Stylistic Conventions Which Thwart Cross-Pollination

seraph

http://beepsnort.org/archives/2003_06.html
I am posting the link to this article by Jeff Harrington here because I found it very interesting and worth the time reading it

seraph · Posted: Mon Nov 10, 2003 4:03 am Post subject:

now that I am thinking about it the idea of dodecaphonic dance music does not sound so silly after all Shocked

Why do not we put together a contest for the best dodecaphonic dance music song?
The problem would be to find the "panel of experts" who should judge it.
And on what basis? the weirdest? the most "serialistic"? the most academically correct?
so many 12 tone rows, so little time Idea

elektro80 · Posted: Mon Nov 10, 2003 4:16 am Post subject:

Righto, I found this blogpost interesting too.

It is quite possible to have an academic approach to metric / hypnometric beats, structured harmonic audio events etc. and not end up with evil popular dance music. Music is a collection of numbers and relatiional audio events and there is a whole lot interesting numbers out there still. I have never quite seen how "noise" and the more academic difficult "harmonies" ( or lack of or whatever) cannot coexist with traditional tonal structures. But I do see how "experimental electronic music" in the shape of music rooted in techno makes life hard for serious experimental composers. There might be a problem with the term experimental in this context. We have been hacking at this in several other threads here. Personally I tend to use the term experimental when I work with something musically that I haven´t figured out how to impolement or use or understand. When I do write music I tend to think of it as a process where I make something I understand myself and will hopefully know why I do this or that. I do understand that others might use the term differently. That is quite OK.

I have downloaded a lot of Jeff´s music and I have been listening to it using pretty good headphones. This is good, solid stuff. Personally I would not label any of this experimental at all, it is just excellent music. This does probably says a lot more about my messed up mind than the music though.

seraph · Posted: Mon Nov 10, 2003 4:22 am Post subject:

elektro80 · Posted: Mon Nov 10, 2003 4:27 am Post subject:

Beyer Demonics 770 Pro Shocked

I would call these experimental when I use them for nonritualistic purposes. And don´t ask..

Shocked

seraph · Posted: Mon Nov 10, 2003 4:34 am Post subject:

elektro80 · Posted: Mon Nov 10, 2003 4:36 am Post subject:

The thread title reminds me of one of the sayings by Captain Sam : " You gotta get to know them before you can f**k them".

The famous captain is a high end character animator working on feature films using Maya. And yes, evidently he has hobbies too.

seraph · Posted: Mon Nov 10, 2003 4:43 am Post subject:

what the **** are you talking about?
Posted Image, might have been reduced in size. Click Image to view fullscreen.

have you checked your glucose level lately?

elektro80 · Posted: Mon Nov 10, 2003 4:50 am Post subject:

Low on espresso. Brewed a Bialetti pot just now. Things are better. Wrong mode... demonics=Dynamics .. ok?

Shocked

elektro80 · Posted: Mon Nov 10, 2003 4:53 am Post subject:

back on topic.. the title is cool. Stylistic conventions do present problems. And yes.. this can mess up the crosspollination routine. ( No jokes.. please Shocked

)

elektro80 · Posted: Mon Nov 10, 2003 5:00 am Post subject:

I quoted the captain because.. well. stylistic conventions travel too easily. Different styles can provide a lot of interesting methods, but too often conventions are applied instead. So.. you gotta know the styles and the conventions before you can mess with them.

seraph · Posted: Mon Nov 10, 2003 6:49 am Post subject:

seraph · Posted: Mon Nov 10, 2003 6:51 am Post subject:

by the way: I have a pair of Beyer Demonics 770 Pro too Twisted Evil

elektro80 · Posted: Mon Nov 10, 2003 7:01 am Post subject:

no kidding?

Shocked

BTW: DiD you see Adobe has issued a suite named Adobe CS ! ... CS! Are we going to sue, Carlo?
Legal action?

Shocked

seraph · Posted: Mon Nov 10, 2003 7:07 am Post subject:

and what about CSound?
there is no respect anymore......when I was young..... Shocked

seraph · Posted: Mon Nov 10, 2003 7:10 am Post subject:

Beyer Demonics 770 Pro are a little too close for me, I prefer (A)KGB K240 monitor 600 ohms (if you know what I mean Question

)

elektro80 · Posted: Mon Nov 10, 2003 7:26 am Post subject:

Of course I do. Shocked

elektro80 · Posted: Mon Nov 10, 2003 7:45 am Post subject:

jeff harrington · Joined: Nov 08, 2003 Posts: 84 Location: Brooklyn

elektro80 · Posted: Mon Nov 10, 2003 12:25 pm Post subject:

Well, no wonder those wizard animators use this line too. Shocked

mosc · Posted: Mon Nov 10, 2003 2:52 pm Post subject:

Great little article, Jeff. I must say I've been thinking about this beat/tonality thing quite a bit. In Xeroid Entity, an electronic music improvisational ensemble I'm in, we constantly deal with this. We don't get into the popular vs. academic thing. (Even though I have academic training, I'm not an academic, and unfortunately, not popular either. Laughing

)

This is maybe where IEM comes in, or maybe it's electro-music, as opposed to electro. Maybe we can start to define it.

There may be a beat, but not oppressive, monotonous, or incessant.
There may be tonality, but not mindless noodling in one key.
There are no stylistic requirements or exclusions.
There must be a recognizable degree of originality, but that is never the primary attribute.
Formula, especially when obvious, is avoided.
It may be minimalistic, but not boring.
It may be very complex, but not incomprehensible.
It stimulates the intellect, but only through the media of sound itself; verbal explanation is not required or needed.
The primary motivation for it's creation is the joy of creation.
There may be vocal components, but language is avoided as it limits universality.
Visual or narrative components are not required because the sound itself creates it's own imagery in the mind of the listener.
There is often sophisticated cleverness and craft, but not as a primary aspect for either the creator or the listener.
The listener is touched, moved, and inspired though a transcendental experience.

egw · Posted: Mon Nov 10, 2003 3:44 pm Post subject:

elektro80 · Posted: Tue Nov 11, 2003 1:44 am Post subject:

Did I just now read the "Howard manifesto"?

Very Happy

seraph · Posted: Tue Nov 11, 2003 4:07 am Post subject:

jeff harrington · Joined: Nov 08, 2003 Posts: 84 Location: Brooklyn