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 Forum index » DIY Hardware and Software » MusicFromOuterSpace.com designs by Ray Wilson
WSG Volume - connection problem
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asafnetzer



Joined: Jun 16, 2007
Posts: 112
Location: Israel

PostPosted: Fri Aug 24, 2007 4:40 am    Post subject:  WSG Volume - connection problem Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Hello

Well, I have breadboarded the WSG and it worked and have now hosted it in the stripboard layout and have a major volume - connection problem.
The volume is just too low unless I touch a connection on a potentiometer, only then does it output increase, and this goes to each and every pot on the board.
They all work and there is no solder bridges, I have added an on - off switch and a led to the board but even when I removed them it's still the same.
Any idea ?

Thanks and best regards,
Asaf
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asafnetzer



Joined: Jun 16, 2007
Posts: 112
Location: Israel

PostPosted: Fri Aug 24, 2007 10:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Ok, update

After looking at all the connections and checking everything again but finding nothing wrong I have spent all this afternoon to make one more, same stripboard layout and what do you know, same problem.
Bare in mind that this is a new area for me so I'm still learning but have not realized when went wrong in the process.

maybe something with grounding ? I really don't know, it's like I'm a connection in this layout, when i touch the pots they play load, same with touching some of the resistors on the board so I guess it's something with the voltage or grounding, but still have no idea how to fix it.

Asaf
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RF



Joined: Mar 23, 2007
Posts: 1502
Location: Northern Minnesota, USA
Audio files: 28

PostPosted: Fri Aug 24, 2007 3:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Hi asaf
We're not ignoring you...really Smile you just have not given us much information to help you.
Which version did you make? Did you just make the basic WSG or did you use the leftover inverters?
Did you add the filter?
Can you trace the circuit to a point where things start going wrong?
What sort of volume are you expecting? You understand it won't drive a speaker directly, right?

Any other unusual symptoms?

Good luck!

bruce
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asafnetzer



Joined: Jun 16, 2007
Posts: 112
Location: Israel

PostPosted: Fri Aug 24, 2007 10:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Hi bruce

Firstly, thanks for your reply.
Secondly, here are some clarifications -
I have made the stripboard layout that used all the potential from the CD40106 chip, photos attached.
Yes the filter is also in.
The WSG is driven through a mixer - preamp so there is no problem with that area, I can compare the sound to some APC's and cracklebox I have built.
I am just started electronics so a lot still don't make sense, learned alot but not enough, so trace what is wrong when I don't know what to look for is hard.

Here are the complete symptoms as far as I can see.
- when connected to power and to the amp there is only a buzz.
- touching the connection on the pots suddenly make the noise they intended to make.
- even if i touch just the wires without any pot connected it delivers sound, not as load or as accurate, still I am not with variable resistance myself.
- last, if I touch the resistors on the board I can get sound as well.

As much as it would be fun to make these WSG's with body contacts as the crackle box's I would really like to know what I did wrong.

Thanks and sorry for the long post.

Asaf.


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RF



Joined: Mar 23, 2007
Posts: 1502
Location: Northern Minnesota, USA
Audio files: 28

PostPosted: Sat Aug 25, 2007 7:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

OK asaf -
It's probably just one small problem - your work is very nice and it should be easy to troubleshoot with a logical approach.
Here is where I would start using "The Divide and Conquer method of troubleshooting"
Idea
The concept is to look at any complex circuit as just a bunch of small circuits tied together.
You want to verify what section is working...and what isn't.

First - mentally divide the circuit in two parts - oscillators and filter. (There is a built in 'test point' between those two sections at J1 if you added that) Take a listen there.
If you didn't add that part, cobble it in, or make a test probe for your amplifier...Ray talks about doing that on his site...

http://www.musicfromouterspace.com/analogsynth/oddsandends.html#AMPSIGNALTRACER

and then check the output at pin 2 of the CD40106. If everything sounds right at that point, then the problem is in the filter.

When you narrow down to filter or oscillators, then further divide those sections...ie. does it sound right at this point? how about here...That sort of thing.

good luck! We're still having fun, right?

bruce
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Randaleem



Joined: May 17, 2007
Posts: 456
Location: Northern CA, USA

PostPosted: Sat Aug 25, 2007 7:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Hi,

I am unfamiliarwith this stripboard layout, so this is just from looking at the pics, and the two apparent solder bridges may be intentional?

It looks like there is a solder bridge near pin 2 of the upper IC. Then move 4 holes down and 4 across to see another potential solder bridge?

Kind regards,

Randal
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asafnetzer



Joined: Jun 16, 2007
Posts: 112
Location: Israel

PostPosted: Thu Aug 30, 2007 12:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Hi,

Bruce, thanks for your help, I didn't have the time to deal with the WSG this week, too much work, Now I'm back with the fun.
O.k, fun talking, I have decided to use your advice and a strange thing happened, when I have plugged one of the WSG it worked, no changes, Nothing, I think it's a living creature, It's giving strange noises ( stranger then normal ) and I will now go on testing the other one ( he is still "sick" )
Would post pictures soon.
Thanks again,
Asaf.

Randaleem, thanks for posting a comment, all the solder bridges on the stripboard are intentional, when on the same strip it doesn't really count as a bridge, the copper strip is conducting all the way so you can call it a huge bridge.
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Wild Zebra



Joined: Apr 28, 2005
Posts: 806
Location: Ohio
Audio files: 5

PostPosted: Thu Aug 30, 2007 10:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Hello I think your misunderstanding Randell. The solder bridges he is talking about are jumping over to a parallel trace. Not on the same row.

-----------------------
/
-----------------------

this is very crude but you get the idea the slash (solder bridge) is connecting two traces together.

_________________
"your stripes are killer bro"
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asafnetzer



Joined: Jun 16, 2007
Posts: 112
Location: Israel

PostPosted: Thu Aug 30, 2007 11:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Wild Zebra wrote:
Hello I think your misunderstanding Randell. The solder bridges he is talking about are jumping over to a parallel trace. Not on the same row.

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/
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I guess I did misunderstand Randell, still there is no bridge just the angle of the shot ( it's a high soldering joint i didn't fix )
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Randaleem



Joined: May 17, 2007
Posts: 456
Location: Northern CA, USA

PostPosted: Thu Aug 30, 2007 12:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Wild Zebra, Thank you for clarifyng my words.

Nosferatu, Thank you for explaining it's just a camera angle. Here's another possibility?

The top connection of the pink jumper attached to pin 9 of the lower IC does not have the desirable soldered joint appearance in this picture?

Randal
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