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 Forum index » Instruments and Equipment » Alesis Andromeda
a synth for industrial/electrofunk sounds
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D-Fire



Joined: Nov 20, 2008
Posts: 3
Location: Italy

PostPosted: Thu Nov 20, 2008 4:57 am    Post subject:  a synth for industrial/electrofunk sounds Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Hello there,
I'm new here and i'm writing here for a help in buying a harware synth.
I'm searching for a hardware synth that I could make industrial/electrofunk sounds.
In particular basses and pads...
I thought that andromeda could do but i'm searching for a confirm...
so those are links of music of artist's sounds i want to reproduce:

Bass sounds i'm looking for:

(Imperative Reaction):
www.myspace.com/imperativereaction
(Vnv Nation):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bedj1qC_jwg
(Ultraviolet Sound):
http://it.youtube.com/watch?v=wLSNmQ4DiN0
(Supernova):
http://it.youtube.com/watch?v=HJTZf3x6Ek0

Pad sounds i'm looking for:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3TT4oOp-RCI
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KZFkSIS8pf8
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wklqtlULbSM

Could Andromeda do those sounds? or maybe i must choose a virus ti?
I'm searching for my first synth for those sounds i'm searching for.

Hoping in your answers...
Cheers,
D-Fire.
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rh2y



Joined: May 08, 2007
Posts: 216
Location: Pittsburgh, USA
Audio files: 5

PostPosted: Thu Nov 20, 2008 10:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

At the 2:19 mark on the Supernova video, you can see an Access Virus TI Polar. Whether they are using it for the bass sounds; who knows. But it may be a clue.
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jonkull



Joined: Sep 22, 2006
Posts: 164
Location: Burbank, CA

PostPosted: Thu Nov 20, 2008 12:23 pm    Post subject: Re: a synth for industrial/electrofunk sounds Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

D-Fire wrote:
I'm searching for a hardware synth that I could make industrial/electrofunk sounds.
In particular basses and pads...

Could Andromeda do those sounds? or maybe i must choose a virus ti?
I'm searching for my first synth for those sounds i'm searching for.



For what it's worth I'm selling my Ti and keeping my Andromeda. My advice is to find someplace that sells both and try them out. They can both do basses and pads.

The Virus Ti gives you over 1000 presets to get you going right out of the box. The Andromeda will take some time and work to program your own. With the Ti you also get supersaw, wavetable, granular and formant oscillators. So it's capable of a wider variety of sounds. It can do things an Andromeda can't (as far as digital type sounds) but it's 'analog' sounds aren't as thick and full sounding as the Andromeda and it has fewer mod routings.

If you want instant gratification and the ability to make odd digital noises (with the granular, formant and wavetable oscillators) I'd go with the Ti. If you're willing to put time into programming your own sounds and don't care about the digital stuff the Virus offers I'd go with the Andromeda.
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D-Fire



Joined: Nov 20, 2008
Posts: 3
Location: Italy

PostPosted: Thu Nov 20, 2008 1:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

yeah you are wright cause all those artists have a virus...i do not know if they used it like a masterkeyboard or an platform for effects or so...i don't know.

My question is: for those sounds it's better Andromeda or Virus?
I know that some industrial artists use Andromeda and Virus.

But what you think i must choose at first Andromeda or a Virus?
I think Virus could be a plus to complete my gear if I will have a Andromeda..and viceversa.

@jonkull: i do not fear about programming and i have patience...I want to find a place to try them too, but it's hard..however if you says me with programming i could do those sounds, i will choose the andromeda instead of a virus c or ti (Ti humm...it's not my preferred Virus) oviously as first synth, after i could buy a virus b or c to get all the sounds i want.

Let me know what you think.
Cheers,
D.
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LamerDeluxe



Joined: Jul 08, 2008
Posts: 38
Location: Netherlands

PostPosted: Fri Nov 21, 2008 3:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

The Andromeda should be able to do those bass sounds. I've been working on creating something similar to the bass in On her majesty's secret service by Propellorheads http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e3aI5AxebQo

The Andromeda can do those ripping bass sounds quite well, because you can combine multiple waveforms in one oscillator, for instance a sine and a pulse wave. Also the positive and negative saw waves sound quite different and can really tear. Adjust the pulsewidth until you get the exact sound you're after.

If you use filter feedback on the 12dB filter, use lowpass (+/- 50) and add quite a bit of bandpass (+/- 30), with high resonance, with the filter tracking the keyboard you are going in the right direction. You can add the 24dB filter for extra depth. Up the oscillator level to about 70 for extra punch and use around 50% sub oscillator.

You can also have an oscillator modulate the filter for an extra tearing effect.

I think I got close to the bass sound you are looking for, but mine sounds a lot more powerful, still only using a single oscillator.

As for the choir pad, the Andromeda does analog choir sounds amazingly well, there are some patches available which demonstrate that impressively. Your example sounds quite breathy though, which is more the territory of samplers.

The pad sound of the last video is the Andromeda's speciality. It can do really thick, large string sounds with lots of emotion in them. The 32 analog VCO's really make a difference here.

The Andromeda is so versatile in its sound that it is easy to feel a bit lost at first. When you get used to it, you really start to appreciate it.
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ThreeFingersOfLove



Joined: Oct 21, 2004
Posts: 162
Location: Greece
Audio files: 3
G2 patch files: 1

PostPosted: Fri Nov 21, 2008 12:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

D-Fire wrote:
I want to find a place to try them too, but it's hard..
D.


Why don't you post your question here. I think some users will definitely want to help!
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D-Fire



Joined: Nov 20, 2008
Posts: 3
Location: Italy

PostPosted: Sat Jan 24, 2009 9:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Hello again,

I still have not the synth, cause is out of stock or sould out as you prefer.
So I must wait or find another places to buy it.

I know that programming sounds is not just moving buttons at random and tryin' to get out that sound you want it...especially for a synth like andromeda.

My question is: What is the fastest way to understand the art of programming sounds? Books? youtube?
What do you conseil?

I want to learn how to program and design sounds.
My dream is to master not only andromeda but also some virtual instruments I have...and why not to become a sound designer.

Thank you to all of you,
D.
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rh2y



Joined: May 08, 2007
Posts: 216
Location: Pittsburgh, USA
Audio files: 5

PostPosted: Sun Jan 25, 2009 11:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

D-Fire wrote:

My question is: What is the fastest way to understand the art of programming sounds? Books? youtube?
What do you conseil?
.


My answer to that is to start out on a "simple" synthesizer. I had the great fortune to begin my synthesis career (career? ok.. "hobby") at a young age on the ARP Educational Modular Synthesizer Lab. Some how my junior high school had gotten its hands on one, and, since I was the only nerd in the class who was bold enough to ask -- they let me take it home for a summer!

http://www.synthmuseum.com/arp/arpmsl01.html
http://www.sequencer.de/pix/arp/arp_educational.jpg

You won't likely find one of these anywhere, but the concept of starting with something small like this and understanding how it works still applies.

I think a great beginner synth these days would be a Paia Fatman, or better still a Paia P9700S, or a Ray Wilson SoundLabs Synth.

Of course, these are all available as kits, so you'd have to do some soldering, but you may be able to find a used one already assembled on the various auction sites.

Once you've mastered one of these wee beasties, then you'll have a better idea what's lurking under the hood on a more capable synth like the Andromeda.

As far as to supplemental materials, yes there are some good books out there.

My favorite (although not strictly a synthesizer book, but will give you a GREAT understanding of why a synth does what is does) is this one:

http://www.amazon.com/Music-Physics-Engineering-Harry-Olson/dp/0486217698

it's written by Harry F Olson, creator of the RCA music synthesizer, and talks about the fundamental components of musical sounds, which I think is a great way to learn about sound design.

Frankly, the Andromeda user manual also comes with a pretty good tutorial on synthesis as well, and the manual is freely downloadable over the net. Check out Chapter 3, Basics of Analog Synthesis. The theory there applies even to other synths besides the Andromeda.

Anyway, that's my 3 cents worth (2 cents adjusted for inflation).

Russ

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Nikolai77



Joined: Mar 08, 2009
Posts: 21
Location: Virginia

PostPosted: Wed Mar 11, 2009 9:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

D-Fire wrote:
Hello again,

I still have not the synth, cause is out of stock or sould out as you prefer.
So I must wait or find another places to buy it.

I know that programming sounds is not just moving buttons at random and tryin' to get out that sound you want it...especially for a synth like andromeda.

My question is: What is the fastest way to understand the art of programming sounds? Books? youtube?
What do you conseil?

I want to learn how to program and design sounds.
My dream is to master not only andromeda but also some virtual instruments I have...and why not to become a sound designer.

Thank you to all of you,
D.


My advice to you is to start off on a much cheaper, simpler synthesizer so you know which features you want.
Since you've listed bands such as VNV Nation and Imperative Reaction, you might wanna look for an old Virus desktop unit (around 1000 USD, give or take) made by Access. VNV Nation's first album was written EXCLUSIVELY with a Virus. You can make some fat, amazing trance sounds. The ultimate problem in my eyes with the Virus is the fact that it's digital, and while it can do a lot, it's not an analog replacement. It's just a good digital synth with a bit more to offer. Also, a lot of bands use it, so the sound it makes can be a bit predictable and overdone.
The Andromeda is a big hunk of meat. It's a massive synth that has more polyphony than most analogs out there and many features. Not to mention the panel is littered with knobs and buttons as to avoid annoying digital synth submenus. However, without understanding or appreciation of what the Andromeda has to offer, and the insane price tag, you might wanna try out something else first.
For analog, there's always old synths on ebay. Any of the polyphonic Korg boards or any of the Roland Juno's would work great for pads and basses, and you'd also have plenty of money left over. I've seen used Poly 800's for less than $300. Korg Poly Six, Korg Poly 61, Roland Juno 106, Roland Juno 6, or Roland Juno 60 are all great analog polysynths from the 80's.
I'd also suggest checking out the Dave Smith Instruments Evolver, Poly Evolver, Prophet, and Mopho. These are all analog hybrids (some parts of the signal path are digital) and are instruments in their own class.
As for the sounds you're trying to produce, look at any virtual analog synth and decide for yourself. Cheap (under 1000 USD) virtual analog synths include the Korg microKorg, (the new) microKorg XL, Korg R3, Korg RADIAS, Novation XioSynth, and Roland SH-201. All of these synths have the basics: multiple oscillators, multiple filter types, LFO's, envelope generators, etc.
As for learning about synthesis, go to the manufacturer's websites and download their manuals. I learned a lot about synthesis from manuals from keyboards I've never bought or used, such as the Clavia Nord Lead series, most Waldorf manuals, etc.
Happy hunting and feel free to ask questions.
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