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TZFM SAW VCO
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/mr



Joined: Aug 05, 2007
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 11, 2010 9:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

zthee wrote:
I'd like some feedback on this panel.

Then just add a feedback knob! Laughing

zthee wrote:
frijitz wrote:

Do you want to have both AC and DC coupling available for the Linear FM?

What is the advantage of DC coupling the linear FM input? AC coupled will make it swing ±? Which is needed for that "original" FM sound?

Standard FM sounds normally use AC coupling, since there should be no DC offset to maintain the pitch of the modulated oscillator.

Don't make it more complicated and confuse AC/DC coupling with ± swing! Both input types swing however you want, the AC coupling is just something that takes away any DC offset.

Awfully nice panel btw! Smile
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zthee



Joined: Feb 20, 2008
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 11, 2010 12:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Oh, that Gothenburg humor! Very Happy

Well, i ment keeping the pitch with my ± sign. Eh. Need to get my terminology straight... Very Happy

But what practical differences would it make? I.e. in what situations would I want to use a AC or a DC coupled linear FM input?

I can understand the concept of keeping the pitch.

I figured I could have the CV mod lin fm input to be AC coupled. And the other input DC coupled?

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Sound



Joined: Jun 06, 2006
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 11, 2010 1:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

DC coupled fm linear input will allow you set external linear initial level.
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/mr



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PostPosted: Fri Mar 12, 2010 4:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

zthee wrote:
I figured I could have the CV mod lin fm input to be AC coupled. And the other input DC coupled?

Do it. Those are the connections you normally want. Smile
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frenchyinmunich



Joined: Jun 23, 2009
Posts: 113
Location: Germany

PostPosted: Wed Apr 07, 2010 5:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

zthee wrote:
Posted Image, might have been reduced in size. Click Image to view fullscreen.

I'd like some feedback on this panel.

And never mind the pitch scaling around the large knobs - it's for the graphics - not usefull Wink

The Voltage Controlled Mod. Section is just a VCA connected to the lin. fm input.


You are the Dude!

cheeeezeeey

That one is really beautifull!!! The best to my taste.
The day you start some to do, please let me know.

Best,

F
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Attorks



Joined: Jun 01, 2009
Posts: 6
Location: Netherlands

PostPosted: Wed Apr 21, 2010 11:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I have finished my TZ VCO 2 weeks ago from a full kit from the BrideChamber. Its a +/-15V version with the modifications from David Brown. Last night I noticed something strange. I what to know if you have the same experience or if its just me.

I have the CV out of my Doepfer MAQ16/3 to a mult. From this mult a cable goes to a DotCom Q106 VCO in the 1V/Oct input. Another cable goes the same way into a second Q106. A third cable goes into the 1V/Oct of the TZ VCO. I had this situation the last week and I noticed the scale was a little bit flat so I thought I had to calibrate the MAQ16/3 again. But last night I unplugged the cable from the TZ VCO and heard that tuning of the 2 Q106 VCO when some quarter semitone up and the scale MAQ is OK again. So it seems that the 1V/Oct input of the TZ VCO influences the CV coming from the sequencer or any CV. Does this sound familiar or is there something wrong with my TZ VCO?
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astroschnautzer



Joined: May 22, 2008
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 21, 2010 12:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

have you tried a buffered mult? This is a common problem if used 3 or more oscillators from the same source I have understood, the buffered mult should cure this...
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frijitz



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PostPosted: Wed Apr 21, 2010 1:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Attorks wrote:
I have the CV out of my Doepfer MAQ16/3 to a mult. From this mult a cable goes to a DotCom Q106 VCO in the 1V/Oct input. Another cable goes the same way into a second Q106. A third cable goes into the 1V/Oct of the TZ VCO. I had this situation the last week and I noticed the scale was a little bit flat so I thought I had to calibrate the MAQ16/3 again. But last night I unplugged the cable from the TZ VCO and heard that tuning of the 2 Q106 VCO when some quarter semitone up and the scale MAQ is OK again. So it seems that the 1V/Oct input of the TZ VCO influences the CV coming from the sequencer or any CV. Does this sound familiar or is there something wrong with my TZ VCO?

The Teezer's V/O input is a standard 100k impedance. As long as you can calibrate it for 1V/Oct it is working properly. I have no idea what this MAQ is, but if it has a finite output impedance there will be some small loading, as is normal is most modular systems. Did you try unplugging one of the other units instead of the Teezer? You haven't isolated the problem properly unless you have done this, too. If the MAQ output is designed improperly, then yes, you might need to use a buffered multiple.

Very Happy

Ian
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Attorks



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PostPosted: Wed Apr 21, 2010 2:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

frijitz wrote:
The Teezer's V/O input is a standard 100k impedance. As long as you can calibrate it for 1V/Oct it is working properly. I have no idea what this MAQ is, but if it has a finite output impedance there will be some small loading, as is normal is most modular systems. Did you try unplugging one of the other units instead of the Teezer? You haven't isolated the problem properly unless you have done this, too. If the MAQ output is designed improperly, then yes, you might need to use a buffered multiple.

I checked and I get the same sort of behaviour when unplugging an Q106 when a Q106 and TZ VCO are still connected. Also ruled out the MAQ16/3 by using a voltage from an LFO which gives the same behaviour. So I guess I have to find/build myself a buffered mult.
Sorry to spoil the bandwidth Embarassed
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Mark Space-Ratio



Joined: Dec 06, 2009
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Location: Sydenham, London

PostPosted: Mon Apr 26, 2010 4:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Attorks wrote:


I have the CV out of my Doepfer MAQ16/3 to a mult.


I had a problem last night running Schaltwerk CV into an Osc. Flat...My Schaltwerk is normally rack mounted and earthed through the rack(?). I had removed it from the rack and stood it on the wood cabinet, then used a single core patch cable and there I encountered the problem. I thought I had blown the CV side of the Schaltwerk as I plugged in the unit it was already switched on. I didn't seat the mains plug correctly so the Schaltwerk went on/off/on momentarily and I thought bang. I then thought 'earth' and replaced the single core with an earthed patch cable and it did the trick, pitch was back to normal. I ran the same CV out to a multi and no problem there. I am guessing MAQ has the same CV circuit that is in the Schaltwerk, with reduced number of outputs.

¬¬¬
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frenchyinmunich



Joined: Jun 23, 2009
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Location: Germany

PostPosted: Wed Apr 28, 2010 4:19 am    Post subject: Where is Zthee Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Hi,

I try to contact Zthee since 3 weeks.
Does someone have recently been in touch with him?

Regards,

F
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Luka



Joined: Jun 29, 2007
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PostPosted: Sun May 23, 2010 5:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

i just went through the troubleshoot proceedure listed for sduck

interesting that neadrewthal swapped his lm311s and it worked, im using lm311H cans maybe that is it.

anyway this is the symptoms
output tri 5v (looks to have high oscillation or noisy signal on scope)
output sin -5v
output saw +5

the measurments

A1-7 (0.72 - 5.14 turning course freq)
A3-6 (-5 to +5 turning initial)

A2-6 4.8v
U2-2 1v-4v
U2-3 -11.3 - -10
U2-7 -0.53

D2/D3/r28 node -6.26

Q3/D3 node -0.54

A9-7 -10.76
A9-6 5.4V

hope that highlights the issue

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Luka



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PostPosted: Fri Jun 04, 2010 4:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

replacing 311s didnt seem to help at all

ian are you around?

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frijitz



Joined: May 04, 2007
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 04, 2010 2:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Luka wrote:
...
the measurments

A1-7 (0.72 - 5.14 turning course freq)
A3-6 (-5 to +5 turning initial)

A2-6 4.8v
U2-2 1v-4v
U2-3 -11.3 - -10
U2-7 -0.53

D2/D3/r28 node -6.26

Q3/D3 node -0.54

A9-7 -10.76
A9-6 5.4V

Sorry, I've been out of commission the past few weeks.

I can't understand your measurements -- some don't even seem possible.

Have you checked all the PS voltages, as given further above?

Very Happy

Ian
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Luka



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PostPosted: Fri Jun 04, 2010 3:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

yeah all the rail checks came through ok
which results in that list in particular dont make sense?

Last night after i made the message i plugged in my 2nd of 3 teezer pcbs using the same panel connectors and it seemed to be fully functioning. So i can eliminate wiring error and hopefully wrong components placement as i populated these 2 pcbs at the same time.

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frijitz



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PostPosted: Sat Jun 05, 2010 6:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Luka wrote:
which results in that list in particular dont make sense?

u2-2: I don't see how this could be varying with the frequency control.
u2-3: I don't see how this could possibly be near -11V. (u2 is powered by +/-7V, R29 is connected to +5V, etc.)
Sorry, this is completrely crazy.

Very Happy

Ian
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Luka



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PostPosted: Sat Jun 05, 2010 3:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

ok ill recheck those, thanks for pointing it out

i have 2 teezers operational now Smile just this third one is giving me grief

i went around the pcb and checked resistors values with my DMM in comparison to the working one and they matched. also swapped all IC and transistors from dead one to living one and it seems they are not the problem

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Argitoth



Joined: Jun 24, 2008
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 21, 2010 3:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

It seems like MOTM-300 VCO sync only reset with pulses. Is the Teezer the same way?
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frijitz



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PostPosted: Sun Aug 22, 2010 3:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Argitoth wrote:
It seems like MOTM-300 VCO sync only reset with pulses. Is the Teezer the same way?

No! The Teezer sync has a built-in pulser. It will sync to any signal that crosses 0.6 V from below. It's sync is also continuously variable from soft to hard.

Very Happy

Ian
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/mr



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PostPosted: Sun Aug 22, 2010 5:38 am    Post subject: Dual Teezer module? Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Has anybody else than zthee thought about a dual version of the Teezer?
What obvious and non-obvious smart features and cross-connections (via switching jacks etc) would you include? Smile
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Argitoth



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PostPosted: Sun Aug 22, 2010 8:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I would love it if Teezer had PWM in and Pulse outputs (I've found so many uses for pulse/square waves lately... I'll list them!)

-high-speed VC clock for S&H effects
-For sync: creating "movement" in sound by modulating pulse width
-For sync: creating vibrato by modulating pulse width
-different FM-type and sync sounds with pulse widths
-creating a saw animator by mixing inversed saw + phase locked square and modulating pulse width
-using it to modulate the pitch of an oscillator up and down a precise octave

David Brown might be able to help me create a circuit for square/PWM to add to the Teezer, but I was wondering first... will the Teezer sync be pulse-width sensitive? And is there a way to use some of the sync circuit to make square/pwm circuit?
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frijitz



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PostPosted: Sun Aug 22, 2010 8:38 am    Post subject: Re: Dual Teezer module? Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

/mr wrote:
Has anybody else than zthee thought about a dual version of the Teezer?
What obvious and non-obvious smart features and cross-connections (via switching jacks etc) would you include? Smile

Well, yes! Scott at bridechamber and I are working on a dual version in euro format. I wanted to do it without changing the board layout significantly, so I just shrunk it down a bit and added the extra power connector. Scott is working on the challenge of designing mounting brackets -- it's going to be a tight squeeze.

We haven't talked about cross-connections yet, but it seems to me it would be easy to normalize some connections on the panel, without changing the board.

Very Happy

Ian
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frijitz



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PostPosted: Sun Aug 22, 2010 9:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Argitoth wrote:
I would love it if Teezer had PWM in and Pulse outputs...

Sorry, that's not gonna happen. I appreciate the usefulness of it, but I really suggest using a separate waveshaper module.

Quote:
David Brown might be able to help me create a circuit for square/PWM to add to the Teezer, but I was wondering first... will the Teezer sync be pulse-width sensitive? And is there a way to use some of the sync circuit to make square/pwm circuit?

Yes, it would be easy to make a little perfboard add-on.

The sync circuit has its own pulse generator at the input and triggers off the upward-going signal transition across a 0.6V threshold. So no, you cannot vary its phase.

There is a pulse wave internal to the sync circuit (driven by the oscillator's Tri signal). It's part of the variable-sync circuit, so it isn't voltage controllable.

Thanks for your interest! I like all your ideas and suggestions, but the circuit is already fairly complex, and we've been trying to keep the price down by not adding a lot of extra features.

Very Happy

Ian
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/mr



Joined: Aug 05, 2007
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 22, 2010 9:28 am    Post subject: Re: Dual Teezer module? Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

frijitz wrote:
/mr wrote:
Has anybody else than zthee thought about a dual version of the Teezer?

Well, yes! Scott at bridechamber and I are working on a dual version in euro format.

Cool! Smile

frijitz wrote:
We haven't talked about cross-connections yet, but it seems to me it would be easy to normalize some connections on the panel, without changing the board.

Common CV inputs is perhaps the most obvious, but the "smarter" connections for intermodulations would be preferable to do via VCAs, I guess... Smile
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Funky40



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PostPosted: Fri Aug 27, 2010 2:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I never found it more interesting or musical to patch two teezers than a teezer and another highfrequenzyrange VCO.

what i miss on my teezers is the option of presettable offsetranges.
If i would build again, i would have the manual offsetknob, AND also switchable offsets.
could be: 0V / 0.1V / 0.2V ( as ZO ) / (0.5V?) / 1V (as ZO) / (2V?) / and definitly also 5V !!!


never wanted to miss the mutejacks on ALL CV inputs !! especially on a TZ VCO
one reason why i hate manufactured VCOs.
never wanted to miss multiple outputjacks !!
the next reason why i hate manufactured VCOs


Teeser and 5pulser are a very nice Team. shit, never made that demos, sorry
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