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 Forum index » Discussion » Diversity in electro-music
Very few women applicants to electro-music 2008
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mosc
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 05, 2008 8:41 am    Post subject:  Very few women applicants to electro-music 2008 Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

A couple of days ago Greg and I reviewed all of the applications for participation for electro-music 2008 to be held this year in Kingsport, TN in mid August. We were struck by the apparent lack of women applicants. We will have some great musicians to be sure, but as far as we can tell, nearly all male.

I'm not exactly sure why this is. We can't very well ask people who didn't apply. We can speculate, but we've already done a bit of that.

I'm thinking next time we should actively recruit people.

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liquidpaper



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PostPosted: Fri Jun 20, 2008 12:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Maybe they didn't want to, or didn't know about it? I'm not sure. In any event, I'd focus on putting together the best possible event you can. Then the rest will fall into place. That's only my opinion, but unless you've turned people down specifically because they are female (which it seems you haven't), I wouldn't worry about it.

That is, unless you're concerned about it because you're into girls and want to get lucky . . . but I won't open that can of worms Very Happy .
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 20, 2008 12:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

liquidpaper wrote:

That is, unless you're concerned about it because you're into girls and want to get lucky . . .


Pffff, for a big hunk like Mosc luck has nothing to do with it.

;¬)

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ramechling



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PostPosted: Thu Aug 07, 2008 7:19 am    Post subject: Electro Ladies
Subject description: Did YOU invite any ?
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Probably I'm not the only one who invited "Electro-Ladies" to the Festival ?
1. Ms. Alex Shapiro was delightd to hear of the 'Woodstock of E-M' and sent us her best wishes.
She is busy "spending the Summer putting the finishing touches on ALEXTRONICA". http://www.alexshapiro.org/#News

2. Ms. Laurie Spiegel was thrilled to hear of the Festival and see Cynthia's whopper modular on the e-m.com site...
She was thankful that I intend to bring along her CD, 'OBSOLETE SYSTEMS' and confessed that she was rapidly becoming an obsolete system herself ! http://retiary.org/ls/
Here is a photo she sent of a rusty monster:


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 15, 2008 4:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

wow that's an awesome picture.

is it just me, or does the dearth of female electro-musicians seem to be related to the lack of repeat performances by female electro-musicians? for example, everyone loves Amy X but she's not a regular. I recall really liking Margaret Noble's set last year, too, but as far as I know she's not here this year.

an audit of past participants by gender would reveal a more scientific figure. it seems that % of female participants who are repeat participants vs. the % of male participants who are repeat participants is a really low ratio.

i don't really know why this might be. i love this kind of event and arriving at electro-music feels like a sort of homecoming for me. but perhaps the more typical female experience is one of feeling emotionally disconnected from the spirit of the event, even while being musically and technically engaged in it.

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PostPosted: Fri Aug 15, 2008 4:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

ps. berae (who performed with project ruori last year) and tina (who performed with us two years ago) both wanted to come this year but circumstances prevented it. berae's suggestions and feedback were also a big part of our set this year. so that's two more females who are here in spirit, thought not in body.
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 16, 2008 6:40 am    Post subject: an addendum... Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

an addendum to my previous post...

perhaps the low attendance of the events by female musicians has something to do with travel expenses? for example, if women have trouble finding other women for musical partnerships, they might be more inclined to be solo artists. travel costs come down much harder on individuals traveling alone than on groups who can split the cost of hotel rooms, etc.

this may be further compounded by the fact that women might be more afraid to accept couchsurfing offers from locals, or to make such offers themselves if they live near the event location. so even if they do attend, they're less likely to share rides/accommodations and therefore they miss out on the bonds of friendship that are formed through those types of cooperation.

i'm lucky enough to have been introduced to this event by my fiance smokris, so obviously i feel comfortable traveling with him. but that means that i am part of this community because of the aggressively encouraging help of a man. when i felt shy or uncomfortable contributing, he more or less forced me to sit down with a sequencer or whatever and get to know it.

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 17, 2008 5:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Can we get a list going here of how many female artists attended?

I didn't catch any sets this year that involved women, though I did talk to Earth Girl about her music, and I performed with project ruori, which also involves Steve's sister Ashley. Genevive told me that OVO and Spacecraft both performed with female members as well – if any of you are reading this, it would be great if you could post a little synopsis of your set, your involvement in electro-music, and your role within your group (if applicable).

Also, to expand the focus from just women to other underrepresented groups, I noticed that once again, DJROCK was (I think) the only person of color who went on stage. I encouraged him to start posting more – DJROCK, if you're reading this, it would be sweet if you could weigh in on this topic here or in another thread or something.

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 18, 2008 5:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

bbinkovitz wrote:
Can we get a list going here of how many female artists attended?

I didn't catch any sets this year that involved women, though I did talk to Earth Girl about her music, and I performed with project ruori, which also involves Steve's sister Ashley. Genevive told me that OVO and Spacecraft both performed with female members as well – if any of you are reading this, it would be great if you could post a little synopsis of your set, your involvement in electro-music, and your role within your group (if applicable).


Beth Binkovitz (project ruori)
Ashley Mokris (project ruori)
Diane Timmons (SpaceCraft)
Jeannie Allen (Earthgirl)
Bernice Murrey-Greer (O.V.O.)
Hong Waltzer (Azimuth Visuals)

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 18, 2008 5:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

bbinkovitz wrote:
Also, to expand the focus from just women to other underrepresented groups, I noticed that once again, DJROCK was (I think) the only person of color who went on stage. I encouraged him to start posting more – DJROCK, if you're reading this, it would be sweet if you could weigh in on this topic here or in another thread or something.


You must have missed Kevin Spears - His brilliant set was a highlight for me. Also his Kalimba workshop was popular.

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 18, 2008 9:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

egw wrote:

You must have missed Kevin Spears - His brilliant set was a highlight for me. Also his Kalimba workshop was popular.


I missed a lot of people's sets while ruori was frantically trying to finish preparing ours. Crying or Very sad I didn't catch Kevin Spears. Does he post on the forum?

I just found his myspace ( http://www.myspace.com/kevinspears ) and am listening now. I'm really sad I missed this! It seems his presence expanded the diversity of the types of music represented as well as to the racial diversity of the participants (which is one of the reasons that I think racial and other types of participant diversity matters – people from different groups often bring different musical experiences).

BTW I just listened to Earth Girl's myspace too ( http://www.myspace.com/earthgirlvibes ) and I highly recommend it.

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 18, 2008 11:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

egw wrote:
You must have missed Kevin Spears - His brilliant set was a highlight for me. Also his Kalimba workshop was popular.

I only got to sit in the theater for full sets at various times on Saturday, because of my other activities. Hong's visuals were out of this world!

I was doing the stream during Kevin's performance, and twice I had to run in to see how he was getting some of those sounds.

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Blue Hell
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 18, 2008 12:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Didn't have too much time this year unfortunately to hang out on the stream, but did hear a couple of things - Kevin was one one oft the highlights for me (and AI coming in on the chat of course Very Happy )
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 20, 2008 1:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Howdy all

djrock3k sticking my head thru the door to check in with my perspective.
As this is a forum on diversity and I was one of three persons of color at EM08. If I recall correctly, I was the one of two persons of color at EM06.

My personal opinion is that inclusivity starts with information dispersal. If you don't hear about something, you usually don't attend it. Advertising is the key to varied participation. If you want to go badly enough, you'll find a way. Gotta hear about it first, tho'.

Was EM adequately marketed to a varied populace, or was it preaching to the choir? Sites such as MusicThing and CreateDigitalMusic/Motion are widely read, I don't remember a word about EM on them. Perhaps Hong can put together a clip reel and inform them of the proceedings.

Philly is a great DJ culture town. I almost brought my system to show how a modern DJ is can actually be an electronic musician in performance. There needs to be more interface with the various DJ-related establishments (record stores, equipment stores) to bring in the wider and varied audience we're talking about.

I know how hard it can be, I'm the VP of PSFS, the local science fiction society. You would think that a futuristic group like that would be all over "music from the future" , but alas, no. We have our own problems in marketing, on the contact side. I doing all I can to open up the membership base, but it is a chore. One that pays off, thankfully.

Enough from me. Questions? Advice?
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 20, 2008 3:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

djrock3k wrote:

Was EM adequately marketed to a varied populace, or was it preaching to the choir? Sites such as MusicThing and CreateDigitalMusic/Motion are widely read, I don't remember a word about EM on them. Perhaps Hong can put together a clip reel and inform them of the proceedings.


That's a good point. Smokris didn't put anything up on kineme.net about it until well after it was too late to submit applications. It just didn't occur to us to try to advertise for it until shortly before we went. I don't think we posted anything to fdiv.net or ruori.org about it at all.

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 20, 2008 5:20 pm    Post subject: electro-women
Subject description: here's my two cents
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Hey all, I'm a very infrequent poster, but, Beth inspires me.
So, there are more electro-women than ever before, but they are the ones that clean the floor! (as well as make amazing music) So, I just wanted to represent and say, that although I handle the non-musical tasks at the event, I am a musician! When Hong and I are there, we are working, but we are repeat electro-women too! And I think sexism exists loud and clear at electro-music, even though I love everyone. So, lets acknowledge it! I will be working hard for E-M 09 in Oakland to be more diverse than ever by advertising in alternative press that reach all the kinds of electro's we have here in the bay. But never stop the discussion!
Peace and Love to All!

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 03, 2008 2:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

could you point out some major disadvantages women have in the electro music scene? of course i am a slave to my genes, but since i have a general lack of affection for the populace (might be genetic, too), i see all people as people. might have something to do with education, we germans are over-correct when it comes to those gender-things. i find it sad that people still deem it necessary to vent so much air about things i just see as, well, part of normal everyday life. i really like how things turned out in the last few years, and it is totally correct to treat women as equals (and i mean not only in the positive meaning; in my job, its often the case that i swear at women and they swear back).

if they (people) are good in what they do, i simply dont bother with appearances. time is just too short for that. so i would be glad if somepone could point me out to some experiences you might have had. (the spill is a bad story in that department, i wouldnt have helped anybody with that Razz )

tia gus

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 05, 2008 10:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

abreaktor wrote:
could you point out some major disadvantages women have in the electro music scene?


I don't know if there are any specific disadvantages, I just was making an observation. There seem to be fewer women than men rock musicians also.

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Lorenzo



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PostPosted: Tue Nov 25, 2008 2:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Miquette Giraud !?

she plays/ed with: Gong, Steve Hillage, System 7

W/ Hillage 1

W/ Hillage 2 (analog orgy!)

W/ System 7 (Steve Hillage & Miquette Giraud - 2005!!)

Gong Reunion 2006
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Kin



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PostPosted: Tue Feb 03, 2009 8:10 am    Post subject:   Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Hi, i'm female & deffinately hoping to get more involved in electronic music. It's exciting! I'm currently trying to think of ways to save up for a dream minimoog voyager or perhaps a dave smith prophet 08... I'd really like one ultimate hardware synth so i can get into live performing with my other half. hardware would be much more satisfactory for live stuff than my current midi keyboard & funny old PC tower. I like recording sounds from nature & messing about with them for jamming, except i gotta do more!
It is an interesting topic this women in electronic music thing. I went to an Autechre gig last year which was cool, deffinately mainly blokes there but there were a few female species around.
Do you think there has been some kind of social conditioning through history which has made a higher proportion of women more technophobic and therefore less likely to be involved in using technologically orientated musical instruments? Perhaps a higher proportion of women go for an intuitive approach to music (eg singing) because there is a more immediate outlet for expression. Although obviously a synthesizer can be just as intuitive (but the sight of all those nobs doesn't look it!) you do firstly have to know its technicalities, i'm still learning all this. It's just an illusion that technology should be associated with maleness because technology can be just as female. You just have to get past the hard male techno surfaces to bring out the inside female creative part of technology.... or something...
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 03, 2009 11:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Kin wrote:

Do you think there has been some kind of social conditioning through history which has made a higher proportion of women more technophobic and therefore less likely to be involved in using technologically orientated musical instruments?.


My own diffuse impression is actually that it is the other way around! I feel a fair amount of the female artists that have caught my eye have either had a more or less experimental approach that often involves electronic instruments (names that pop up in my head are Kate Bush, Stereolab, Delia Derbyshire, Juana Molina).

It's not a dominant fraction of the group of all female artists, but then it's not a domanint fraction among the men either. The thing is there are less visible female artists altogether.

/Stefan

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 20, 2011 6:32 am    Post subject: Re: electro-women
Subject description: here's my two cents
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genevieve wrote:
Hey all, I'm a very infrequent poster, but, Beth inspires me.
So, there are more electro-women than ever before, but they are the ones that clean the floor! (as well as make amazing music) So, I just wanted to represent and say, that although I handle the non-musical tasks at the event, I am a musician! When Hong and I are there, we are working, but we are repeat electro-women too! And I think sexism exists loud and clear at electro-music, even though I love everyone. So, lets acknowledge it! I will be working hard for E-M 09 in Oakland to be more diverse than ever by advertising in alternative press that reach all the kinds of electro's we have here in the bay. But never stop the discussion!
Peace and Love to All!


Genevieve:

I would love to hear your music. There have been many woman who have made great contributions to electronic music in the past. I did notice the lack of woman performing at Electro Music but at least on my part it's not for lack of wanting to hear their music.

You were a great host at Electro Music, much thanks. But perhaps next year we can hear more of your music.
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 20, 2011 6:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I thought it most appropriate to post this web site on Dehlia Derbyshire who made great contributions to electronic music:

http://www.delia-derbyshire.org/
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 22, 2011 5:19 pm    Post subject: does anyone still post here? Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I don't see too many up-to-date threads. Does anyone still read this forum?

I want to give a shout out to Beth Binkovitz...I think I saw you at E-M 2011 but I didn't have a chance to talk much. Hi! As usual you & me were among the only women performers there, or did I miss someone?

I missed seeing a few of the others I met before, like EarthGirl, Tanya and Rebecca Mercuri (the bent doctors.)

If any of them are reading, say hello!

I did a set with my extremely talented son Aaron, who taught me a heck of a lot about MIDI and electronic music. Of course next year he wants to do his own set, which means (gulp) I will have to hit the big time, "man up" and do my own full length set, all by myself! (unless I can find someone who will do a set with me.)

laura woodswalker

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 23, 2011 10:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I read it when there's anything new here to read, sure.

And yeah, there were a couple others. Project Ruori also had Tina and Jaymie; there was Amber, the cellist from PAS; the dude from Mirador's girlfriend (both of whose names I'm totally blanking on) was there with him, mostly doing visuals, but played a bit as well...

Cheers,
Adam / onewayness
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