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 Forum index » Clavia Nord Modular » Nord Modular G2 Discussion
Life's Been Good Synth Sound
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Derek Cook



Joined: Dec 30, 2005
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 19, 2006 3:48 am    Post subject:  Life's Been Good Synth Sound Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Hi,

I'm still getting to grips with this excellent synth and I am hoping some of the G2 gurus can give me some pointers.

My band are about to learn "Life's Been Good" by Joe Walsh, and I need to recreate the synth sound in the middle of the song that plays just before and during the guitar solo.

The most I've found out about it so far on the web is that it was an ARP 2500 with "resonant filter effects". I've messed about with some existing G2 patches, but so far haven't even come remotely close.

Does anybody have an idea of what would be a good starting point for getting this synth sound in the G2 engine? My ears aren't that good at listening to a synth sound and instantly picking out all the things that make it up unless it's really obvious! Smile

I'm of course more than happy to share the results with the community once its nailed.
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Tusker



Joined: Feb 03, 2005
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 19, 2006 5:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Do you have a snippet of the sound. It will make it easier for many of us to help you.

Jerry
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Derek Cook



Joined: Dec 30, 2005
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 20, 2006 12:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Thanks, But I'm not sure of the legalities of posting a snippet, not wanting to get the forum into trouble?

Is posting a snippet OK?
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mosc
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 20, 2006 2:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Please don't post a snippet of Joe Walsh's music on our site. We do not have a licence to host copyrighted music.
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seraph
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 20, 2006 3:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

mosc wrote:
Please don't post a snippet of Joe Walsh's music on our site

...or we'll be forced to bomb your embassy Wink

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deknow



Joined: Sep 15, 2004
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 20, 2006 6:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

hmmmm, if i posted an mp3 of an original patch to replicate the sound, would it be copyright infringment (like posting an unlicensed cover)?

btw, my recolection is that this was originally done on an arp odyssey. i believe it is a sample and hold thing, which must mean they did it once, and dubbed it over and over (as the s&h would not repeat itself as it does in the song). i'll try to put somethihg together later.

deknow
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elektro80
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 20, 2006 7:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

seraph wrote:
mosc wrote:
Please don't post a snippet of Joe Walsh's music on our site

...or we'll be forced to bomb your embassy Wink


WOT? No flag burning?

too much coffee too much coffee too much coffee

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deknow



Joined: Sep 15, 2004
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 20, 2006 10:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

ok, this isn't good enought to be copyright infringment Smile just futzing around in a hotel room (i'm sure i'd do better if i started with the odyssey, then ported to the g2). it is a start (and not much more).
deknow


lifes ok right now.pch2
 Description:

Download
 Filename:  lifes ok right now.pch2
 Filesize:  1.86 KB
 Downloaded:  939 Time(s)

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djfoxyfox
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 21, 2006 6:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

deknow wrote:
hmmmm, if i posted an mp3 of an original patch to replicate the sound, would it be copyright infringment (like posting an unlicensed cover)?
No, not at all. In this case, you are playing neither the actual, original sound recording nor the song, hence, no infringement. However, if you use your original sound to play the song and then post the song anywhere (like on the internet), then you are infringing on the copyright of the song... not because of the sound, but because you're performing the song. There are protections for (1) the composition and (2) the sound recording of the composition. Do not confuse these.
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deknow



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PostPosted: Tue Feb 21, 2006 7:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

bill, generally i totally agree. in this case, that synth lick is solo'd in the middle of the song, and it could be argued (i think) that my mp3 would be "an excerpt from the song"....a paralell might be the signature riff from "smoke on the water"...playing that lick _is_ playing part of the song.

deknow
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djfoxyfox
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 21, 2006 7:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

deknow wrote:
bill, generally i totally agree. in this case, that synth lick is solo'd in the middle of the song, and it could be argued (i think) that my mp3 would be "an excerpt from the song"....a [parallel] might be the signature riff from "smoke on the water"...playing that lick _is_ playing part of the song.
Of course. But if you don't play the lick, then you're not playing the song, or any portion thereof. The sound you use, therefore, becomes totally removed from both the song's copyright and the recording's copyright and you're in the clear.
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Derek Cook



Joined: Dec 30, 2005
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 21, 2006 1:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Well to be on the safe side, I won't post the snippet as per Howard's note, which I understand. Smile

deknow, thanks for that, I'll have a play some time and see if I can tweak it to what's on the record. My only concern is that you're using a sequence, and my attempts at persuading a drummer to follow anything other than their own rhythm have yet to bear success! Smile

Here's what I've come up with so far, based on taking one of the presets as a starting point. It's not very much like the actual sound, but it seems to work and is playable on the keyboard. I have a band practice on the weekend and we'll see how it goes then.

But if anybody has any ideas, it would be much appreciated.


Life's Been Good.prf2
 Description:
Pretty Poor Attempt at the Joe Walsh "Life's Been Good" synth sound.

Download
 Filename:  Life's Been Good.prf2
 Filesize:  4.14 KB
 Downloaded:  764 Time(s)

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cappy2112



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PostPosted: Tue Feb 21, 2006 4:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

mosc wrote:
Please don't post a snippet of Joe Walsh's music on our site. We do not have a licence to host copyrighted music.


Is it ok to post a link here, which points to another website which actually contains the mp3?
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cappy2112



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PostPosted: Tue Feb 21, 2006 4:35 pm    Post subject: Re: Life's Been Good Synth Sound Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Derek Cook wrote:
Hi,

I'm still getting to grips with this excellent synth and I am hoping some of the G2 gurus can give me some pointers.

My band are about to learn "Life's Been Good" by Joe Walsh, and I need to recreate the synth sound in the middle of the song that plays just before and during the guitar solo.




Derek

Try posing this question (without the actual mp3 attachment) to the Analog Heaven mailing list.
Google for analogue heaven, and you should find some info on subbing. If not, send me a PM.

Many questions of this nature have been posted there.
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deknow



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PostPosted: Tue Feb 21, 2006 8:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

...the original sound was _not_ made by playing the keyboard, but was done with the sample/hold module, and i presume (as i said before) was "looped" in the studio.

fyi, from http://www.synthtech.com/users.html
Quote:
Rock icon Joe Walsh has recently taken delivery of his 28 module system. Most people would not suspect that Joe studied electronics in college, and his hobby is restoring pre-1960 ham radios. His studio has many vintage synths, including a Moog 15, MemoryMoog, Juno-106 and the ARP Odyssey that played the famous sequence on "Life's Been Good To Me So Far". Maybe a new MOTM riff on the next Eagles CD?


bill, of course you are correct in general, but in this case, the "sound" is really also a sequence. certainly the original patch was "self playing", so an original patch that replicates this is probably technically a "cover". (to be more precise, the original patch played an unrepeating pattern...in the recording, it was trimmed to 2 bars) i don't think this is a big deal, but i'm not sure you are correct in this case (you may be, i only play a lawer on the internet). a paralell might be the synth part from "babba oriely" by the who.....the patch itself _is_ a sequence.

actually, this is kind of an interesting discussion (at least to me). the evolver has a "sweet dreams" preset (eurhythmics) which is pretty authentic (including the drums). if a "patch" is partly defined by a sequence (as in these examples...certainly the "sweet dreams" patch is very differant if you take out the sequencers and play it with a keyboard), then any patch that seeks to "replicate" the original (even if using differant techniques) must have a similar sequence, making it (in my mind) a cover. although the "patch programing" is unique, the "pattern" (which is part of the sound) is copywriten.

deknow
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cappy2112



Joined: Dec 24, 2004
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 22, 2006 12:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

deknow wrote:
...the original sound was _not_ made by playing the keyboard, but was done with the sample/hold module, and i presume (as i said before) was "looped" in the studio.

>>bill, of course you are correct in general, but in this case, the "sound" >>is really also a sequence. certainly the original patch was "self playing",

>>the who.....the patch itself _is_ a sequence.

deknow

Sounds like you're trying to say noodle, without actually saying it Wink
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deknow



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PostPosted: Wed Feb 22, 2006 12:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

mmm, i specifically avoided saying noodle. to me, a self playing sampleandhold patch is a simple system. noodles seem much more dynamic to me. i don't think anyone has posted a "noodle" that is this simple to em.

deknow
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Tusker



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PostPosted: Wed Feb 22, 2006 8:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I'm sorry for suggesting something inappropriate in my ignorance.

mosc wrote:
Please don't post a snippet of Joe Walsh's music on our site. We do not have a licence to host copyrighted music.


Jerry
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cappy2112



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PostPosted: Wed Feb 22, 2006 8:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Tusker wrote:
I'm sorry for suggesting something inappropriate in my ignorance.

mosc wrote:
Please don't post a snippet of Joe Walsh's music on our site. We do not have a licence to host copyrighted music.


Jerry


is 10 seconds of a copyrighted track inappropriate?
How about 3 seconds?
Does the law draw the line anywhere reasonable?
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elektro80
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 22, 2006 8:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

cappy2112 wrote:
Tusker wrote:
I'm sorry for suggesting something inappropriate in my ignorance.

mosc wrote:
Please don't post a snippet of Joe Walsh's music on our site. We do not have a licence to host copyrighted music.


Jerry


is 10 seconds of a copyrighted track inappropriate?
How about 3 seconds?
Does the law draw the line anywhere reasonable?


No, there is no limit as such. If the piece can be recognised or if it is identified it is a violation. In most cases it would also be a violation even if you had say mangled the piece beyond recognition or whatever. Shocked

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PostPosted: Thu Feb 23, 2006 8:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

It is especially dangerous if one identifies a snippet. If you post something and say "this is a snippet of Joe Walsh's music", then it is clear and unambiguous. Such a thing could be picked up by a search engine.

If you compose a track and your recording includes a short snippet you steal from someone else then that's illegal for sure, but if you don't point it out it may never be observed.

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