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 Forum index » Discussion » Diversity in electro-music
women or lgbtq people doing diy?
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EdisonRex
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2007 4:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Kassen wrote:
Edison; very good.


Yes, well, I am also reminded of the Dream VCO thread where we had to get through our subjective commentary before we got into what features might make something sound good.

I like some of that boom boom shakalaka stuff too, but I can certainly understand where it can get tiring. Another win for the concept of electronic coffeehouses.

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2007 10:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

yeah, i'm talking about the "it's raining men" 58776967 times in a row thing. in my brain i file this and similar songs under "vacuous, geared towards instant gratification, actively trying to curtail meaningful life experiences."

what i would consider to be good music at a gay (or any) club:

1. genuinely expressive
2. encourages participation (like setting up something where people could play the music themselves, or making something that people feel compelled to react to in some way by dancing, booing, whatever)
3. reflects some kind of life experience that people have lived/felt

and before everybody gets all nutty, this is *my opinion.* so yes, i know that what is "genuinely expressive" to me might be ridiculous to someone else. just giving my thoughts.

christ, am i already getting cornered into defending myself against any possible criticisms of what i have said? i hate it when things turn out like that...

note to self: don't allow others to manipulate you into that!
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2007 10:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Kassen wrote:

To bring this back to the topic; To me one of the prime attractions to DIY is making stuff that's unlike what's already on the market. I find this works a lot better with less labelling.


How does one make a product that it is unlike everything out there on the market known to others, without labeling it as being different?
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 28, 2007 3:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

liquidpaper wrote:
yeah, i'm talking about the "it's raining men" 58776967 times in a row thing. in my brain i file this and similar songs under "vacuous, geared towards instant gratification, actively trying to curtail meaningful life experiences."

what i would consider to be good music at a gay (or any) club:

1. genuinely expressive
2. encourages participation (like setting up something where people could play the music themselves, or making something that people feel compelled to react to in some way by dancing, booing, whatever)
3. reflects some kind of life experience that people have lived/felt

and before everybody gets all nutty, this is *my opinion.* so yes, i know that what is "genuinely expressive" to me might be ridiculous to someone else. just giving my thoughts.

christ, am i already getting cornered into defending myself against any possible criticisms of what i have said? i hate it when things turn out like that...

note to self: don't allow others to manipulate you into that!


No need to be defensive. I asked for your opinion. Thanks for sharing it.

I actually agree with your summary too. Genuine expressiveness is, in my opinion, not subjective - we're having another discussion nearby regarding feeling music vs. thinking music. I think this is a related concept. The best artists evoke emotions.

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 28, 2007 4:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

cappy2112 wrote:
Kassen wrote:

To bring this back to the topic; To me one of the prime attractions to DIY is making stuff that's unlike what's already on the market. I find this works a lot better with less labelling.


How does one make a product that it is unlike everything out there on the market known to others, without labeling it as being different?


Sorry, I was talking about a DIY development process, not about a marketing one.

You can have designs that can act as oscillators or wave-shapers or filters and I feel it would be less stimulating to call it either of those too early on in the process. Picking one of those names will lead to a changed perspective and so potentially subconsciously closing off options. See the similarities?

Once you start marketing you may be forced to pick one of those in order to even engage a audience, but that's also basically the same as what we already saw.

Interesting here is that some manufacturers (Buchla comes to mind) mostly ignore terms like that anyway. Also good is Serge's "Dual Universal Slope Generator", the USG completely sidesteps normal behaviour so it has it's own name and if you want to do anything with it you'll have to get up close&personal with it. It can act (more or less) as a LFO, Envelope, Oscillator, filter (well, a weird one), waveshaper (arguably) noise generator or even logic processor (at least so I heard, never managed that myself). So, not a normal module, doesn't fit the normal categories, giving it a normal name would be sad.

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 28, 2007 4:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

liquidpaper wrote:

what i would consider to be good music at a gay (or any) club:

1. genuinely expressive
2. encourages participation (like setting up something where people could play the music themselves, or making something that people feel compelled to react to in some way by dancing, booing, whatever)
3. reflects some kind of life experience that people have lived/felt


I wanted to write about this earlier but the politics got in the way.

In the 60's and 70's Finish artist Kurenniemi build a series of experimental digital instruments amongst which was a instrument called the "sexaphone" meant to be played by four participants who controlled tones by touching eachother's skin.

Sadly information online is kinda sparse on him and I couldn't find a good link on that speciffic instrument. There is a good DVD on him called "the dawn of dimi" featuring a documentary called "The future is not what it used to be" as well as a performance and more in depth information on his instrument designs.

Not gay as such per-se but it does seem to fit all of your criteria and then some. Sadly it's the only thing I can think off that does to such a extent. Michel Waisvisz build and performed on comparable instruments but as far as I know for two people max so that's a bit different in this context and not so much aimed at group interaction.

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 28, 2007 3:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

EdisonRex wrote:
No need to be defensive. I asked for your opinion. Thanks for sharing it.


yeah, sorry.. i got a little nutty. apologies!
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 28, 2007 3:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

what projects is everyone working on? doesn't matter what your gender/sexual orientation is. if you feel like talking about it, fine.. if not, that's swell too. i talked about myself in the initial post of this thread.

as for myself, i picked up this phone as a pawn shop. it's a "modern" phone, but has the look of an old phone, like this:

Posted Image, might have been reduced in size. Click Image to view fullscreen.

first, i'd like to learn some more about how phones work (i'm at the level where i know the basic deal: wires, switch, speaker, mic, coil thing... i'll figure out how the dialing works). anyone know any good resources for this? anyway, after i learn how it works, i'd like to modify it into some kind of bleepy bloopy thing. i might just install a light into the ear part and put some light sensors along the "body" of the phone so that you can flash the light on them. anyone have any other ideas for this?

i have a bunch of other ideas for projects, but i have problems with the whole start-continue-finish thing. usually i do start-continue-start something else-continue-start another thing-continue-etc.
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 28, 2007 4:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Here? Very Happy
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 30, 2007 11:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Good link for US/UK, but doesn't say much for Venus Telephony Company. Or other countries/planets (NOPE IT'S NOT ALL THE SAME!)
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 31, 2007 11:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

jksuperstar wrote:
Good link for US/UK, but doesn't say much for Venus Telephony Company. Or other countries/planets (NOPE IT'S NOT ALL THE SAME!)


I once used Soundforge to synthesise DTMF tones, then used this to make a international call on a phone with a broken keyboard but for Venus I suppose more heavy duty synthesis may be needed...

;¬)

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 02, 2008 11:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Just a bit of history. The prime reason that the DSP chip was invented/developed by Bell Labs and NEC was as a DTMF transmitter and receiver. Analog designs were too expensive and not stable/reliable.
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 03, 2008 7:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

This thread is really timely for me because I'm bisexual, but smokris and I have recently started planning to marry, so I'm coming to grips with what it means to be bisexual but in a permanently monogamous hetero relationship.

To me, questioning gender and sexuality is one of the main reasons to make art. I heard LeTigre for the first time when I was a freshman in college, and "gone b4 yr home" and "tres bien" really, really impressed me. I know that's more feminism than sexual orientation-related, although LeTigre includes a trans man so I don't know where I was going with this, but we love tangents here, right?

Semi-relatedly, I gave bernat a voice changer toy for Christmukah this year and it has options "Old man", "Robot", "Boy", and "Kid". Apparently boy and kid are mutually exclusive? It surprised me in that it was a bit of a reversal of the setup of "normative vs. deviation" that usually assumes more generic=male. In other words, I would have expected "girl" and "kid" to have been considered different categories, rather than "boy" and "kid".

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 04, 2008 8:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

bbinkovitz wrote:
This thread is really timely for me because I'm bisexual, but smokris and I have recently started planning to marry, so I'm coming to grips with what it means to be bisexual but in a permanently monogamous hetero relationship.


Why would a marriage need to be monogamous? Depending on what statistics you believe (I like the ones based on the blood-groups of the children) many or most aren't.

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 04, 2008 9:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Kassen wrote:
bbinkovitz wrote:
This thread is really timely for me because I'm bisexual, but smokris and I have recently started planning to marry, so I'm coming to grips with what it means to be bisexual but in a permanently monogamous hetero relationship.


Why would a marriage need to be monogamous? Depending on what statistics you believe (I like the ones based on the blood-groups of the children) many or most aren't.


It doesn't have to be hetero either, but ours is.

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 04, 2008 3:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

bbinkovitz wrote:

Semi-relatedly, I gave bernat a voice changer toy for Christmukah this year and it has options "Old man", "Robot", "Boy", and "Kid". Apparently boy and kid are mutually exclusive? It surprised me in that it was a bit of a reversal of the setup of "normative vs. deviation" that usually assumes more generic=male. In other words, I would have expected "girl" and "kid" to have been considered different categories, rather than "boy" and "kid".


yeah, that's pretty surprising. what does the "kid" voice sound like, and what does the "boy" voice sound like?

i thought you were going to say it had a voice called "gay," which would've been pretty awesome/funny. that's a neat idea - i should make a voice changer that adds the gay male lisp to people's voices.

hehehe
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 04, 2008 3:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

liquidpaper wrote:
bbinkovitz wrote:

Semi-relatedly, I gave bernat a voice changer toy for Christmukah this year and it has options "Old man", "Robot", "Boy", and "Kid". Apparently boy and kid are mutually exclusive? It surprised me in that it was a bit of a reversal of the setup of "normative vs. deviation" that usually assumes more generic=male. In other words, I would have expected "girl" and "kid" to have been considered different categories, rather than "boy" and "kid".


yeah, that's pretty surprising. what does the "kid" voice sound like, and what does the "boy" voice sound like?

i thought you were going to say it had a voice called "gay," which would've been pretty awesome/funny. that's a neat idea - i should make a voice changer that adds the gay male lisp to people's voices.

hehehe


yeah, you could put it in that phone!

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 04, 2008 3:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

EdisonRex wrote:
liquidpaper wrote:
bbinkovitz wrote:

Semi-relatedly, I gave bernat a voice changer toy for Christmukah this year and it has options "Old man", "Robot", "Boy", and "Kid". Apparently boy and kid are mutually exclusive? It surprised me in that it was a bit of a reversal of the setup of "normative vs. deviation" that usually assumes more generic=male. In other words, I would have expected "girl" and "kid" to have been considered different categories, rather than "boy" and "kid".


yeah, that's pretty surprising. what does the "kid" voice sound like, and what does the "boy" voice sound like?

i thought you were going to say it had a voice called "gay," which would've been pretty awesome/funny. that's a neat idea - i should make a voice changer that adds the gay male lisp to people's voices.

hehehe


yeah, you could put it in that phone!


awesome. another great application might be to sneak it into a megaphone being used by an ultra-macho, robocop-type policeman or football coach.
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 04, 2008 3:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

liquidpaper wrote:
EdisonRex wrote:
liquidpaper wrote:
bbinkovitz wrote:

Semi-relatedly, I gave bernat a voice changer toy for Christmukah this year and it has options "Old man", "Robot", "Boy", and "Kid". Apparently boy and kid are mutually exclusive? It surprised me in that it was a bit of a reversal of the setup of "normative vs. deviation" that usually assumes more generic=male. In other words, I would have expected "girl" and "kid" to have been considered different categories, rather than "boy" and "kid".


yeah, that's pretty surprising. what does the "kid" voice sound like, and what does the "boy" voice sound like?

i thought you were going to say it had a voice called "gay," which would've been pretty awesome/funny. that's a neat idea - i should make a voice changer that adds the gay male lisp to people's voices.

hehehe


yeah, you could put it in that phone!


awesome. another great application might be to sneak it into a megaphone being used by an ultra-macho, robocop-type policeman or football coach.


That sounds like something out of a Gilbert Shelton cartoon. It would beat those idiot Aqua Teen Hunger Force amateurs.

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 04, 2008 9:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

bbinkovitz wrote:
smokris and I have recently started planning to marry,


Congratulations.

Juli and I have been married for 37 years as of last week. If you love each other and are committed to each other marriage can be a beautiful and very fulfilling experience, even if at times it can be very painful.

I wish for you all the happiness in the world.

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 07, 2008 8:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

mosc wrote:
bbinkovitz wrote:
smokris and I have recently started planning to marry,


Congratulations.

Juli and I have been married for 37 years as of last week. If you love each other and are committed to each other marriage can be a beautiful and very fulfilling experience, even if at times it can be very painful.

I wish for you all the happiness in the world.


Thanks! We hope to still be electro-musicking together 37 years from now too!

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2008 8:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

well, so far one person has answered in the affirmative to my original question (and thanks by the way). there can't be only two of us. or, i should say: i really hope there's more than two of us.

helloooooo out there..
*crickets chirping*
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2008 9:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Does only hardware DIY count? There is software DIY too... ChucK, SuperCollider. I'm G, used to be more Q but couplehood mellows me. I don't get along with soldering irons though... more comfortable with branches and loops, classes, methods and signal flow graphs.

James

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PostPosted: Sat Jan 12, 2008 1:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

dewdrop_world wrote:
Does only hardware DIY count? There is software DIY too... ChucK, SuperCollider. I'm G, used to be more Q but couplehood mellows me. I don't get along with soldering irons though... more comfortable with branches and loops, classes, methods and signal flow graphs.

James


yeah, diy software counts. the only reason i didn't mention anything about it is because i know nothing about it Very Happy .

does anyone know any lgbtq (yes, i'm using that term again.. work with me here) musicians that are doing diy stuff? i'd like to look them up. it'd be nice to feel as though there are a few kindred souls out there.
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 12, 2008 2:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

As far as Synth DIY is concerned, I can be gay if you like.

BTW Some people around here seem to believe that I recently got married, to a woman, but they don't know what they're talking about. Wink Very Happy

BTBTW I'm not meaning to take the piss, just being silly. Smile

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