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 Forum index » Clavia Nord Modular » Wish List
Unison module
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dorremifasol



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PostPosted: Fri Dec 29, 2006 3:27 am    Post subject: Unison module
Subject description: probably in the fx area
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I haven't seen this requested before, so here it is.

The thing is that I haven't found yet a good way to make true unison patches (without using more than one slot).

A Unison module in the FX area where you could tell how the number of notes to use, the stereo spread amount and the detune amount would be really cool.

The module would need a pair of inputs (for the stereo mix) or just one for a mono input, and a pair of outputs for the final mix.

Well I'm talking about a true Unison feature using true polyphony, not an effect Smile

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jksuperstar



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PostPosted: Fri Dec 29, 2006 11:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

By disabling the KBT control, and using a "monokeyboard" module, you can achieve nice unison effects. In this example, the amount of detune is set by the Voice No., adjust it by turning the Pitch Modulation of OscB1. Also, the Random module B1, is in "Poly" mode, so each voice has a slight variation to the filter and pan effects.

On the keyboard or in the editor, change the voice count to see how the variation sounds. I can easily get 32 voices simultaneously on an expanded G2, though this example defaults to 4.

It's easy to forget in the G2, all voices and all slots are always making sound. It's up to envelopes and such to STOP sound, rather than the style of most synths that dynamically allocate voices to unused resources.


unison_example.pch2
 Description:
Patch to illustrate voices of one patch/slot in unison.

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 Filename:  unison_example.pch2
 Filesize:  1.32 KB
 Downloaded:  934 Time(s)

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dorremifasol



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PostPosted: Fri Dec 29, 2006 6:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Wow! Thank you very much for the example, it's really cool to have 32 saws screaming at once, sounds great.

Still, it would be nice having an unison module because this method doesn't allow to have polyphonic instruments. I'm thinking about an unison pad Smile

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jksuperstar



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PostPosted: Fri Dec 29, 2006 7:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

You could assign the "KB" control on the envelope & oscillators to MIDI, then enable/disable at will. Not that I'm discouraging your request, just pointing the work arounds out.
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dorremifasol



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PostPosted: Sat Dec 30, 2006 3:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Sorry I don't get it, how can I make a polyphonic instrument of 4 notes * 4 voices for example (that is, 16 voices in total)?. The method you described works very well for monophonic though. Very Happy
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Antimon



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PostPosted: Fri Jan 05, 2007 10:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

This is something that could be done fairly easily if there were a macro feature in the G2. You would encapsulate your patch in a macro, and then create, say 5 instances with varied frequencies.
Too bad...
/stefan

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cappy2112



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PostPosted: Fri Jan 05, 2007 2:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

dorremifasol wrote:
Wow! Thank you very much for the example, it's really cool to have 32 saws screaming at once, sounds great.

Still, it would be nice having an unison module because this method doesn't allow to have polyphonic instruments. I'm thinking about an unison pad Smile


So can we expect a new "Jump" patch in 2007? Smile
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jamos



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PostPosted: Fri Jan 05, 2007 3:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Isn't a polyphonic unison patch a contradiction.. a logical impossibility?

The G2 has lots of ways to stack oscillators and voices.. check the patch archives for details.

As for the macro-wishing from a few posts back: there's no need for macros to do this, just copy and paste all the voice modules and duplicate as necessary.
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ian-s



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PostPosted: Fri Jan 05, 2007 9:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

jamos wrote:
The G2 has lots of ways to stack oscillators and voices.. check the patch archives for details.


Here is another one.
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dorremifasol



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PostPosted: Sat Jan 06, 2007 12:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

That patch sounds great Ian, thanks Smile
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Antimon



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PostPosted: Sat Jan 06, 2007 5:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

jamos wrote:
Isn't a polyphonic unison patch a contradiction.. a logical impossibility?

The G2 has lots of ways to stack oscillators and voices.. check the patch archives for details.

As for the macro-wishing from a few posts back: there's no need for macros to do this, just copy and paste all the voice modules and duplicate as necessary.


On my Yamaha An1X you can turn on "unison", which means that one keypress will trigger 5 (i think) voices with slight frequency variations, creating a "fat" sound. Two keys will trigger 10 voices.

It is possible to copy/paste, but what if you find you want to change one module or change a filter setting? For 5 voice unison you'll have do every little thing 5 times. Macros would make this a less painful chore.

Stefan

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Blue Hell
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 06, 2007 7:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Antimon wrote:
..., but what if you find you want to change one module or change a filter setting?


Morphs, MIDI CC's and use of control inputs connected to a constant, use of module colors helps as well.

I know you knew that of course Very Happy And not at all meant to invalidate the macro idea (as I certainly would appreciate to have 'm), but macro's would require 'some' planning and housekeeping as well.

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Chrono



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PostPosted: Tue May 20, 2008 4:57 am    Post subject:   Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

That real unison sound can't be compared with any of those patches made above.

G2 should maybe implement unsion where Legato, Mono and voices can be selected. As unison isnt used as FX

For me this is an absolute must have... Recreating access virus TI leads are practically impossible.

So my request update the editor with an Unison option to turn on or off, as it acts different on the amount of Voices you select
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mosc
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PostPosted: Thu May 22, 2008 5:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Don't forget you can load the same patch in multiple slots. Performance mode is very useful sometimes.
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Chrono



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PostPosted: Thu May 22, 2008 11:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

i agree, the first thing wich came up to me was stacking a lot of osc's and modulate them differntly etc. That can result to some more clean sounds but on the other hand , unison combined with these same tunings doubles the power.

Do you think unison would be possible to implement in such complex system? I think a way just like in reaktor added up next to voice mode. And ye Pan Spread wich reacts with the voice combining.

Even if this would be the last update.. this really would make this system Complete! so nowadays users can easily get a full detuned sound without doing to much complex stackings. So you just need 1 osc module instead of 32
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ian-s



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PostPosted: Thu May 22, 2008 1:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Sneiter wrote:
Do you think unison would be possible to implement in such complex system?


Well yes, it is just another voice allocation mode. Like poly but each voice is triggered from a monophonic trigger/note value. They just need to add a control for the amount of detune. Probably why they didn't is the exact same thing can be patched using 2 or 3 existing modules. It's just not as convenient.


unison.pch2
 Description:

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 Filename:  unison.pch2
 Filesize:  1.59 KB
 Downloaded:  842 Time(s)

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Chrono



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PostPosted: Thu May 22, 2008 2:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

As its just an voice allocation mode in your words. Then why did they not add this in the first place like Korg ms20, Sequential prophet V, Access virus..

atm im reduced to the demo version becouse my g2 is replaced as i properbly mentioned to much allready (variation button 1 is stuck) Razz So if i use this patch on my expanded g2 and allocate more voices does this change the detune and voice allocation?

i will give an example for the specific purposes its about an original Warner Brothers movie theme

+12 semitones Detune on a 6 voice unison allocation. (My Unison Reaktor Movie Lifter.mp3)
is anyone capable reproducing this specific sound and motion without unison?

and just some notes from your unison g2 patch.. (your unsion g2 patch.mp3) (sry for the cheap playing)
if the demo version does not playback your patch as it should let me know. Becouse the more voices you add the more unison should interact, especially at extreme detunes. (octave)


My Unison Reaktor Movie Lifter.mp3
 Description:
Unison with Reaktor! +12 semitones detune with an envelope point draw system (warner brothers movie lifter)

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 Filename:  My Unison Reaktor Movie Lifter.mp3
 Filesize:  151.15 KB
 Downloaded:  378 Time(s)


Your Unison G2 patch.mp3
 Description:
your unison g2 patch on the demo version mono mode.

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 Filename:  Your Unison G2 patch.mp3
 Filesize:  85.02 KB
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Blue Hell
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PostPosted: Thu May 22, 2008 2:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Sneiter wrote:
if the demo version does not playback your patch as it should let me know.


No it doesn't as the demo plays one voice only.

The patch is setup to play twelve voices which are detuned from each other by using the "voice no" output from the status module and this is modulated by the note being played through the morph on OscDual's pitch sensitivity.

I don't have a keyboard connected, so I can't really make a recording of this but the example you posted should be doable.

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Blue Hell
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PostPosted: Thu May 22, 2008 2:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Ok, I changed the patch a little bit so it plays itself and I made a recording from that with zero unison to max and back to zero - this was using 12 voices.


g2ian-unison.mp3
 Description:

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 Filename:  g2ian-unison.mp3
 Filesize:  438.49 KB
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Chrono



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PostPosted: Fri May 30, 2008 4:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Quote:
The patch is setup to play twelve voices which are detuned from each other by using the "voice no" output from the status module and this is modulated by the note being played through the morph on OscDual's pitch sensitivity.


ill take a carefull look at the voice no output, and do some testing. I only used 6 voices tough.


i see, unfortunatly im still waiting for my modular... it didnt arrive today so will be next week on tuesday..... :S
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Chrono



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PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2008 12:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

About the movie lifter unison style....

i reproduced this

The more slots you use the more sound.


Movie Lifter.prf2
 Description:
Movie Lifter Performance.

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 Filename:  Movie Lifter.prf2
 Filesize:  8.69 KB
 Downloaded:  783 Time(s)

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dorremifasol



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PostPosted: Wed Dec 31, 2008 4:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Now I remember about the STACK function on the Nord Lead 3. This would be a much better implementation than the unison module. In fact I think it's an absolutely brilliant idea from Clavia.

It could be improved with a "stereo spread" value.

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Chrono



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PostPosted: Wed Dec 31, 2008 9:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Quote:
Now I remember about the STACK function on the Nord Lead 3. This would be a much better implementation than the unison module. In fact I think it's an absolutely brilliant idea from Clavia.

It could be improved with a "stereo spread" value.

That sounds interessting, im not sure how that works tough :p



Polyfonic Unison v1 (23 voices)
http://www.electro-music.com/forum/topic-31184.html

Mono Unison (32 voices)
http://www.electro-music.com/forum/topic-28361.html

Here you can download my Unison patches. The mono unison version has no bugs what so ever, but when you use polyfonic unison, each note press changes according to how many keys there can be played at the same time. So if i use 24 max voices, and 12 unison voices the note changes each note press. Its pretty difficult to explain, in this patch i made the bouncing notes unnoticable, you wont notice it too much. If you reduce or heavily detune unison voices the bouncing occurs sooner. If i know how to stabilize this, that would be a big step forward.
There are a lot smart guys here who might be able to figure this out Smile
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