The Beginner

[modernmike0005]

Hello,

I'm new here, and if this seems to amateur for you guys than I apologize. This is my first time on this site and my first post here so please bare with me...

Anyway, I would like to know what kind of equipment one would need to produce some decent quality synth without spending my entre years salary. Lets say you had absolutely no knowledge about making music whatsoever, (like me) and you only had a computer and a keyboard, (also like me). What would be the best synthesizer program to buy for a beginner. Or do I even buy software? Should I buy hardware instead? What are the pros and cons of using a computer program verse using a real synthesizer? These are all questions I have not been able to find answers to until now... I hope... Any advise that you may like to include would be appreciated.

[Uncle Krunkus]

Anybody could ramble on for pages about stuff which would be relevant to your question (although everyone has their biases ) I reckon the best way to get a good idea of what you want/need is to read through heaps of posts on this forum.
Download a copy of the G2 demo: -
http://www.clavia.se/products/nordmodular/demo.htm
That will teach you a bit about software synths, and a lot about hardware synths.
It's probably best to decide whether you're interested in making music, or building hardware for making music, as either one could easily take up all of your available time.
Don't hesitate to post some more specific questions when you get an idea of which way you'd like to go. We all started out in the vacuum of space!

[elektro80]

Reason ..latest version..
This is software. It is inexpensive, it works great and you can make music with it.

[modernmike0005]

I'm probably going to buy a software program anyway, because like you said it is relatively inexpensive. But are there were any disadvantages to using a computer program. I mean, if you could make a song on a 200 dollar program the same way you could on a 20,000 dollar machine, than why aren't they extinct. Is it just a hobbyist issue or is there really a difference in quality.
Also, I will defiantly download that program like Uncle Krunkus suggested because I have done that before and its good for learning the details. I downloaded the Ableton Live 5 demo and so far it has been an easy program to learn. I just can't seem to remember what each button and nob dose. But I am sure that will come with practise. The most important thing about these programs though, is choosing the right one. Is live 5 a good one to start with, or are there others that anyone would like to add that are better? What programs do you use and witch ones would you advise not using?
As always, Thank you for your support.

[elektro80]

Well, if you are a beginner then I recommend that you don´t spend much time considering if you really need a chateau of hardware synths.

You will have to learn several crafts. Something like Reason will give you access to both a simple studio production enviroment, synths and samplers. Next you will have to learn something about music and what you really want to do. That might take years and rest assured that you will most probably buy more fancy gear later.

There are alternatives to Reason of course, something like Garageband might be all you need right now.

Myself? I am using various macs and Logic. I have hardware synths and software synths. I even have a piano and a violin, some guitars and a african drum ( haven´t seen that one for years though ). I started out with tape recorders, organs, electric pianos and synths in the 70s.

[Uncle Krunkus]

As far as computer stuff goes, I use Tuareg to put drum loops together, Soundforge for general wav manipulation, I put everything together with Cakewalk (very old now) and master with T-racks. Reason (like Stein recommended) is a good replacement for Cakewalk (see also Cubase etc). I should really get it myself, but I'm stuck in a bit of a hardware building phase at the moment and haven't actually done much composition for a while.
Add other software tools around Reason as you find them, but learn that first.
As far as hardware is concerned, well, you could do strangely musical things and record them in Reason using a circuit which cost $10 to put together. On the other hand you could track down a classic old analogue like a Jupiter8 and spend thousands. Either way you may or may not use them to create sounds which you could create with software. It all depends on what you find fun to work with.
I'd say if you're a sonic kind of person who lives "in their head" go for software. If you're a sensate kind of person who is good with their hands, go for hardware. These are of course the black and white generalisations at either end of the scale, everybody is a shade of grey in between, but you know what I mean.

[Uncle Krunkus]

Oh, and try to find some info on basic music synthesis fundamentals. That will help either way, and you will feel alot more confident about tweaking controls, whether they be real or virtual.

[Mohoyoho]

I think electro80 is right. Reason would be the best place to start. It has everything you need to get up and running.

[elektro80]

Reason is a kind of vrtual stack of rack units. You can go out there and buy reasonably similar real hardware stuff ( but there are of course some modules that are unique to Reason ) but this will be really expensive even though you decided to go for secondhand gear. Brand new quality cables will probaly cost more than Reason alone. Thing is that unless you are really seasoned, Reason will make it easier to put together songs and record these compared to having a pile of lousy hardware synths filling up every corner in your apartment.. The really big investment would be learning how to make music and find your own way. A great start is to try too learn what your favorite acts are doing and kinda brak the code. When that is done you wil be first be a bit frustrated and then you will probably want to make music that sounds like your music. All this is both serious fun and a painful experience. It is possible to learn to enjoy both these sides of making music.

Uh, you might want to get Reason, a midi keyboard and an audio interface. I reckon you already have a decent computer.

[Isopolis]

Hello,

I am also a beginner and new to this site. I must say I really appreciate this forum. Since this is a recent thread I'm hoping it's okay to jump on and also ask some questions? If so, regarding the last few posts,

What is an audio interface?
Also, for a midi keyboard, is the oxygen 8 still a good choice? I see it's gone down in price from a few years back when I was told it was really good.
And, does Reason have a sampler; could I go record some live hand drum strokes or other audio and use the wav. or mp3 files as beats in the software?

Thanks much for any help, I might have more questions.

[elektro80]

It is a good choice to not use the computer´s built-in audio inputs and outputs. In order to record external audio sources you will need something like this:

http://www.motu.com/products/motuaudio/traveler/

or this:

http://www.apogeedigital.com/products/ensemble.php

or this:

http://www.m-audio.com/products/en_us/FireWire1814-main.html

and there are lotsa similar products out there.
Some use a PCI card ( or PCIE or whatever ) and have a breakout box.
Others connect using Firewire or USB2. Some will have at least one MIDI port.

Quality doesn´t already folloew price but in genereal the more expensive ones are better. The more expensive ones will also usually have more features and you might find a less expensive interface with less features but it might essentially be just as good ( audio quality that is. )

[Isopolis]

Thank you! So, is it necessary to have a MIDI card installed into your computer, or can you just use an audio interface with a USB connection, and have any MIDI devices connect into that? What exactly is an audio interface for? I understand you can plug mics into it.

also what do you think of this one:

http://www.zzounds.com/item--RLLGCI404

[elektro80]

That Rolls thinghie is a bit crude. This is the absolute low end and I really think you would want something a bit more modern.

[elektro80]

Many midi controllers have USB and those will connect directly to the computer.

[elektro80]

If you have a lot of midi devices then you would want something like the Steinberg Midex 8.

[blue hell]

[Uncle Krunkus]

I have to say that both Stein and Jan might have a bit more ideal situation in mind than others. If you don't have heaps of cash, like me, an Audigy ZS PCI sound card is capable of doing anything you want in the way of music. And if you convert anything to MP3 you will be throwing away the tiny bit of extra quality you get from $1000 external interfaces anyway.

[blue hell]

[Uncle Krunkus]

I do however agree that you should not use "on board" audio interfaces. They are the crappolescence of all sound options!! In fact I go out of my way to get MBs which don't have it. And stay away from on board video too!! Especially as you want your MB to have all available resources free for music.

[Antimon]

I had a Creative soundcard with a breakout box once, and it didn't take long for the volume pot to go rusty (or whatever it is they do) and crackle nastily when you turned it and eventually start to lose contact. So if you're going for standard computer brands you might want to check that there aren't any level dials between the digital-analog converter (DAC) and the main output.

This was a couple of years ago, so it might not be an issue with modern gear today.

/Stefan

[Isopolis]

Could anyone recommend a good lower-end midi controller? From what I've read the Oxygen 8 has some annoying problems, but the M-Audio Trigger Finger and the M-Audio Axiom's seem popular right now. What do you think? Thanks.

[paul e.]

personally i am coming to the conclusion that M-audio stuff is a bit...well, it will break ..soon after purchase....it's OK...does the job...kinda cheap..i won;t buy anything from them again, i doubt

[paul e.]

[klangumsetzer]

[v-un-v]