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Baby 10
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intosia



Joined: Mar 14, 2007
Posts: 14
Location: Netherlands

PostPosted: Sun Apr 08, 2007 1:24 pm    Post subject: Baby 10
Subject description: Some questions
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Im attempting to make the Baby10 sequencer (+ the WP-20). Looks pretty easy Very Happy But i have some questions.

- The diodes, what type is it? N914? Cant read it that clear Sad
- The CV and Pulse out, hoe does it work? In the scheme its 1 wire? I know it normaly is a jack, but doesnt it require 2 wires?

I know how it technically works but since my pure electronic knowledge isn't that good, i thought I'd ask.

Hope it makes sense... im kinda new into the analog music world, but it starting to make sense now Laughing

(full page: http://www.midiwall.com/gear/babyseq/pics/wholepage.jpg)


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Blue Hell
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 08, 2007 1:33 pm    Post subject: Re: Baby 10
Subject description: Some questions
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intosia wrote:
- The diodes, what type is it? N914?

That's what I make from it as well and it makes sense to use those. Edit : 1N914 it should be.

Quote:
- The CV and Pulse out, hoe does it work? In the scheme its 1 wire? I know it normaly is a jack, but doesnt it require 2 wires?


The other wire(s) would be the ground wire(s), it's not unusual to not draw it(those) in schematics.

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intosia



Joined: Mar 14, 2007
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 08, 2007 1:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Aah yes, the 1N914 that makes more sense Smile

About the wires it should more like this (attachment)?

And for the clock, can i use a simple 555 pulse generator, with a pot for the rate?


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Blue Hell
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 08, 2007 1:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

intosia wrote:
About the wires it should more like this (attachment)?
Exactly Very Happy

Quote:
And for the clock, can i use a simple 555 pulse generator, with a pot for the rate?


As long as it's fed from the same supply that should be no problem. The counter chip wouldn't like the clock to go higher than it's supply voltage.

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intosia



Joined: Mar 14, 2007
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 08, 2007 2:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Ok, thanks Jan for the help & tips, hope i get it to work, going to do some testing tomorrow Smile Otherwise ill be back Wink
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Blue Hell
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 08, 2007 2:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Good luck Exclamation
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intosia



Joined: Mar 14, 2007
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 16, 2007 8:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Im back Smile

Well I've done some testing and it suprissed me it actualy worked, haha Very Happy

I used Forestmims 555 timer notebook for the 'clock generator' and 'simple VCO' schematics.
(small movie: http://www.vimeo.com/clip:171147)

But i have two questions:

1) Part A on the image shows my current setup. Note the missing wires on the pots (see start post for full schematic). My question is, are those really needed? Since it works like i've drawn it...

2) Part B: In the schematic (original) it looks like the ground wire is connected to the diode (inside the red square). Ive also tested with this but when i did the LED on that output faded... So i guess thats wrong and i omited it. So, connect or not connect?

So basicly, the ground wire for the pots, whats the use of it? I cant seem to grasp the theory behind it Very Happy


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Blue Hell
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 16, 2007 8:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Good you got it working Very Happy

The dot in the red square makes no sense indeed.

The ground connections for the pots should be pressent though. When they are not the CV ouput voltage is not well defined and depends on the load connected to the CV output. Well it does so anyway with 100 k pots and no buffering I guess, but it will do even more so without the ground connections.

To make it better a fixed load with a buffer opamp could be added maybe.

I'd put in the ground connections and then see if any weird things would happen for the purpose in mind, and if so, then add a buffer thing.

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ciscothehellspawn



Joined: Oct 01, 2008
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 01, 2008 7:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I'm starting to build it today... I saw that this topic is too old, but I would like to know if there is more to know about the schematic I found at: midiwall.com

Thank you all very much! Wink
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RF



Joined: Mar 23, 2007
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 01, 2008 8:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Fonik has done a real nice redraw of the schematic with some nice additions here...

http://modular.fonik.de/baby10/baby10_sch.bmp

bruce
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ciscothehellspawn



Joined: Oct 01, 2008
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 01, 2008 8:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

thank you!

I would like to know if i can hook up the end of the 4017's exits to a deepswitch, and after to the reset pin. I would like to have 8 step reset switch. Is it possible to do?
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intosia



Joined: Mar 14, 2007
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 01, 2008 9:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Do you mean you want ony 8 steps? If so, you van connect the output (step) 9 from the 4017 to the reset pin of the 4017, so it starts again. You can add a rotary switch to select the steps you want to play. (Switch which step connected to the reset). No so good at explaining but its really simple.
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ciscothehellspawn



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PostPosted: Thu Oct 02, 2008 3:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

thank you guys! I did it! It works! Very Happy

only one strange thing... when I try to play, for example, only 4 steps, i hear: 1. 2. 3. 4 and then 2 or 3 beats out of the sequence! Shocked

I linked 4017's pin 15 with 9, and first to eight channel to pin 15 through a deepswitch.

Where's the error? Rolling Eyes
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stolenfat



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PostPosted: Thu Oct 30, 2008 11:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

can the baby 10 run off of a 9 volt battery?

Any special tweaking needed to do so?
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ciscothehellspawn



Joined: Oct 01, 2008
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 31, 2008 1:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

stolenfat wrote:
can the baby 10 run off of a 9 volt battery?

Any special tweaking needed to do so?


I'm not really expert... but I think you can keep it running until a 15v battery.


So... I've another question: If I would like to build more baby 10 with the same clock, which of the following way can I try?

1 - I can build 3 separate Baby 10 (for example) and one clock generator (555) that leads all sequencers.

2 - I build a sequancer with 10 steps, and then, if I would like to have another, I add 10 other steps at the same 4017's exits... and so on... I mean something like casper electronics sequencer, it has 8 steps and 4 channels
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stolenfat



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PostPosted: Fri Oct 31, 2008 11:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

i would prolly go about it by way of method 1.

But they will all step at the same time, not in sequence (you cant get a 30 step sequencer from chaining 3 baby10s together this way) I think you could just split the clock signal into 3 separate 4017, prolly use a diode there to keep things from getting weird. Or split the clock signal with a 'reverse mixer' op amp schematic to prevent the clock signal from breaking down as you split it.

Im in San francisco, im not sure where to get a 15volt battery, unless I chained a large amount of AA's together.

I have a new project im working on, a kind of semi mini modular with the baby 10 involved, every thing is running off of 9volts... just wanted to know if i could either use the baby10 off a 9 volt battery or just power everything off a 9volt power supply.
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amplex



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PostPosted: Thu May 21, 2009 10:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

my baby10 seems to make the same pitch on every beat (i am feeding it a 40106 clock and outputting the summed/dioded CV to a 40106 YAVCO).. are the pots supposed to control the pitch or just how much of that beat is in the signal (volume)?
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EdisonRex
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PostPosted: Sat May 30, 2009 1:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

amplex wrote:
my baby10 seems to make the same pitch on every beat (i am feeding it a 40106 clock and outputting the summed/dioded CV to a 40106 YAVCO).. are the pots supposed to control the pitch or just how much of that beat is in the signal (volume)?


I had to read this a couple of times, sorry. I still don't understand what the question is. The pots are supposed to output varying control voltages and your VCO should change pitch relative to those voltages. Is your problem that the pots don't work? If the LEDs light, you should have some voltage present... are you getting gate out? What voltage are you driving your baby10 with?

I guess I don't understand what it is you are hearing. "beats"?

Are the diodes in the right way, just wondering.

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amplex



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PostPosted: Sat May 30, 2009 3:13 pm    Post subject: Nandsynth + Baby8 = 'NB8' Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

well i got this idea from researching a few nand gate synths and a few baby10 sequencer schematics, and came up with the NB8 or NandBaby8, very similar to the SGMK nandsynth/sequencer, but changed in a few ways.. No schematics as of yet but its basically a bolt style patchable Baby10 permanately set to 8 or less steps (with reset in). I used a 4017 for the seq, 40106 for the int clock, 4093 for the nands, and an lm386 for amp/gain, all powered off a single 9v, and packed into a nice 4x7x4" stylish Laughing florescent green box. The controls are:

top:
8 steps on top (round 100k pots)
2 nand freq's (in the middle)
2 nand 'mixer' pots (the outside ones)


front:
8 red leds in the middle for which step sequencer is on
1 amber power led on left
main mixer pot between left and right nand controls (backwards doh, too lazy to fix =)
2 fixed LP/HP on/off for both nand channels (these do strange things to the sequencer so i dont use them much)


right side:
spdt switch on right to select which nand gate gets the sequencer cv out (both on one side of the switch, wired straight into the pots)
sequencer speed pot on right


left side:
on/off switch
int/ext clock switch (bolt on back for ext clock)
pot for pre gain/feedback on lm386
(hole where i was going to put a glide switch but didn't include yet)


back:
1/4" out
each sequencer step pulse out
sequencer summed cv out
clock out (int clock)
clock in (ext clock)
seq reset in
ground
(audio out bolt to be added soon, again too lazy to include so far)


so far the only major problems have been the fact that i used varying resistors on the leds because i didnt have enough low ohm ones (around 500) to work with these (i think) 12v leds.. but it made for an interesting sequencer pattern multiplier at least =] also the nand 'mix' pots have way too big a range, but its quick to turn them off and on this way. also i would use a rotary switch next time to allow for some more interesting combinations of where the sequencer interfaces with the nandsynth. right now its 1) middle lug of left nand 'mix' pot or 2) right lug of right nand freq pot (which barely affects sound). also the controls of the nand synth do strange things to the sequencer like slight speedups and slowdowns. this is undesirable, but the sound is affected in a very desireable way imo!! i've been recording and editing long sessions and cutting some samples for use in new tunes but havent got around to starting the tunes yet, going to document some of my work today and upload some video to youtube of a few things seperately and then together =] big huge thanks to dusjagr @ SGMK for the awesome idea, and as usual everyone on here for their helpful replies & entertainments Smile

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amplex



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PostPosted: Sat May 30, 2009 3:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

EdisonRex wrote:
I had to read this a couple of times, sorry. I still don't understand what the question is. The pots are supposed to output varying control voltages and your VCO should change pitch relative to those voltages. Is your problem that the pots don't work? If the LEDs light, you should have some voltage present... are you getting gate out? What voltage are you driving your baby10 with?

Sorry, haven't come back and let everyone know I figured it out, it was a problem with wiring on the pots, wasnt sure which one the wiper was, got it figured out on breadboard last week, but then by the time I soldered everything in together in the NB8, it is back to doing the same thing (due to how I routed the summed CVs into the nand synth.. oh well, the CV out still makes different pitches fine on a VCO, just all the pots are upside down.. noob mistake!) but its all for noise toys so it doesnt really matter, when you play with the thing you figure out what it does like a puzzle kind of Laughing the thing is powered with 9v, the led resistors make their own sequence (varying from 560 to 670 ohms, accidently used 12v leds)


EdisonRex wrote:

I guess I don't understand what it is you are hearing. "beats"?

'Beat' = step of the sequence.. sorry thought the context made sense but.. i am known for choosing words badly much of the time Laughing
EdisonRex wrote:

Are the diodes in the right way, just wondering.
Yup checked this many times to make sure. otherwise I wouldnt get anything on my CV out at all right? (or else just negative voltages blocked from exiting sum of step pots) .. hrm wonder how this would affect the CV out signal or if it would work @ all..
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EdisonRex
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PostPosted: Sat May 30, 2009 3:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Shocked Ok...

Why not post a clip of this thing in action? As pictures tell a story, so would the sounds... Wink

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amplex



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PostPosted: Sat May 30, 2009 3:40 pm    Post subject: 15 minutes of noize (NB8->VCO->AX30G efx proc) Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

ok i got a huge 15min mix of the sequencer going to my lunetta, and then effected by a korg ax30g guitar processor (some rev/delay/eq), just going to include a link to the whole thing for now (warning: 25 megs or so) .. there are some blatant cuts removing more uninteresting parts, and fades here and there where i first was cutting things. pretty inconsistant, aren't i? thank you coffee Laughing

the first couple minutes are going through interesting presets on the ax30g that i made, the rest is all nb8 manipulation on a preset which is basically reverb/delay/eq.. cool rhythmic sounds/glitches all coming from the sequencer.. starts getting cool around 2:10 or so imo, some boringness around 10minutes, then @ 10:38, really cool sound to sample, kinda like a trumpet or something! then around 11:00 we get to the cream of the crop as far as im concerned, pretty sequence with electrobugs in the background =]]

15 minutes of noize

enjoi

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Last edited by amplex on Sat May 30, 2009 4:21 pm; edited 1 time in total
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EdisonRex
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PostPosted: Sat May 30, 2009 3:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Glad you sorted it. It looks wild. Cool
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amplex



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PostPosted: Sat May 30, 2009 4:25 pm    Post subject: clock changes based on nandsynth controls .. Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

wish i could have fixed the sequencer part of it so the clock never wavers or changes based on whats happening with the rest of it, only (easy) way i can think that might fix that is run the 40106 off a seperate power/ground (another 9v or something)..

heres another quick (3min) sequence that starts where the other one left off, much shorter, same setup, nb8->yavco->ax30g

Take 2.. same setup, more noise, 3minutes, 5megs

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jukingeo



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PostPosted: Mon Jun 22, 2009 1:36 pm    Post subject: Re: Nandsynth + Baby8 = 'NB8' Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

amplex wrote:
well i got this idea from researching a few nand gate synths and a few baby10 sequencer schematics, and came up with the NB8 or NandBaby8, very similar to the SGMK nandsynth/sequencer, but changed in a few ways.. No schematics as of yet but its basically a bolt style patchable Baby10 permanately set to 8 or less steps (with reset in). I used a 4017 for the seq, 40106 for the int clock, 4093 for the nands, and an lm386 for amp/gain, all powered off a single 9v, and packed into a nice 4x7x4" stylish Laughing florescent green box. The controls are:


It looks like a Porcupine!
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