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Quad-NAND synth / breadboarding
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marcelds



Joined: May 24, 2011
Posts: 19
Location: austria

PostPosted: Tue May 24, 2011 1:44 pm    Post subject: Quad-NAND synth / breadboarding
Subject description: looking for some advice!
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Hi everybody!

As a long-time electronics fan and enthusiast, I've finally decided to undergo my first real electronics project - building a quad-NAND synth
( as per http://www.misusage.org/wordpress/?p=23 ).
It's basically a simple oscillator run through each NAND gate of a 4000 series CMOS IC, fed into each other for manipulation.
This is also my first time actually translating schematics to a breadboard, which I've attempted haphazardly - see attached image.

My questions are the following:

    How many errors have I run into?
    If I were to test this oscillator, how would I go about installing the audio jack?
    Am I grounding this correctly?


Thanks a ton, sorry for the obnoxious newbie questions! Rolling Eyes Really excited about this project.

-Marcel


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current wiring of breadboard
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cmos.JPG


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blue hell
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Joined: Apr 03, 2004
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PostPosted: Tue May 24, 2011 2:34 pm    Post subject: Re: Quad-NAND synth / breadboarding
Subject description: looking for some advice!
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marcelds wrote:
Hi everybody!


welcome

    How many errors have I run into?


About 6 Laughing you didn't ground the unused inputs, should always do that with CMOS stuff. Unused outputs should not be tied to anything, just in case you wonder. The thing is CMOS inputs are very sensitive, and when left floating they'll do all kinds of odd stuff with the rest of the circuit, even when not logically related.

And re. output, there is a point labeled out that's one terminal, the other is GrouND.

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also .. could someone please turn down the thermostat a bit.
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richardc64



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PostPosted: Wed May 25, 2011 1:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Seven.

A single ordinary NAND will not oscillate. You need the hysteresis of a Schmitt trigger, such as the 40106 inverters or the 4093 quad schmitt NAND, as specified in the misusage page.

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marcelds



Joined: May 24, 2011
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Location: austria

PostPosted: Sat May 28, 2011 3:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

alright, thanks. damn, luckily I do have a few 40106 inverters around. these are also required to have all unused inputs grounded?
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PostPosted: Sat May 28, 2011 3:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

marcelds wrote:
these are also required to have all unused inputs grounded?


Yeah, all CMOS wants that.

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also .. could someone please turn down the thermostat a bit.
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dimsound



Joined: Jun 07, 2011
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 07, 2011 3:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

marcelds wrote:
alright, thanks. damn, luckily I do have a few 40106 inverters around. these are also required to have all unused inputs grounded?


Also, this is a bit of a different pinout from the 4093. Check out this link for quick specs on 4000 series CMOS...

http://www.kpsec.freeuk.com/components/cmos.htm

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richardc64



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PostPosted: Wed Jun 08, 2011 4:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

It can be done with a 40106. It just needs three 1N4148 diodes.

While this isn't rocket science, I really hate when a d.i.y. site is casual about important information. "NAND" appears in the text 11 times. Is it any wonder that marcelds concluded that any NAND would work? Almost as a footnote, the article says -- just once! -- that the 4093 is a "Scmitt Trigger", then compounds the carelessness by MISSPELLING "SCHMITT."


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marcelds



Joined: May 24, 2011
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 19, 2011 4:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

thanks a lot, richard. it's interesting - i just found this site:

http://www.zen22142.zen.co.uk/Circuits/Testgear/sqosc.html

even without a schmitt trigger, the 4011 oscillates? i don't understand.
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richardc64



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PostPosted: Sun Jun 19, 2011 9:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

marcelds wrote:
thanks a lot, richard. it's interesting - i just found this site:

http://www.zen22142.zen.co.uk/Circuits/Testgear/sqosc.html

even without a schmitt trigger, the 4011 oscillates? i don't understand.


Ah, but that 2nd circuit uses two 4011 gates. One gate or inverter alone won't oscillate if it isn't a schmitt.

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marcelds



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PostPosted: Sun Jun 19, 2011 9:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

ah, excellent! i have a use for all these ICs! thanks.
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marcelds



Joined: May 24, 2011
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 19, 2011 1:05 pm    Post subject:   Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

success! two gates of the 4011 are producing a nice, crisp square wave. time to make four LFOs out of two chips. thanks for everyone's help!
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Strazdas



Joined: Apr 21, 2010
Posts: 42
Location: Kaunas, Lithuania

PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2011 12:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

This is simple LFO section from simple monosynth published in Radio magazine (Russia) giving you two nice waveforms with "Rate" and "Width" controls. Original cmos is K176LA7 = CD4011. Circuit designed to work with +8V (K176 cmos max Vss=+9V), but with 4011 you can go up to +15V.

Breadboarded and tested.


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