanks Bbob, I suspected about the usual 1.2V output level, but just would like to check from an actual circuit


fluxmonkey wrote:
i've built it, and have PCBs available: http://fluxmonkey.com/fluxmerch_gear.htm. I don't remember the output level measurement, but its designed for standard buchla audio levels, ie line level, which is i believe 1.2v.


Fernando wrote:
Anyone built the 160 circuit recently?

Which voltage range at it's output? 1.22V or hotter?
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