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 Forum index » DIY Hardware and Software » Ken Stone designs - CGS
CGS 22 Master divider
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Funky40



Joined: Sep 24, 2005
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 10, 2008 6:37 am    Post subject: CGS 22 Master divider
Subject description: confusion about the timing diagramm/ wiring
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Hallo,

I have my Master divider ready for final wiring.
I'm confused about the wiring because phase one has allways a first stepp that is just half the pulsewidth on the timing diagramm.


i searched for a point where i get a Phase 1 that starts on each division at the same time/phase.


see 4B ( the third from the bottom), the second pulse.....
drwawing at this point a vertical line gives me the following to set as the Phase 1 on each division:

Div2 : ---> 2A
Div4 : ----> 3A
Div8 : ----> 4C
Div16: ---> 4B


this way i have on all divisions Phase 1 starting at the same point: 1.1.1
I'm confused..............
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andrewF



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PostPosted: Tue Nov 11, 2008 4:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Maybe it is easier to ignore the 1st step on the timing diagram. I don't know how Ken created it, but consider the 1st step the 'start-up' step. Once the cct is running you won't get those half-steps.

for me it seemed more useful to group the outputs by their divisions -
/2, /4, /8, /16

If you try to set it up according to rising edges, it might get tricky
would you group

4D 4C 3A 2A
or
1A 4A 3A 2A? scratch
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Funky40



Joined: Sep 24, 2005
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 13, 2008 3:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

andrewF wrote:

for me it seemed more useful to group the outputs by their divisions -
/2, /4, /8, /16


Yep, thats how my Frontpanel is done

andrewF wrote:
Maybe it is easier to ignore the 1st step on the timing diagram. I don't know how Ken created it, but consider the 1st step the 'start-up' step. Once the cct is running you won't get those half-steps.
Yep, i thought that its maybe just the drawing. Anyway, i'm confused.



My goal ist to have all Divisions Phase1 synchronised. How it is in real with the common wiring ?
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otherunicorn



Joined: May 11, 2008
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 17, 2008 4:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Don't worry about being confused. This circuit confuses even me!
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Fetafarmer



Joined: Jul 29, 2007
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 03, 2009 10:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I'm confused that I have a problem which no one else appears to have : )

I've had the /2 and /4 sections of my Master Divider v2 wired up and working fine for some time now. Today I wired up the /8 outputs, only to find that the /8 sequence runs backwards!

All wiring connections are exactly as stated in the chart on the webpage. All modifications needed for the board have been implemented. All ICs are the correct type, and match their silkscreens.

I can rewire the /8 outputs to give the correct output order, but regardless, if I've done something wrong, I'd like to know what it is, and if there's something wrong on the board, I'm sure Ken would like to know.

Any ideas?

Cheers,
Kevin
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andrewF



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PostPosted: Tue Mar 03, 2009 3:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

by backwards, do you mean div8 phase 4 is leading with the other div8 waveforms shifted from it?
So 4C fires first, then 3B, 4A, 3D?
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Fetafarmer



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PostPosted: Tue Mar 03, 2009 4:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

andrewF wrote:
by backwards, do you mean div8 phase 4 is leading with the other div8 waveforms shifted from it?
So 4C fires first, then 3B, 4A, 3D?


Yes, exactly. The tempo is correct, but the firing order is the reverse of what it should be.

Kevin
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otherunicorn



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PostPosted: Tue Mar 03, 2009 4:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

This circuit is very confusing - even for me. It is possible I somehow managed to get the labels wrong. Has anyone else found this?
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Fetafarmer



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PostPosted: Thu Mar 05, 2009 6:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Fetafarmer wrote:
andrewF wrote:
by backwards, do you mean div8 phase 4 is leading with the other div8 waveforms shifted from it?
So 4C fires first, then 3B, 4A, 3D?


Yes, exactly. The tempo is correct, but the firing order is the reverse of what it should be.

Kevin


Further testing: I wired the /16 outputs up, and they function correctly, so it seems like all I need to do to have a functioning module is to reverse the order of the /8 outs.

There's a short, low-quality YouTube video of someone's Master Divider, but they laid out their panel in a way that makes it extremely difficult to visually track the correlation between divisions, so I can't tell if that one runs correctly or not : {

Kevin
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wicked1



Joined: Apr 24, 2009
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PostPosted: Mon May 18, 2009 8:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

-edit- I got answers elsewhere, so have put them here in case anyone else has the same questions in the future.

I just finished the master div and noticed the same thing w/ /8! goes from bottom to top. (phase 4,3,2,1 the others go phase 1,2,3,4)
-edit- This may indeed be a mislabeling of the PCB, but if anyone else has this module, could you test your divider and let us know?

I have another issue.. /2 phase 1&2, light/trigger together, and phase 3&4 go together.
-edit- This one isn't right, and I'll have to do some troubleshooting.

Also, there are always 2 led's lit per division. led's 1&2, 2&3, 3&4, 4&1, cycle.
-edit- It was explained that the lights are correct, as the outputs have a 50% duty cycle. That's in the text on the website, but I didn't think it through...

but otherwise it works.. triggers sequentially through the phases, and divisions.

Is that the way the others are running, or do I have a problem somewhere?

I also posted this on the CGS yahoo group, so a few might see these questions twice.

Thanks!
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Funky40



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PostPosted: Sat Jun 27, 2009 7:57 am    Post subject: Re: CGS 22 Master divider
Subject description: confusion about the timing diagramm/ wiring
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wired up all the Div-out stages ( modul was ready fpr wiring since month, exept that i had to do the cludge, which was easy ).

As reported i wired Div8 also vise versa and it runs the right way.
thanks Guys !




Funky40 wrote:


i searched for a point where i get a Phase 1 that starts on each division at the same time/phase.


see 4B ( the third from the bottom), the second pulse.....
drwawing at this point a vertical line gives me the following to set as the Phase 1 on each division:

Div2 : ---> 2A
Div4 : ----> 3A
Div8 : ----> 4C
Div16: ---> 4B


this way i have on all divisions Phase 1 starting at the same point: 1.1.1
I'm confused..............


I had a look to this.
My Module has no LEDs, but i can patch to a quad ADSR.
indeed was the pattern funny when patching phase1 of all divisions to the quad ADSR.

i got a In-Sync Pattern when patching:
1. DIV2 / phase2
2. DIV4 / Phase2
3. DIV8 / Phase3
4. DIV16 / Phase3



this means when DIV 16 "starts" with phase 1, all other divisions have also phase 1 triggered. so you have a 1.1.1 point where everything is in sync.
One just has to invert the clock when syncing other dividers. Refering to the graphic diagramm, have not patched this.



see DIV16 Phase2, take the second square and paint a vertical line there thru the graphic from Ken,
and then see all the Divisions that start at this point ( explained above)
My occupation was identical with the graphic. then see also above the clock.
have no space in the synth for any new module, can not use it for now.
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TekniK



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PostPosted: Sat Jun 27, 2009 8:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I hope am not gonna need to riwire mine when i got my panels.


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Funky40



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PostPosted: Thu Jul 02, 2009 3:20 pm    Post subject: Re: CGS 22 Master divider
Subject description: confusion about the timing diagramm/ wiring
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I tested again: my observations were right.

for simplier patchings it might be from no importance,
but for more complex patchings it will be from inportance in my Opinion. My suggestion is to wire this way:


Divide by 2:
2,3,4,1 (*)= 2A, 1B, 2C, 1D

Divide by 4:
2,3,4,1 (*)= 3A, 2B, 3C, 2D

Divide by 8:
3, 4, 1, 2(*)= 4A, 3D, 4C, 3B ( according to the corrected order )

Divide by 16:
3, 4, 1, 2(*) = 4B, 1C, 4D, 1A


* = the numbers are right, numbers plus letter i just read from the table, this is unverified.
I patched to my quad ADSR to see the LEDs.
i patched all the Divisions first phase, and those are then in sync. you get a nice straigth logic pattern.
I checked then all divisions with phase 1-4 , and made some "testpatterns".
and it is so that you then have to invert the clock to run other sequenzers in sync, respectivly send a inverted clock to the masterdivider



I gonna rewire my module. you can patch funky patterns .
please note: My module is not installed as i have no space. so it was never used to make music. My module has no LEDs wired for now.
I just made these tests.



bevore wiring to my suggestions, better make this and check youself:

Funky40 wrote:

see DIV16 Phase2, take the second square and paint a vertical line there thru the graphic from Ken,
and then see all the Divisions that start at this point ( explained above)
.
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Funky40



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PostPosted: Fri Jul 03, 2009 8:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Done.
I rewired my module and stuffed all the LEDs.
and jammed a little bit bevore soldering.

Great module !
Thanks Ken
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abelovesfun



Joined: Dec 17, 2012
Posts: 40
Location: Portland, OR

PostPosted: Thu Jul 16, 2015 9:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I'm confused, If I want to wire this up for the BrideChamber panel. should I change:

Divide by 2:
2,3,4,1 (*)= 2A, 1B, 2C, 1D


to

Divide by 2:
1,2,3,4 = 1D, 2A, 1B, 2C

?

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