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 Forum index » Clavia Nord Modular » G2 FAQ
Serious G2 Engine Problem
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northstar



Joined: Jan 19, 2006
Posts: 35
Location: Vienna/Austria/EU

PostPosted: Tue Mar 28, 2006 8:05 pm    Post subject:  Serious G2 Engine Problem
Subject description: I'm desperately seeking for your help! Unable to bring my engine to life...
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Hi everybody,

I'm desperately looking for your help, Jan, Howard... whoever can contribute to a solution, highly and frantically appreciated!!

I recieved my Modular G2 engine a few days ago. Before even give it a tryout at my place I took it to my piano teacher, who is a Nord Modular addict himself and owns a Classic Modular. We updated the factory installed OS to the current 1.4 via the guy's Mac, which was indeed a process smoothly by the book, we installed the 1.4 Editor at the Mac and checked out the factory presets. Everything OK.

At home I was eager to check the G2 engine's sound via my HiFi equipment, hence I connected the main-outs to the amp and my stage piano to the G2 engine's midi-in. I instantly got a sound - the Clavia welcome-noodle. I tried if I was able to change to another preset via a stage piano's program change message, but that didn't work. Since then I hadn't even installed the Editor and I hadn't have connected the engine to my PC.

Then I installed the G2 USB driver and the v1.4 Editor to my PC, connected the engine via USB and launched the Editor. Unpleasant surprise: Blank patch window and all Synth submenues greyed out. Sad I tried to load a patch which I had created with the Demo. That worked, but once again: the Synth submenues out of function and no way to upload the patch to the engine. Sad

At that stage I rechecked the USB connection in detail. I tried several USB cables (Each connection straight to USB port. NO hub!), all the USB ports, nothing changed! The Win98SE Control Center/Device Manager read the G2 hardware correctly with its respective driver and as being active.

My next guess was that the G2's OS didn't like the change from Apple Mac to PC (Not very likely, but who knows) or something was going wrong while having the engine connected to my stage piano and something corrupted the OS. Hence I launched the Update Utility. It read: "Current status: Nord Modular G2 Engine, OS version 1.4". Catching no glimpse of another option I tried to reload the OS and checked the "update" button. It read "sending reboot request - waiting for reconnect", then "reboot failed" and left it there. When pressing the "update" button, the engine's Midi LED lit up flashing and kept on flashing, even when I terminated the Update Utility.

I was aware that Clavia states that one should under no circumstances shut-off the G2 hardware while in an OS-update process. But was there any update in progress? There was no percentage indication like when attempting the successful update at my piano teacher's. At least Clavia certainly didn't mean that one should wait 'til his very end, so I shut-off the engine's power after some 30 minutes and no progress at all.

Then I retried the process. The PC/Updater/G2 behaviour differed in detail but the outcome was pretty much the same. Sad When launching the Update Utility once it read "Current status: Nord Modular G2 Engine, OS version 1.4" and terminated itself when I tried to start the update process. Once it read "No Nord Modular G2 Connected" without stalling and once it read "No Nord Modular G2 Connected" and crashed completely. On perhaps the tenth retry the Updater read "Recv OS v1.4", the USB LED lit up steady and the Midi LED was flashing (Hopeful thought: "A successful update at last??"), but in fact nothing happened, no progress after another 30 minutes. On some stalls of the Updater Utility the Windows-OS lost the G2's driver entry and after shut-off/shut-on of the engine this time it didn't read "G2 ... found" but "new unknown hardware found" for a change. Question Question Confused

Ah.. Of course I'm to mention that I attempeted some "hardware resets" then, holding the engine's hidden reset button depressed while powering-on the engine. Not the slightest difference! Same behaviour as before after launching the Update Utility.

Whatever. I'm unable to use the G2 engine and it's Editor and I can't think of no solution now that I haven't already tried and that's quite frustrating. Crying or Very sad Crying or Very sad Just to highlight it: 1.) The GS OS update was perfectly successful at my piano teacher's and the engine performed well there. 2.) I didn't mess around with the G2's OS right after connecting it to the PC. At the first place I launched the Editor and it didn't establish positiv communication with the engine from the very start. So this seems to point to a USB problem. But my other USB gear works perfectly. And what's more important: There must be some kind of USB communication between my G2 engine and my PC 'cause the USB LED lit up!

Perhaps the following details can pinpoint the problem:
Whenever I launch the Editor and keep it running (Without any file-loading, saving, patch-building or whatever activity) after some 2 minutes there's a window popping up that reads "major error". Nothing else.

I kept a sharp eye on the engine's USB LED. Whenever I launch the Editor it lights up and keeps on 'til I close the Editor. Whenever I launched the Update Utility it lit up very briefly (Obviously while the Utility read out the G2s OS version data) and darkened then. It stayed dark while the readout was "sending reboot request - waiting for reconnect". But it kept lit on whenever the Update Utility stalled and crashed. It then only darkened when killing the stalled Update Utility via the task manager. It sounds weird but it's quite like the Editor or the Update Utility establishes an USB connection and the engine responds with either terminating that connection or with stalling the respective program. Confused

Just to count out every possible cause: My PC's Win98SE Control Center/Device Manager lists a "1394 Bus Controller" with its sub "PCI OHCI-compatible IEEE 1394-Hostcontroller" and that device caused a conflict of resources some month ago and is currently disabled. I don't know the heck what its purpose is but that disabled device never caused any problems since.

Please help!!!

northstar
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Blue Hell
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 28, 2006 8:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

It seems like USB is not working properly, don't know what and why though.

But whatever you do don't try to update the synth OS when USB is flakey. Guess you did no harm but it seems such a bad idea ... and there really should be no need to update the same once more.

Maybe you can check again on the Mac of your teacher if the G2 is still working ?

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jksuperstar



Joined: Aug 20, 2004
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 28, 2006 9:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I was going to list some links to other threads on this problem here, but there's a few too many Smile Just hit the "search" (upper right corner), then search for all terms of "g2 usb hub".

I had a similar issue with my G2 keyboard. A powered USB hub solved my problem. I've since replaced that laptop, so I don't know if it helps having a powered vs. non-powered USB hub. I hear there were/are some issues with the G2's USB & grounding, but whatever, the hub will re-time the G2's output, and make it more friendly with the PC's USB port. That was my experience, and also fixed my problem and have never had an issue since.
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varice



Joined: Dec 29, 2004
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 28, 2006 9:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Oh no! Sorry to hear that you are having problems with the new Engine.

Did you reboot your PC after installing the USB driver and Editor software while the PC was connected to the Engine already powered on? The problem you described with the Editor not showing a connection to the Engine is the same problem I have if I do not have my G2X powered on and USB connected before booting my PC. I always get a good USB connection if I power the G2X first and then boot the PC.

But if that does not work for you, Jan's advice is very good - test your Engine on the teacher's Mac. Try the Editor software first. If that works, then of course the problem is not with your Engine hardware or OS. It would then be a problem with your PC/USB.

Try these suggestions and let us know what you find. Good Luck!

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mosc
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 29, 2006 9:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Sorry to read about your problem. I have nothing else to add, but here is a probably unrelated anecdote. I have an evil usb port on one of my computers. About 6 months ago, someone came over and plugged in their USB flash card to give me some pictures and the device stopped working. Blown out. Other devices I have since used have had no problems. Last week my daughter plugged in her 40 GB iPod and it worked, she ripped a few CDs. Then she unplugged it an the iPod was dead. It won't work on that USB port or any other. Not trying to scare you, but I think evil USB ports are out there. If you every get one bite, I'd suggest trashing the USB port. That's what I'm doing.
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ian-s



Joined: Apr 01, 2004
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 29, 2006 2:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I am sure that there is an acknowledged flaw in the (engine only?) USB hardware which leads to failure under some conditions. I would take it back to the shop and if they cant get it working, have it serviced. A replacement unit might have the same gremlin waiting to bite at a less convenient time in the future.
BTW has anyone had a dead USB port on a G2 key or G2X?

Howard, that is an interesting story about your rouge USB port.
I wonder if some Sony software in your boot sector detected the CD Ripping activity (by sensing bits flipping inside the RFID tags on the CD cases) and then reprogrammed the USB port (sending it a Kill password) specifically to destroy the Ipod.
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mosc
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 30, 2006 7:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

g2ian wrote:
Howard, that is an interesting story about your rouge USB port.
I wonder if some Sony software in your boot sector detected the CD Ripping activity (by sensing bits flipping inside the RFID tags on the CD cases) and then reprogrammed the USB port (sending it a Kill password) specifically to destroy the Ipod.

Idea That must be it. Shocked

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Acidfever



Joined: Aug 25, 2004
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 11, 2006 11:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Keep in mind that Microsoft OSes prior to WinXP need their USB devices disconnected before physically removing the device. XP does this automaticly but it is possible to damage either USB port or device if you do not disconnect your USB before detaching it.

This is kind of like PS/2 ports blowing out when connecting a mouse 10 years ago. Non likely that it happened....but it could!!
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glitched



Joined: Mar 25, 2006
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Location: phila., pa USA

PostPosted: Tue Aug 29, 2006 7:37 pm    Post subject:  
Subject description: Random restarts?
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I'm wondering if my problem is related to improper grounding or some other hardware malady.

Basically, my computer will restart, randomly, when my G2 is connected and powered on.

I don't have to be doing anything with it (sending midi messages, editing patches); my computer just restarts for no good reason.

At first, I thought it could be the Axiom 25 kbd controller, which runs off the computer's USB power, but I've ruled that out. I kept my computer on all day, with only the G2 plugged in and turned on (no other USB devices) and the darn thing restarted on me.

To be 100% sure, I will install the G2 diver on my rock-solid HP laptop (don't laugh). (Hey, having a dedicated editor PC might not be a bad idea.)

Anyone experience random restarts?
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mosc
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 29, 2006 8:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

My previous computer used to restart randomly and the Micorsoft error message said there was a problem with a device driver. I could never figure out what it was. I replaced the mother board and things are rock solid now. I think it was a bad raid controller but I may never know.

Let us know if your G2 engine works well with your hp.

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glitched



Joined: Mar 25, 2006
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 02, 2006 5:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Well, I've found that my randomly restarting computer problem has nothing to do with the G2, thankfully. After plugging it in to my laptop and running the editor for two straight days, the computer didn't crash. It doesn't have anything to do with the Axiom 25 controller, either.

The only other possibility is my Mackie 1220 Onyx Firewire interface. This thing is freaking great, but it seems like the PC restarts more often when I have lower latency settings or higher sample rates.

More testing will ensue.

The venerable G2 has gotten through, unscathed.

-d
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Suilebhain



Joined: Jan 25, 2007
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 16, 2007 9:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I am having a similar problem.

I bought a G2 engine used. I have a PC running Windows XP and connect direct to my PC's USB ports.

I loaded the driver, set up the editor, then hooked up the unit. Nothing. Looking in the Update utility, it would say No Nord Modular connected but if I pull the USB plug and plug it back in , as per the instructions, the Update utility then sees my engine.

However, the editor never seems to see it. Opening a patch that I have downloaded does not connect the synth. The choices on the Synth menu are all greyed out. I have my headphones on and nothing carries through. The virtual keyboard sends nothing.

Please help!
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glitched



Joined: Mar 25, 2006
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 17, 2007 5:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

My problem turned out to be the Mackie 1220 firewire mixer (driver). Strangely, the thing that solved my problem was simply leaving the mixer off until windows loads.

So, nothing to do with the g2.
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Blue Hell
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 17, 2007 12:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Good you found it Very Happy
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Suilebhain



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PostPosted: Tue Jul 17, 2007 10:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I detected an anomaly that might help someone help me get the Editor and the G2 to talk to each other.

In the Editor section of the manual there is something called Slot Buttons, then Connection Indicators, then the Perf button. They are in the top row, next to the Perf name and Master Clock. Well, in my editor, they do not even show up.

The Editor behaves as if nothing is connected to it.
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deknow



Joined: Sep 15, 2004
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 18, 2007 7:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

...in the intrest of full documentation, i offer this story.

i had 2 engines (one was a demo unit, one was my own). my engine was setup for synthesis, the other for processing the flute.

one day at an informal rehersal, the flute engine would not work...i tried to connect the computer, and it would always return an error, and never was able to get it to work again (although i tried from time to time).

eventually, i sent it to nord usa for repair (remeber, i had an identical unit that worked fine with the computer). they got it on the bench, and found it to work just fine....i detailed my experience, and the tech "burned it in" for several days, and tried flexing the board, and was not able to get it to fail. i never had the chance to test it after that, but i would have heard about it if there was still a problem.

i still don't know what the problem was, but i do know there was a problem. the good news is that nord usa was _wonderful_, and the tech working on it called me several times while he had it, and was open to my suggestions/ideas.

deknow
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