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 Forum index » Clavia Nord Modular » Nord Modular G2 Discussion
Are those "clicks" normal?
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xav



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PostPosted: Sun Dec 21, 2008 1:41 pm    Post subject: Are those "clicks" normal? Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Several synth generate clicks at the beginning of filtersed sounds and other don't (the memorymoog e.g.). The envelope generator generates those clicks if it is after the filter. You can hear that in this patch. The green module switches to a more silent solution (envelope before filter).
But is this normal? Or maybe my G2 alone does those noises? Do you have other solutions?

Xavier


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Blue Hell
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 21, 2008 1:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Yes this is normal, the problem comes from the amplitude going from zero to max in a very short time. This effect is different for each individual key press as it is most pronounced when the signal happens to be at a high level when the envelope opens.

Putting the filter after the envelope will reduce the effect by filtering the highs out which makes the signal raise more slowly (that is when it's not a HPF of course).

You could set the envelopes slower, setting it to len-exp or exp-exp mode will also help.

When you have the envelope directly after an oscillator you can also reset the oscillator with the keyboard gate signal (on the sync input), as that way the amplitude of the oscillator will be zero at the moment the envelope opens up (or when it's not it will be synced with all the other edges in the signal which will fool the ear into believing that there is no click).

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varice



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PostPosted: Sun Dec 21, 2008 1:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Yes, this is normal. The clicks happen because of the fast EG settings of the attack and release times. You can reduce the clicks by increasing the times a little.

Oops - Blue Hell beat me with his reply!

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xav



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PostPosted: Sun Dec 21, 2008 2:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

When you have the envelope directly after an oscillator you can also reset the oscillator with the keyboard gate signal (on the sync input), as that way the amplitude of the oscillator will be zero at the moment the envelope opens up (or when it's not it will be synced with all the other edges in the signal which will fool the ear into believing that there is no click).[/quote]

Thanks Blue Hell and Varice. This solution is interesting and doesn't consume so much cpu than on eg before each filter.
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xav



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PostPosted: Fri Jan 30, 2009 2:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Blue Hell wrote:

When you have the envelope directly after an oscillator you can also reset the oscillator with the keyboard gate signal (on the sync input), as that way the amplitude of the oscillator will be zero at the moment the envelope opens up (or when it's not it will be synced with all the other edges in the signal which will fool the ear into believing that there is no click).


Sorry! I'm sill worried with that noise.
That's strange. I synced the osc with the keyboard gate signal, and that click is still there. To be sure it is synced, the osc is at its lower frequency.
I don't understand why there are clicks louder than other, and why it is so loud in comparison to that so filtered signal.
Is my G2 like everyone' unit?


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Blue Hell
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 30, 2009 2:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

When you put the envelope after the filter the filtered signal has no fixed phase relation with the oscillator, it just depends on what has happened before and so the clicks will change in amplitude too. The only way to get rid of 'm in this case is to make the envelop slower.

In the before case there are no clicks here, as expected.

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xav



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PostPosted: Fri Jan 30, 2009 4:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Thanks Jan.
I promise I won't post anymore messages related to those clicks!!!
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Blue Hell
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 30, 2009 4:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Please ask more questions when you don't understand!
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dorremifasol



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PostPosted: Sat Jan 31, 2009 2:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Not only it is normal to hear a click sound when raising or lowering the amplitude of a waveform very fast, but it may be a very desirable effect for certain sounds, for example lead or percussive ones.

In fact, the G2 lacks "power" in the click effect, comparing it to other synthesizers I have. For example, the Nord Rack 2X, Korg M3 / Radias, Motif XS or Roland V-Synth.

The Korg M3 / Radias for example has a parameter to emphasize the initial click to create snappier sounds.

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xav



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PostPosted: Sat Jan 31, 2009 4:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Albert, you give me the idea to compare side by side the G2 and the NordWave. The G2 has a much louder click at minimum envelope attack level. I have to raise that level to 6ms to hear the same attack loudness.
But I noticed another difference: the G2 is brighter than the NordWave. The NordWave sounds warmer.
I had several synth that have an impact parameter, for the envelope, eg the K2600. I wasn't really a big fan of its envelope, so slow... and the impact parameter couldn't help me rally.
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