electro-music.com   Dedicated to experimental electro-acoustic
and electronic music
 
    Front Page  |  Articles  |  Radio
 |  Media  |  Forum  |  Wiki  |  Links  |  Store
Forum with support of Syndicator RSS
 FAQFAQ   CalendarCalendar   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   LinksLinks
 RegisterRegister   ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in  Chat RoomChat Room 
Live streaming at radio.electro-music.com

  host / artist show at your time

poster

Please visit the chat
 Forum index » DIY Hardware and Software
The Threeler
Post new topic   Reply to topic Moderators: jksuperstar, Scott Stites, Uncle Krunkus
Page 4 of 10 [246 Posts]
View unread posts
View new posts in the last week
Mark the topic unread :: View previous topic :: View next topic
Goto page: Previous 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10 Next
Author Message
janvanvolt



Joined: Nov 24, 2005
Posts: 285
Location: Mainz, Germany

PostPosted: Mon May 05, 2008 8:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Well. that was it. Tantalums... replaced with normal elco caps, no short anymore.

testing now.

Update: Filter now working over expectation. holy crap !

_________________
Homepage - http://www.czmok.de
My dIY - http://diy.czmok.de
Film/Music - http://gfm.me
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website AIM Address
frijitz



Joined: May 04, 2007
Posts: 1733
Location: NM USA
Audio files: 54

PostPosted: Mon May 05, 2008 12:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

unit-sound wrote:
Well. that was it. Tantalums... replaced with normal elco caps, no short anymore.

cheers
Ah, very good. Thanks andrew!

Very Happy

Ian
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
andrewF



Joined: Dec 29, 2006
Posts: 1176
Location: australia
Audio files: 4

PostPosted: Mon May 05, 2008 7:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Smile
What is it with Tant.caps?

they seem so sensitive, but to what? voltage spikes, reverse voltage?

I certainly won't bother using them in synth ccts anymore, I need components that can handle my luddite tendencies.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
RF



Joined: Mar 23, 2007
Posts: 1501
Location: Northern Minnesota, USA
Audio files: 28

PostPosted: Tue May 06, 2008 5:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Tantalums are sensitive to reverse voltage...

I use tantalum caps in my modules quite often. (I scrounge them from scrapped equipment) I don't recall ever having a problem with them...

bruce
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Blue Hell
Site Admin


Joined: Apr 03, 2004
Posts: 22817
Location: The Netherlands, Enschede
Audio files: 231
G2 patch files: 319

PostPosted: Tue May 06, 2008 12:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

One could consider ceramic caps now they are becoming available with larger capacitance values.
_________________
Jan
also .. please don't march .. we are on a bridge right now.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
janvanvolt



Joined: Nov 24, 2005
Posts: 285
Location: Mainz, Germany

PostPosted: Sun May 25, 2008 7:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Hi,

a finally got my panel from Schaeffer earlier last week so i finished all cabling today.

I just observed one strangeness (which somebody could help me out with):

- When switching modes with the rotary, i seem to have a short "short" in the whole power rail. not sure if it is +15 or -15V. besdies that the filter is working.

no other tantalums in the circuit, so i definitely can rule this one out.

ideas anyone ?

_________________
Homepage - http://www.czmok.de
My dIY - http://diy.czmok.de
Film/Music - http://gfm.me
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website AIM Address
guitarfool



Joined: Feb 26, 2007
Posts: 156
Location: Maryland
Audio files: 8

PostPosted: Sun May 25, 2008 7:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

unit-sound wrote:
When switching modes with the rotary, i seem to have a short "short" in the whole power rail. not sure if it is +15 or -15V. besdies that the filter is working.


You're probably using a "make before break" rotary switch. As it is rotated, it connects the wiper with the next contact before disconnecting with the previous one. Since the rotary switch in the Threeler selects alternately from V+ and ground, you're getting momentary shorts between V+ and ground.

Not all rotary switches are this type, but many are. Usually (like when switching between audio sources) it is a good thing. But not in this case Shocked

Anyone who hasn't built theirs yet (like me) should take this as a "heads up". Very Happy
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
janvanvolt



Joined: Nov 24, 2005
Posts: 285
Location: Mainz, Germany

PostPosted: Mon May 26, 2008 10:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Any idea if i can put in CAPs to limit the short ? (e.g. ground connection?)
final solution might be another switch.

_________________
Homepage - http://www.czmok.de
My dIY - http://diy.czmok.de
Film/Music - http://gfm.me
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website AIM Address
guitarfool



Joined: Feb 26, 2007
Posts: 156
Location: Maryland
Audio files: 8

PostPosted: Mon May 26, 2008 11:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

unit-sound wrote:
Any idea if i can put in CAPs to limit the short ? (e.g. ground connection?)
final solution might be another switch.


You might try a current limiting resistor between V+ and the switch. I would think something like at least 1k might work. 1k would give you a current of 0.015 amps at a power dissipation of 0.225 watts (although briefly). Too large a resistor might cause the voltage at A0 and A1 to be too low. I haven't looked at a spec sheet for the DG409.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
frijitz



Joined: May 04, 2007
Posts: 1733
Location: NM USA
Audio files: 54

PostPosted: Mon May 26, 2008 1:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

unit-sound wrote:
- When switching modes with the rotary, i seem to have a short "short" in the whole power rail. not sure if it is +15 or -15V.
Unit --

Thanks for bringing that up. Yes, you need a break-before-make switch. Alternately, you can probably put a 10k resistor in series with either the V+ line or the ground line. I should have thought of that. Embarassed

Very Happy

Ian
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Funky40



Joined: Sep 24, 2005
Posts: 875
Location: Swiss
Audio files: 1
G2 patch files: 5

PostPosted: Mon May 26, 2008 3:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

and which ones are break bevore break switches ?
which would be the right ones from mouser ? ( locally i can get Lorlin, are those fine? )
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
janvanvolt



Joined: Nov 24, 2005
Posts: 285
Location: Mainz, Germany

PostPosted: Mon May 26, 2008 4:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Funky40 wrote:
and which ones are break bevore break switches ?
which would be the right ones from mouser ? ( locally i can get Lorlin, are those fine? )


never mind about the switch.
i now soldered a 10K in series to ground and the problem is no longer existant.

Thanks Ian for the Hell of a filter Smile

_________________
Homepage - http://www.czmok.de
My dIY - http://diy.czmok.de
Film/Music - http://gfm.me
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website AIM Address
guitarfool



Joined: Feb 26, 2007
Posts: 156
Location: Maryland
Audio files: 8

PostPosted: Mon May 26, 2008 4:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Funky40 wrote:
and which ones are break bevore break switches ?
which would be the right ones from mouser ?


the Alpha rotary 2P4T is Mouser part number 105-SR2511F-34NS
The "NS" stands for non-shorting, (break before make) as opposed to shorting, designated by a part number ending in just "S".

There's also the Alpha plastic enclosed type, Mouser part number 105-SR2611F-34-38RN. Both of these have round shafts and solder terminals (not PCB mount).

I prefer the 1st type myself.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
frijitz



Joined: May 04, 2007
Posts: 1733
Location: NM USA
Audio files: 54

PostPosted: Mon May 26, 2008 7:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

unit-sound wrote:
never mind about the switch.
i now soldered a 10K in series to ground and the problem is no longer existant.


Good, thanks! I thought that would work, but I haven't actually tried it.

Very Happy

Ian
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Funky40



Joined: Sep 24, 2005
Posts: 875
Location: Swiss
Audio files: 1
G2 patch files: 5

PostPosted: Tue May 27, 2008 3:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

guitarfool wrote:
the Alpha rotary 2P4T is Mouser part number 105-SR2511F-34NS
The "NS" stands for non-shorting, (break before make) as opposed to shorting, designated by a part number ending in just "S".
.

thanks, it came just in the right moment.
I also was not aware that there are shortening and non shortening types.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
jnuaury



Joined: Feb 28, 2008
Posts: 161
Location: chicago
Audio files: 9

PostPosted: Thu Jun 05, 2008 3:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

does anybody want to show off their front panel for this?

ive been really interested in this bad boy but i think i need to see how much front panel real estate it takes up
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message AIM Address
Etaoin



Joined: Jun 30, 2005
Posts: 761
Location: Utrecht, NL

PostPosted: Tue Jun 10, 2008 1:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

My Threeler appears go work great, although the (2)134's are running warm. Are they supposed to?
_________________
http://www.casia.org/modular/
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website MSN Messenger
frijitz



Joined: May 04, 2007
Posts: 1733
Location: NM USA
Audio files: 54

PostPosted: Tue Jun 10, 2008 2:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Etaoin wrote:
My Threeler appears go work great, although the (2)134's are running warm. Are they supposed to?


I don't remember them running warm, but I may not have checked carefully. Are they clipping against the rails when they get warm? Are they always warm, even with low feedback?

Unfortunately, I don't have one set up right now. I'll try to check this later in the week.

Very Happy

Ian
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Etaoin



Joined: Jun 30, 2005
Posts: 761
Location: Utrecht, NL

PostPosted: Tue Jun 10, 2008 11:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Hehe, something is very wrong with mine. The res pot just went up in flames! I turned it slightly from zero on up and a big flame burst out of the side. Haven't seen that since I first began in electronics some 25 years ago Very Happy Back to my workbench...
_________________
http://www.casia.org/modular/
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website MSN Messenger
Etaoin



Joined: Jun 30, 2005
Posts: 761
Location: Utrecht, NL

PostPosted: Tue Jun 10, 2008 11:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Okay, found it. I'm using pcb-mount Alphas. But if you mount those flush with the pcb, the pads on the pot are actually touching the extra two holes and causing shorts. A short from +15V to the wiper burned out the pot. So you need to mount Alphas slightly off the board (or isolate those extra holes).
_________________
http://www.casia.org/modular/
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website MSN Messenger
Blue Hell
Site Admin


Joined: Apr 03, 2004
Posts: 22817
Location: The Netherlands, Enschede
Audio files: 231
G2 patch files: 319

PostPosted: Wed Jun 11, 2008 6:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Etaoin wrote:
[...]a big flame burst out of the side.


You seem to have a /power/ supply Laughing

_________________
Jan
also .. please don't march .. we are on a bridge right now.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
frijitz



Joined: May 04, 2007
Posts: 1733
Location: NM USA
Audio files: 54

PostPosted: Wed Jun 11, 2008 7:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Etaoin wrote:
Okay, found it. I'm using pcb-mount Alphas. But if you mount those flush with the pcb, the pads on the pot are actually touching the extra two holes and causing shorts. A short from +15V to the wiper burned out the pot. So you need to mount Alphas slightly off the board (or isolate those extra holes).

Ouch! You're saying the little legs on the slider terminal are hitting the pads for the smaller size pot? I'm not sure what I can do about that -- the board is layed out to accept two pot sizes.

Very Happy

Ian
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
bridechamber



Joined: Oct 06, 2007
Posts: 64
Location: Saint Paul, MN

PostPosted: Wed Jun 11, 2008 8:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I just tried trimming those little stops on the middle pin with a wire cutter, and that worked pretty well. Sorry it's necessary, though; that's one I never would have thought of.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
RF



Joined: Mar 23, 2007
Posts: 1501
Location: Northern Minnesota, USA
Audio files: 28

PostPosted: Sat Jun 21, 2008 9:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

jnuaury wrote:
does anybody want to show off their front panel for this?

ive been really interested in this bad boy but i think i need to see how much front panel real estate it takes up


Such as it is - here's mine. Just fits on a 2 1/4 by 8 1/2 inch panel.
I left off the fine-tune for the frequency. May have been a bit crowded with it.

Just finished it tonight so have not played with it much yet - just a few tests to make sure all was good. It's quite an interesting/unusual filter....

props to Scott at Bridechamber for the parts kit and board. Everything was perfect.

Ian, it's a crazy/nifty filter thumleft - thanks for sharing it.

bruce


resized_Picture 010.jpg
 Description:
 Filesize:  70.83 KB
 Viewed:  273 Time(s)
This image has been reduced to fit the page. Click on it to enlarge.

resized_Picture 010.jpg



resized_Picture 011.jpg
 Description:
 Filesize:  76.26 KB
 Viewed:  268 Time(s)
This image has been reduced to fit the page. Click on it to enlarge.

resized_Picture 011.jpg


Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Etaoin



Joined: Jun 30, 2005
Posts: 761
Location: Utrecht, NL

PostPosted: Thu Jun 26, 2008 6:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

This is my low budget Threeler panel. I left out the fine tune pot as well. Size is double Frac. Need to find another knob for the switch!


threeler.jpg
 Description:
Threeler low budget panel
 Filesize:  66.82 KB
 Viewed:  235 Time(s)
This image has been reduced to fit the page. Click on it to enlarge.

threeler.jpg



_________________
http://www.casia.org/modular/
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website MSN Messenger
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic Moderators: jksuperstar, Scott Stites, Uncle Krunkus
Page 4 of 10 [246 Posts]
View unread posts
View new posts in the last week
Goto page: Previous 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10 Next
Mark the topic unread :: View previous topic :: View next topic
 Forum index » DIY Hardware and Software
Jump to:  

You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum
e-m mkii

Please support our site. If you click through and buy from
our affiliate partners, we earn a small commission.


Forum with support of Syndicator RSS
Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group
Copyright © 2003 through 2009 by electro-music.com - Conditions Of Use