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 Forum index » Clavia Nord Modular » G2 FAQ
Phase Cancleation Question
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Lfohead



Joined: Jul 29, 2009
Posts: 266
Location: Sweden
Audio files: 6
G2 patch files: 24

PostPosted: Sun Feb 24, 2013 12:11 am    Post subject: Phase Cancleation Question
Subject description: Phase Cancleation
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I know how to cancle out a sound, though it seems pretty useless with the "Inv" function on Mix2 1B. If the oscillator most be the exact same to get total phase cancleation.. If i use two oscillators it doesnt work or i get some phase cancleation.. Then i hypotheticly thought maybe the mixer is working like in serial mode and are delaying the sounds..

I grabbed a delay module, and tried delaying it to out of phase, a step closer but with no luck, also tried adding a level converter, and the same goes for that..

I also made a patch to show exactly what im talking about, and what im trying to achieve..


Lfohead Phase Cancleation.pch2
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varice



Joined: Dec 29, 2004
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Location: Northeastern shore of Toledo Bend
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 24, 2013 1:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Your patch proves that there is not a problem with the mixer module (switch selection 2 “works”). And what it also shows is that each G2 oscillator module runs independent of the others with any possible phase difference, even when producing the same pitch (switch selection 1). To get control of the waveform phase relationship between two or more oscillator modules, you need to use modules that have a sync input to force the oscillator waveform to start at a desired point.

For more information about this, check out these topics:

http://electro-music.com/forum/viewtopic.php?highlight=phase&t=51909

http://electro-music.com/forum/viewtopic.php?highlight=phase&t=23170

http://electro-music.com/forum/viewtopic.php?highlight=phase&t=55381

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Tim Kleinert



Joined: Mar 12, 2004
Posts: 1023
Location: Zürich, Switzerland
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 24, 2013 2:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

If you want consistent predictable phase relationship within a voice, you'll need oscillators with sync inputs, as varice already pointed out. Most commonly, the keyboard gate signal is patched into the sync inputs in order to restart the oscillators at every new keypress.

If you want consistent phase relationships polyphonically, meaning that multiple keystrokes on the same note will be in phase which each other and also in phase with the same note in other octaves (like in string machines and organs), this too is possible, although it takes quite a bit more effort. I nailed this problem here:

http://www.electro-music.com/forum/topic-52981.html

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Lfohead



Joined: Jul 29, 2009
Posts: 266
Location: Sweden
Audio files: 6
G2 patch files: 24

PostPosted: Mon Feb 25, 2013 1:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Thanks for ure answers guys, much appreciated..

Ive switched to Osc Phase Mod, which have Sync Input..

My first example that didnt work is now working which is amazing, though the 3rd one isnt working, in that example im trying to totaly phase cancle the fundamental.. Now switching Osc Phase Mod which only have Triangle Sine wave, im trying to cancle out the fundamental..

And i just realise one thing, even with KBD (Mono/Stereo) Gate, after many key presses it goes out sync then gets back..

And also if two different waveforms, with KBD Gate hooked to both Syncs..
The two wave forms are already not in phase without Mixer Inversion at Lin mode.. When Inverted it increases in loudness..

Ive tried all oscillators now wich sync input, no difference
Also just found out ConstantLevel works also as Gate..

Once again thanks alot for ure help guys!
I will read the links posted more throughly throughly..

Kind Regards / Lfohead
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