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“quasi ¼ comma meantone bluesy”
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seraph
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2007 12:55 am    Post subject: “quasi ¼ comma meantone bluesy”
Subject description: 1/4 comma Insensatez
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The scale “quasi ¼ comma meantone bluesy” comes from a study of meantone scales. With LMSO I built a diatonic scale based on a chain of 7 perfect fifths starting on D each one smaller than 3/2 (701.955 cents) by a syntonic comma (81/80, 21.508 cents) split in 4. (21.508/4 = 5.377, 701.955 - 5.377 = 696.578 = ¼ comma meantone perfect fifth). If this does not make any sense don’t worry, anyway see the picture “1/4 comma diatonic”. The intervals are either 193.157 (yellow ones) or 117.108 cents (purple ones). It is a symmetric scale built on 2 different intervals.

arrow Listen to quasi 1/4 comma "Insensatez"


quarter comma diatonic.jpg
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quarter comma diatonic.jpg



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The man that hath no music in himself, nor is not mov'd with concord of sweet sounds, is fit for treasons, stratagems and spoils; the motions of his spirit are dull as night and his affections dark as Erebus: Let no such man be trusted. - W. Shakespeare

Last edited by seraph on Fri Mar 25, 2016 1:15 am; edited 9 times in total
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seraph
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2007 12:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I found this scale pleasant, so I decided to create a chromatic version of it splitting each 193.157 interval in 2 (193.157/2 = 96.5785 cents), see quasiquartercomma chromatic.jpg, again a symmetric scale built on 2 different intervals.


quasiquartercomma chromatic.jpg
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quasiquartercomma chromatic.jpg



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The man that hath no music in himself, nor is not mov'd with concord of sweet sounds, is fit for treasons, stratagems and spoils; the motions of his spirit are dull as night and his affections dark as Erebus: Let no such man be trusted. - W. Shakespeare

Last edited by seraph on Tue Sep 18, 2007 4:53 am; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2007 1:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

for those into this kind of crazy stuff I will add the I called it “quasi ¼ comma chromatic bluesy” because a real ¼ comma meantone cycle of 12 perfect fifths (each 696.578 cents) would look like the one in the “1/4 comma chromatic” picture, the famous Renaissance and Baroque tuning, that I find much uglier than mine!

In my scale (I say “mine” but it could have been discovered hundreds of years ago) major thirds are either 5/4 (386.314 cents) or 406.844 cents (very close to pythagoric ones, 407.82 cents), minor thirds are either 310.265 (close to 6/5, 315.64129 cents) or 289.736 (almost 13/11, 289.20972), perfect fifths are always 696.578 cents (the so called “generating interval”, see above, while the octave is the so called “folding interval”).

I am posting my “piano interpretation” of “Insensatez” (How Insensitive) by Antonio Carlos Jobim and Vinicius de Moraes, played using this tuning to let you know what I am talking about!


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The man that hath no music in himself, nor is not mov'd with concord of sweet sounds, is fit for treasons, stratagems and spoils; the motions of his spirit are dull as night and his affections dark as Erebus: Let no such man be trusted. - W. Shakespeare
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2007 1:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Heh carlo. I would have not thought to listen had you not bumped this.

I once tuned a piano in perfect fifths, because I could. It sounded very much like what you have, except I added proper beating for each note. My music professor was tolerant of the exercise, he let me play the piano for a couple of days then he asked me to please tune it properly now that I had my fun.

There are certain keys in this tuning that work great, and there are certain keys/modes that really sound different. have you tried playing on some of the odd modes?

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2007 1:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

EdisonRex wrote:
have you tried playing on some of the odd modes?

I have tried a few things on different keys. in general I would say this tuning sounds earthy, bluesy, unrefined (in a good way) to me.

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The man that hath no music in himself, nor is not mov'd with concord of sweet sounds, is fit for treasons, stratagems and spoils; the motions of his spirit are dull as night and his affections dark as Erebus: Let no such man be trusted. - W. Shakespeare
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2007 2:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Can you describe the unrefined-ness? I always thought of it as more refined, in certain keys, but really jarring in others. If you get afoul of the circle of fifths, as it relates to modes, I mean. Which is funny because in this scale you're theoretically even in the circle of fifths, sort of. Except it doesn't seem to work out when you hit the octave.

I envy you LMSO, and yeah I'll buy it soon when I have time to devote to it. You have to want to do something, and I can see you are having a blast with it.

No time yet, and less for a while.

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2007 3:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

EdisonRex wrote:
Can you describe the unrefined-ness?

maybe because of the long exposure to equal temperament, this scale sounds familiar because you can play almost any piece of the usual repertoire with it but, at the same time, it does not sound as "geometrically polished" as the ingeniously built 12tET. For me it's like comparing something built by hand with some mass-produced device (I usually prefer the former).

EdisonRex wrote:
I always thought of it as more refined, in certain keys, but really jarring in others.

You are right consonance-wise but the unevenness of intervals makes it more interesting and challenging.

EdisonRex wrote:
it doesn't seem to work out when you hit the octave.

Shocked all octaves are exactly 1200 cents.

EdisonRex wrote:
I envy you LMSO...


Very Happy

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The man that hath no music in himself, nor is not mov'd with concord of sweet sounds, is fit for treasons, stratagems and spoils; the motions of his spirit are dull as night and his affections dark as Erebus: Let no such man be trusted. - W. Shakespeare
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2007 11:20 am    Post subject: Re: “quasi ¼ comma meantone bluesy”
Subject description: 1/4 comma Insensatez
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seraph wrote:
quasi ¼ comma meantone...

according to Barbour's "Tuning and Temperament" this scale could be defined "mean-semitone" or "semi-meantone". I thought everyone was waiting for this detail.
Shocked

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The man that hath no music in himself, nor is not mov'd with concord of sweet sounds, is fit for treasons, stratagems and spoils; the motions of his spirit are dull as night and his affections dark as Erebus: Let no such man be trusted. - W. Shakespeare
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2007 2:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

well. Education is always good, you know. Wink
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 02, 2007 2:54 pm    Post subject: Re: “quasi ¼ comma meantone bluesy”
Subject description: 1/4 comma Insensatez
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seraph wrote:
seraph wrote:
quasi ¼ comma meantone...

according to Barbour's "Tuning and Temperament" this scale could be defined "mean-semitone" or "semi-meantone".

according to Jorgensen's Tuning: Containing the Perfection of Eighteenth-Century Temperament, the Lost Art of Nineteenth-Century Temperament and the Science of Equal Temperament, semi-meantone is synonym of equal-tempered.
Rolling Eyes

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The man that hath no music in himself, nor is not mov'd with concord of sweet sounds, is fit for treasons, stratagems and spoils; the motions of his spirit are dull as night and his affections dark as Erebus: Let no such man be trusted. - W. Shakespeare
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