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 Forum index » DIY Hardware and Software
PCB layout for Ian Fritz' AD/AR EG
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frijitz



Joined: May 04, 2007
Posts: 1712
Location: NM USA
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 1:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Coriolis wrote:
Will there be boardmounting of pots?

Ooooohhhh yes. All four in a row, typical MOTM configuration.

Very Happy

Ian
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Adam-V



Joined: Jan 29, 2007
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 4:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

frijitz wrote:
synthmonger wrote:
Anything against using a 500k-2M pot for attack?

No, nothing against it if you need long attack times. The only issue will be that you will loose resolution at the low end.

Very Happy

Ian


I haven't looked at this circuit at all so feel free to shoot me down in flames but instead of using a larger pot, why not add a range switch and switch in some series resistors that are multiples of the existing pot? I reckon that would allow you to keep the low end resolution and give you the extended times you're after. You do need more panel real estate for this though.

Cheers,
Adam-V

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frijitz



Joined: May 04, 2007
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Location: NM USA
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 5:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Adam-V wrote:
I haven't looked at this circuit at all so feel free to shoot me down in flames but instead of using a larger pot, why not add a range switch and switch in some series resistors that are multiples of the existing pot? I reckon that would allow you to keep the low end resolution and give you the extended times you're after. You do need more panel real estate for this though.

Sure, why not, if that's what you want.

Very Happy

Ian
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Fetafarmer



Joined: Jul 29, 2007
Posts: 32

PostPosted: Thu Jul 09, 2009 11:27 am    Post subject: Ian Fritz AD/AR (Bridechamber) Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Hi everyone,

Recently finished a dual build of Ian's AD/AR, using a pair of the Bridechamber PCBs. The pulse shapers' outputs are normalled to the EG inputs at the jacks, so that I can use both parts of the circuit independently if I need to. I added the truncation circuitry back from Ian's original version (only 2 diodes, so I'm not sure why the option isn't available on the PCB). Also added an LED each to display the EGs' outputs. Total depth behind the panel is only 3cm : )

I've been needing this exact setup in my system forever, and I'm so happy to finally have it that I'll probably follow the advice in the documentation and build another dual set : )

Thank you, Ian, for providing this great little circuit. And sorry that my camera has no dynamic range whatsoever!

Cheers,
Kevin


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DGTom



Joined: Dec 08, 2008
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 09, 2009 5:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Shocked

Wow! Work of art! I love the condensed Buchla look! (are those knobs readily availible? I've seen them a few times in the last few days)

a quad would be super nice!
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parasitk



Joined: Sep 21, 2008
Posts: 69
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 09, 2009 5:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

DGTom wrote:
Shocked

Wow! Work of art! I love the condensed Buchla look! (are those knobs readily availible? I've seen them a few times in the last few days)

a quad would be super nice!


They look like they could be these?: http://www.alliedelec.com/Search/ProductDetail.aspx?SKU=5431916&MPN=1913BW

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frijitz



Joined: May 04, 2007
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Location: NM USA
Audio files: 54

PostPosted: Thu Jul 09, 2009 6:28 pm    Post subject: Re: Ian Fritz AD/AR (Bridechamber) Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Fetafarmer wrote:
Recently finished a dual build of Ian's AD/AR, using a pair of the Bridechamber PCBs. The pulse shapers' outputs are normalled to the EG inputs at the jacks, so that I can use both parts of the circuit independently if I need to. I added the truncation circuitry back from Ian's original version....

I've been needing this exact setup in my system forever, and I'm so happy to finally have it that I'll probably follow the advice in the documentation and build another dual set : )

Thanks for the report. Glad it works OK for you. Do you find the truncation switch useful? I left it off because it didn't seem to be working the way I thought it would. Embarassed

Very Happy

Ian
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Fetafarmer



Joined: Jul 29, 2007
Posts: 32

PostPosted: Fri Jul 10, 2009 6:58 am    Post subject: Re: Ian Fritz AD/AR (Bridechamber) Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

frijitz wrote:

Thanks for the report. Glad it works OK for you. Do you find the truncation switch useful? I left it off because it didn't seem to be working the way I thought it would. Embarassed

Very Happy

Ian


This was the last module to get completed before tearing down my synth in preparation for a big move, so I only got one short session with it. The effects of the truncation switch were very subtle in the patches I built, but nonetheless, I'm happy to have it there as an option.

And yes, the knobs are Davies 1913BW.

Cheers,
Kevin
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creekree



Joined: Mar 30, 2006
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 10, 2009 9:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

i will etch one of these dual AR/AD boards too, thanks tom bugs for designing it!
however, one thing that is not completely clear to me: how do you choose between AD and AR modes? is there even a difference? (sorry for my ignorance)
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frijitz



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PostPosted: Fri Jul 10, 2009 4:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

creekree wrote:
however, one thing that is not completely clear to me: how do you choose between AD and AR modes? is there even a difference

Drive it with a short trigger and you get an AD. Drive it with a gate and you get an AR. An unusual, but simple and sensible response.

Very Happy

Ian
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drapdap



Joined: Oct 11, 2004
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 14, 2009 12:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

And is it possible to cycle these somehow by themselves?
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frijitz



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PostPosted: Tue Jul 14, 2009 8:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Sorry, no.

Very Happy

Ian
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creekree



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PostPosted: Mon Aug 17, 2009 3:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I finally found some time to build this thing.
I used the PCB version that Tom Bugs designed and included the TRUNCATE switch - but I can not figure out what it is supposed to do!

So far I have used the gate signal from a x0xb0x sequencer to drive the AR/AD generator and I am happy with what I hear, but could someone please tell me that the TRUNCATE switch ought to do? It does nothing on my unit, and I am very sure that it is not because of bad wiring or such...

Also, I want to include a manual trigger button by connecting a pushbuton to +15v and the trigger in jack, but I am afraid that a 15V trigger signal might be a little bit too much... should I add a resistor to GND? Something like 100k maybe?

Thanks!
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frijitz



Joined: May 04, 2007
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 17, 2009 6:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

creekree wrote:
I finally found some time to build this thing.
I used the PCB version that Tom Bugs designed and included the TRUNCATE switch - but I can not figure out what it is supposed to do!

You might want to review some of the earlier posts. I left the truncate switch off the final design because it didn't work exactly like I expected it to. It does have an effect, but it is a bit subtle. It brings the tail of the decay phase to zero a bit more crisply.

Quote:
Also, I want to include a manual trigger button by connecting a pushbuton to +15v and the trigger in jack, but I am afraid that a 15V trigger signal might be a little bit too much...

A pushbutton will be more like a gate signal. For a pushbutton trigger you would want some kind of RC differentiator to feed the input.

Otherwise the unit is OK?

Very Happy

Ian
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creekree



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PostPosted: Mon Aug 17, 2009 10:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

thanks for answering, ian!

so, i guess i'll just not include the truncate switches - i'm glad i didnt drill holes for them on the frontpanel yet.

yes, the unit is working very well, thanks for sharing the details!
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neandrewthal



Joined: May 11, 2007
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 31, 2009 2:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Glad I found this thread. I had lots of questions about this circuit but this answered most of them already.

Just a couple more, though. What happens if you drive the pulser with a gate signal instead of a trigger? I guess it will delay like normal, but what happens if the input is still high when the "width" time is up? I am just wondering if it can be used to shrink a gate signal into a trigger if all I have is a gate yet I want an Attack Decay envelope.

Also, if I want to do the opposite and use the unit as a pulse stretcher with no delay, will there be any perceivable delay at all if the pot is set to zero?

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frijitz



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PostPosted: Tue Nov 10, 2009 6:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

neandrewthal wrote:
What happens if you drive the pulser with a gate signal instead of a trigger? I guess it will delay like normal, but what happens if the input is still high when the "width" time is up? I am just wondering if it can be used to shrink a gate signal into a trigger if all I have is a gate yet I want an Attack Decay envelope.

The input to the pulser is a comparator followed by a differentiator. So the first one-shot fires when the input crosses a small threshold from below.This one-shot is not retriggerable, so it will always put out the same width pulse. The second one-shot (width) is retriggerable, so it will stay high if repeatedly pulsed at a high rate. Anway, yes, it can be used as a Gate > Trig generator.

Quote:
Also, if I want to do the opposite and use the unit as a pulse stretcher with no delay, will there be any perceivable delay at all if the pot is set to zero?

The minimum RC time constant is 2.2 ms. So it might barely be noticable, if your ear is sharp enough. I don't notice a problem in my units.

Very Happy

Ian
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neandrewthal



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PostPosted: Tue Nov 10, 2009 6:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Cool, thanks Ian. Definitely gonna get 4 of these boards to make love to my quad LPG
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Dego



Joined: Apr 22, 2008
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 13, 2009 6:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Does it run with +/- 9 volt? If you use lm394? Question
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frijitz



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PostPosted: Fri Nov 13, 2009 10:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Dego wrote:
Does it run with +/- 9 volt? If you use lm394? Question

scratch scratch scratch scratch
Sorry?

Very Happy

Ian
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Dego



Joined: Apr 22, 2008
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 14, 2009 3:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Does the AD/AR circuit run on +/- 9 volt?

If you try this circuit at 9 volt is it better to use the lm 324 insted of tl074(not 394 sorry)?
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inlifeindeath



Joined: Apr 02, 2010
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 20, 2011 2:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

hey fellas, i'm about to start laying out a board with 6 of the AD/AR circuits on it. i'm going to be using it in conjunction with my lunetta most likely, which runs on a single supply of 9v. I just want to verify that there won't be any issues running the circuit of a single supply (using the LM324). Ian? Tom? Anyone? Thanks!
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frijitz



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PostPosted: Wed Apr 20, 2011 2:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

inlifeindeath wrote:
i'm going to be using it in conjunction with my lunetta most likely, which runs on a single supply of 9v. I just want to verify that there won't be any issues running the circuit of a single supply (using the LM324).

Shocked No way!

Very Happy

Ian
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inlifeindeath



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PostPosted: Wed Apr 20, 2011 6:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

sarcasm much? or for reals? are you gonna make me breadboard this? Very Happy
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furio



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PostPosted: Mon Dec 12, 2011 11:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

My pots are 100KA and 500KA.
I have some difficulty to choose the cap values Sad
With the first attempt I used C1 4u7 and C1x 470nF and now C1 1uF and C1x 1nF. But I think there is no end, the envelope is still running non-stop! Should I have used polarized caps for both?


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