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Where's the beef?
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State Machine
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Joined: Apr 17, 2006
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 12, 2006 1:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Howard wrote:
Quote:
I don't know what's to discuss about an active subwoofer. I've used them before - they're excellent. The Mackie sub should work well with the Mackie PAs we used.


I guess since there is such a large selection out there, someone may have a better suggestion than my own. Maybe a lighter class "D" amplifier or something like that? Your right though, the compatability should not be a question. Wink

I own a B2092A for my studio and it is real nice! Great price also!

http://www.behringer.com/B2092A/index.cfm?lang=ENG

Chat soon ...
Bill
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State Machine
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 12, 2006 1:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Greg Wrote:

Quote:
Thanks Bill, for the suggestions and offer to contribute!


Your very welcome! My pleasure!

Chat soon ....
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dmosc



Joined: Jun 23, 2003
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 12, 2006 3:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

smokris, I hope our comments on the sound quality have not made you feel unhappy with your performance. I was quite impressed! I thought it was definately one of the better acts of EM06. I guess that's why it made the sound quality in that room all the more apparent. You had our ears perked up!
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utenzil



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PostPosted: Tue Jun 13, 2006 12:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

$0.02, the three prong adapter provided by smokris to elminate the ground hum from my laptop definitely helped my sound.
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deknow



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PostPosted: Tue Jun 13, 2006 12:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

...actually, it was me who loaned you the 3 prong adaptor. Smile no one who plays with a laptop should leave home without one.

deknow
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mosc
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 13, 2006 12:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

utenzil wrote:
$0.02, the three prong adapter provided by smokris to elminate the ground hum from my laptop definitely helped my sound.


General suggestion. Get a good pair of diag cutters and go through every piece of equipment you have and permanently remove the ground pin.

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deknow



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PostPosted: Tue Jun 13, 2006 12:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

howard, i almost completely agree on practial grounds (so to speak), but i would hate for a fire inpector (after the fire that had nothing to do with grounding) to have an excuse to blame me....a cheater can be quickly removed (and put in your pocket), and doesn't appear as "reckless" as snipping the prong. i do keep a cheater on my laptop powersupply, and i've been questioned about it more than once (by doctors who paid a lot to have their offices properly wired).

ask greg about the argument on synthsites about this isssue Smile

deknow
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utenzil



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PostPosted: Tue Jun 13, 2006 12:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

deknow wrote:
...actually, it was me who loaned you the 3 prong adaptor. Smile no one who plays with a laptop should leave home without one.

deknow


ah ha! ok, thanks, then Smile That is decidedly the case, I did have one extension cord gelded as Howard suggests kicking around somewhere Smile.

It's also very good to have the PA plugged into a separate circuit than the laptop. http://www.epanorama.net/documents/groundloop/

Last edited by utenzil on Tue Jun 13, 2006 1:03 pm; edited 1 time in total
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mosc
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 13, 2006 1:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

deknow wrote:
howard, i almost completely agree on practial grounds (so to speak), but i would hate for a fire inpector (after the fire that had nothing to do with grounding) to have an excuse to blame me....a cheater can be quickly removed (and put in your pocket), and doesn't appear as "reckless" as snipping the prong. i do keep a cheater on my laptop powersupply, and i've been questioned about it more than once (by doctors who paid a lot to have their offices properly wired).

ask greg about the argument on synthsites about this isssue Smile

deknow


It's always better to be lucky than good. The fire inspector visited the CAC on the Wednesday - the day before the event. Wink Our equipment setup was clean - since it wasn't there... Very Happy

Well, we can argue about this. I will win, but only if the prime criterion is noise reduction. In some rare cases, you do need a ground to get rid of RF interference, but there are many ways to get rid of that without grounds as well. The ground is mainly for safety, not fire protection. I'm sure a fire inspector would be upset with almost any electronic music setup just because they look so crazy - so many extension cords and power strips. The nice thing about clipping off the ground pins is that you can't see it's gone when they are plugged in. Besides most fire inspectors wouldn't think anyone would be stupid enough to intentionally remove the grounds. Wink Another good thing, when it comes to packing up, I can alway identify my gear even if I forgot to write my name on it. Laughing

This really happened, on Monday afternoon, Greg and I were in the theater. He picks up a power strip - "Is this your's or mine?", he looks at the plug and says, "it's yours...".

Some synths, like the Clavia G2, don't even have grounds. In fact, I never buy a synth if it has a ground connection. Wink

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deknow



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PostPosted: Tue Jun 13, 2006 1:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Quote:
It's also very good to have the PA plugged into a separate circuit than the laptop
.

actually, i don't think that's true. you generally want all audio equiment on one outlet, unless you are using a balanced audio connection and can lift the xlr ground.

Quote:
It's always better to be lucky than good. The fire inspector visited the CAC on the Wednesday - the day before the event. Our equipment setup was clean - since it wasn't there...


...we might have been "good" as well. i saw him drive up (on thursday, not wed), and grabbed the cheater off of my setup, and unpluged and hid our plug in water boiler Smile

deknow
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mosc
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 13, 2006 4:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

deknow wrote:

...we might have been "good" as well. i saw him drive up (on thursday, not wed), and grabbed the cheater off of my setup, and unpluged and hid our plug in water boiler Smile


Shocked Very Happy

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deknow



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PostPosted: Tue Jun 13, 2006 5:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

about 8 years ago (before i had nearly the experience doing live audio than i do now), i was asked to do sound for a free concert in a church (small room) in harvard square (a fundraiser to put out the cd that a local musician had been working on before his suicide)...i declined, as it sounded like a whole can of worms.

i was also playing at the concert, and the live sound setup was about what i would have done...powered studio monitors, mic, guitar amp. while we were in the audience, a singer type was shocked pretty hard by the microphone...i whispered to ramona, "that's why i didn't agree to do sound".

there are some safety factors, but i've rarely felt like i was doing something dangerous (and i'm pretty paranoid about such things) to do live sound.

deknow
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 13, 2006 5:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

one other quick thought on the sound issues (bass).

the mackie speakers only really go down to 60hz...if you try to push more subbass out of them, you won't get it, you will only get the upper harmonics.

the high amplitude, low frequency signals will trip the protection on the built in amp, and the cutoff frequency will roll up from 60 to 120hz ...to protect the speaker, and to keep the amp from clipping.

the upside to this is they don't really clip easily...the downside is if you try to squeeze really low frequencies out of them, you will end up with less bass, as you loose everything below 120hz.

just stuff to keep in mind...the mackie's are quite popular, and you are likely to see them again.

deknow
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utenzil



Joined: Apr 10, 2006
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 14, 2006 10:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

deknow wrote:
Quote:
It's also very good to have the PA plugged into a separate circuit than the laptop
.

actually, i don't think that's true. you generally want all audio equiment on one outlet, unless you are using a balanced audio connection and can lift the xlr ground.


It has worked to eliminate hum for me before.

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deknow



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PostPosted: Wed Jun 14, 2006 11:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

....there are many things to try when you have ground noise problem.

in the case of the cac (at least in the large gallery), the wall outlets were not grounded, which will make the laptop noise worse (the noise from the laptop ground can't get to actual ground, so it goes into the chassis ground of the other equipment. this can be a problem even with a grounded outlet, but this tends to make things worse.

in some cases, lifting the ground makes things worse (i've had this with my powered studio monitors)

pluging the laptop into a separate circut can help in some circumstances, but in general, it's not where i would start.

deknow
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utenzil



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PostPosted: Wed Jun 14, 2006 2:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

deknow wrote:
....there are many things to try when you have ground noise problem.

in the case of the cac (at least in the large gallery), the wall outlets were not grounded, which will make the laptop noise worse (the noise from the laptop ground can't get to actual ground, so it goes into the chassis ground of the other equipment. this can be a problem even with a grounded outlet, but this tends to make things worse.

in some cases, lifting the ground makes things worse (i've had this with my powered studio monitors)

pluging the laptop into a separate circut can help in some circumstances, but in general, it's not where i would start.


I'd definitely agree with that, particularly given the above Smile the three prongs are decidedly superfluous.

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