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 Forum index » Clavia Nord Modular » Nord Modular G2 Discussion
'Perfect' Bands?
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monobass



Joined: Nov 30, 2004
Posts: 275
Location: UK
G2 patch files: 12

PostPosted: Fri Jun 02, 2006 6:11 am    Post subject:  'Perfect' Bands? Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Hello all,

I've been trying to achieve something this morning, to accurately split a signal into 3 distinct bands of frequency, Bass, Mid and Hi.

My aim being that when these 3 bands are summed they sound identical to the original. This much I have achieved in the patch attached.

The modulation wheel is controlling the green fade module which at it's low value lets you hear the original, at it's highest value let's you hear the sum of the three distinct bands. They sound identical.

I created the bands in this sequence:

'Bass' = lo pass on Original
'Mid & Hi' = Original + Inv 'Bass'
'Hi' = hi pass on 'Mid & Hi'
Mid = 'Mid & Hi' + Inv 'Hi'

But if you start to change the balance of the three distinct bands (yellow module) you will start to hear artifacts and phase effects, which I presume are due to the way the EQ modules work or due to sample delay issues.

Is there a more accurate way to do this band seperation?
Is this where we come into the realms of the 'allpass' filter?

Thanks

Steve


3 Band Test Steve.prf2
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 Filename:  3 Band Test Steve.prf2
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paul e.



Joined: Sep 22, 2003
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 02, 2006 8:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

are you hearing comb filtering effects perhaps...? just taking a guess...but if so, then that would be pretty hard to avoid
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monobass



Joined: Nov 30, 2004
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G2 patch files: 12

PostPosted: Sat Jun 03, 2006 2:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

paul e. wrote:
are you hearing comb filtering effects perhaps...? just taking a guess...but if so, then that would be pretty hard to avoid


If you open up the patch and then simply turn the mid volume knob all the way down and up you can hear the effect. Especially the way it seems to get quietest at about 10% on the knob and then actually louder at zero. I guess it's something to do with the crossover of the EQ's.

It's not a terrible thing, I'm just interested in why it happens and I'm sure there are many ways of achieving the effect I'm after.

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Kassen
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Joined: Jul 06, 2004
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 03, 2006 4:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Probably there are many ways but problems in this field tend to involve very hard math. Just this afternoon I saw some equations involving complex numbers (those aren't all that bad, at least I understand the concept) and mathematical signs I never saw before (that always means trouble).

I'm nowhere near a G2 editor right now but 10% sounds like a lot, that probably means something is wrong. This effect in general is simply something you may have to live with or switch to FIR filtes (which would likely be on a computer). I recomend doing what most eq desigener seem to do; pick settings that sound reasonable for most realistic applications.

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Jason



Joined: Aug 12, 2004
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 03, 2006 5:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

interesting stuff.
But why is this a performance out of curiousity and not just a patch?
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monobass



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PostPosted: Sat Jun 03, 2006 5:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Jason wrote:
interesting stuff.
But why is this a performance out of curiousity and not just a patch?


I always start every patch as a performance, as I find everything generally ends up as one anyway! Smile

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Jason



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PostPosted: Sat Jun 03, 2006 5:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Right on! Just wondering, I havent really made perfs.
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Tim Kleinert



Joined: Mar 12, 2004
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 04, 2006 3:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Isn't it this what you are looking for?
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monobass



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PostPosted: Sun Jun 04, 2006 12:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

tim wrote:
Isn't it this what you are looking for?


Aha, Thanks!

Phase Linear is what i'm after, unfortuantely when I try and download Rob's patch it just hangs though.

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jksuperstar



Joined: Aug 20, 2004
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 04, 2006 4:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I just downloaded & opened, ok for me.
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monobass



Joined: Nov 30, 2004
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 04, 2006 4:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

jksuperstar wrote:
I just downloaded & opened, ok for me.


Ah yeah working fine now, electro-music as a whole was really chugging but seems fine now.

Actually I'm quite impressed with myself that my solution was very close to Rob's Smile I had just used a hi-pass for the hi-end rather than subtracting the lo-pass, which was causing the slight crossover artifacts.

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