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 Forum index » Clavia Nord Modular » Nord Modular G2 Discussion
need Master Clock slower 30bpm ?
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FaschingsPrinz



Joined: Aug 24, 2010
Posts: 36
Location: Vienna
G2 patch files: 4

PostPosted: Fri Feb 02, 2018 10:35 pm    Post subject: need Master Clock slower 30bpm ? Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I would like to run my G2 with tempo slower then 30bpm, .. say 6bpm for very slowly evolving melodys I have developed over the last monthes.

Master Clock can only be set via CTRL+R or on G2s front direct from 30bpm to 240 bpm.

When I use CTRL+G I can set the G2 so it listens to external MIDI-clock when not checking the "ignore external clock" option. So I tried using the software-tool MIDIclock.com (free but stops every 3 minutes; for testing good enough) to generate a very slow external MIDI-clock and did send it via MIDI-cable to my G2.
But unfortunately it seams like that under 30bpm this generates hickups. Run- button starts to flicker.

I can use a ClockDivider module for the triggers in my patch to slow them down fractional (1/4, 1/8 ). No problem.

The problem are the LFOs I use in my patch.
Some of them are set to "CLK" at their rate option so they are in sync with the main tempo (1/16, 2/1, etc.)

I have got no idea how I could achive it to slow these "CLK"-rated LFOs down.

I found out that when I set the LFOs to "BPM" instead and send a negative value to its pitch-modulation-input I can slow the LFO down way more then the minimum adjustable 30bpm.
But signals on the pitch-modulation-input are ignored when the LFO is set to "CLK".

So I would have to derivate my own clock from the incoming MIDI-clock using the ClockGenerator module and somehow generate my own clock-signal when I manage to sync this to the incoming MIDI-clock, so its only running 1/4 or 1/8 of its speed.
But I have no idea how I can generate a slower running ClockGenerator-tempo which is synced to an incoming MIDI-MasterClock and after that somehow get/calculate a (negative) "rate" that I can send to the LFOs modulation-inputs to let them run in BPM-mode but getting CLK-like results ?

Any ideas, hints or other options that come to your minds ?

Thanx a lot in advance

_________________
"If I have an apple, and you have an apple, and we exchange apples, then you and I still have ONE apple.
But if I have an idea, and you have an idea, and we exchange ideas, then we BOTH have TWO ideas."
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Blue Hell
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Joined: Apr 03, 2004
Posts: 22425
Location: The Netherlands, Enschede
Audio files: 216
G2 patch files: 319

PostPosted: Sat Feb 03, 2018 3:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Hmm .. tricky.

Maybe the ZeroCount module (from the note tab) would settle fast enough to provide a rate control signal for all the LFO's?

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Electromagnetic Wave



Joined: Apr 28, 2013
Posts: 232
Location: Kebek
G2 patch files: 34

PostPosted: Sat Feb 03, 2018 8:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Hi!

My hardware sequencer can run at 1 BPM and you are right. G2 is not happy!

Hmmm ... replace LFO modules with ClkDiv + sequencer modules (draw the LFO waveform in sequencer)? Could be a bit of work. I don't know how big is your patches.
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Tim Kleinert



Joined: Mar 12, 2004
Posts: 1144
Location: Zürich, Switzerland
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G2 patch files: 236

PostPosted: Sun Feb 04, 2018 2:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I don't fully understand the objective.

Do you want clocked LFOs to respond correctly to a incoming MIDI clock stream that is below 30 BPM?
Or do you want to run everything on a higher BPM count and subdivide the corresponding clocked LFOs into smaller (i.e. faster) cycles?
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FaschingsPrinz



Joined: Aug 24, 2010
Posts: 36
Location: Vienna
G2 patch files: 4

PostPosted: Sun Feb 04, 2018 4:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

My band is running a drum computer.
Its giving out MIDI-clock, so all hardware-synths can sync to it.
Clock is running 80 bpm for example.

Im running a complex melody-generator on my G2 built over the last monthes.
I want it to run my G2 at 1/4 or 1/8 the speed of this clock for very (very) slow melodys that never the less should be in sync.

Clock is incoming with 80bpm, I want the G2 to run with a fractional speed of the incoming MIDI-clock. Say 1/4 of 80bpm so would be 20 bpm.

Dividing down all triggers in my G2 is of course not the problem.

But I have several LFOs running in CLK-mode - so they are synced to G2 tempo.
So if I let a LFO run with 8/1 CLK rate (slow), its running on the incoming MIDI-clock which is 80 bpm.

What I would like to achive is to let the LFOs run on 8/1 of 20bpm .. not 80bpm.
The only chance I see is to replace all CLK-synced LFOs with BPM driven LFOs that I set to a never changing tempo of say 120bpm and somehow calculate a (negative) value that I can feed to the rate-input of the LFO so its slowed down - since CLK-driven LFOs cant go slower then 30bpm.

_________________
"If I have an apple, and you have an apple, and we exchange apples, then you and I still have ONE apple.
But if I have an idea, and you have an idea, and we exchange ideas, then we BOTH have TWO ideas."
G.B.SHAW
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Tim Kleinert



Joined: Mar 12, 2004
Posts: 1144
Location: Zürich, Switzerland
Audio files: 7
G2 patch files: 236

PostPosted: Sun Feb 04, 2018 4:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

FaschingsPrinz wrote:
So if I let a LFO run with 8/1 CLK rate (slow), its running on the incoming MIDI-clock which is 80 bpm.

What I would like to achive is to let the LFOs run on 8/1 of 20bpm .. not 80bpm.

20BPM is 1/4 of 80BPM, so why not run your LFOs on 32/1 instead of 8/1?

I suspect I still don't understand the problem.
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FaschingsPrinz



Joined: Aug 24, 2010
Posts: 36
Location: Vienna
G2 patch files: 4

PostPosted: Sun Feb 04, 2018 4:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

.. you are right,
.. and I feel stupid.

I wanted the fraction of the division to be adjustable.
1/4, 1/2, or same speed as MIDI-clock.

But when I think about it I could make it fixed to say 1/4 on all modules without having it adjustable and that would be it. Clocked LFOs can stay clocked.
Solved.

Thank you,
thinking over-complicated is my middle-name.

PS.: By the way Tim, I tried using your division-patch "restodivision_tk_149.pch2" to get the proportion from the incoming MIDI-clock to a fixed running clock inside my G2 running 120 bpm to get the ratio between the indoming (unknown) speed and a reference clock running stable and thereof calcuate the rate I wanted to feed to the rate-input of the BPM-driven LFOs (with negative values) to slow it down.

_________________
"If I have an apple, and you have an apple, and we exchange apples, then you and I still have ONE apple.
But if I have an idea, and you have an idea, and we exchange ideas, then we BOTH have TWO ideas."
G.B.SHAW
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FaschingsPrinz



Joined: Aug 24, 2010
Posts: 36
Location: Vienna
G2 patch files: 4

PostPosted: Sun Feb 04, 2018 12:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Just to finish the topic:

Signals sent to rate-inputs on LFOs are summed with the value that is adjusted at the LFOs rate-knob.

Sending a value of -12 to the rate-input reduces the adjusted speed of a LFO by 1/2, -24 = 1/4, -36 = 1/8

So by using a Sw4-1 switch and setting up constant-value modules with 0, -12, -24, -36 attached to the 4 inputs and connecting the output of the switch to the rate-input on all LFOs I have been able to adjust the speed of the LFOs.
By using MIDI-CC sends I did send these values even across slots.

Thanx for the hints.
Seams I did just need a little push in the right direction.

_________________
"If I have an apple, and you have an apple, and we exchange apples, then you and I still have ONE apple.
But if I have an idea, and you have an idea, and we exchange ideas, then we BOTH have TWO ideas."
G.B.SHAW
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Electromagnetic Wave



Joined: Apr 28, 2013
Posts: 232
Location: Kebek
G2 patch files: 34

PostPosted: Sun Feb 04, 2018 10:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Quote:
Sending a value of -12 to the rate-input reduces the adjusted speed of a LFO by 1/2, -24 = 1/4, -36 = 1/8

After understanding what you were trying to do to solve the problem I did some tests with the rate-input. I came to the same conclusions as you.

I did not understand exactly what you were trying to do at first too. I had never done this kind of test with the rate-input and sync mode. I learned something new. Smile
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