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 Forum index » Instruments and Equipment » Alesis Andromeda
Record knob movements on ableton 9 ?
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pixel



Joined: Jun 03, 2014
Posts: 6
Location: Israel

PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2014 6:56 pm    Post subject: Record knob movements on ableton 9 ? Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Hey guys ... Im a happy new owner of an andromeda Smile

so , as I am stil in the reading/learning/adapting phase I've got couple of questions


1. I've noticed that the unit only sends out midi notes and ribbon ... but what if i'd like to record other knobs as well ??? i read here that it sends sysex massages instead of CC values ... so , is there a way to record those massages into the DAW (Ableton) ?


2. trying to understand the voices behavior :
when i press one key , on mono mode i see that only 1 voice is being used ... but when i switch it to poly mode , i see and hear that 2 voices are being used , with only one note pressesd
(unison off , and chord disabled of course)
any ideas ??

tnx

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Last edited by pixel on Wed Jun 04, 2014 11:51 pm; edited 1 time in total
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soundwave106



Joined: Nov 24, 2004
Posts: 322
Location: Elmo's Mud Wrestling Club
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2014 5:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

A) The Andromeda send and receives NRPNs, which aren't Sysex per se but a special type of MIDI message made up of combined control change data packets.

From what I can Google, unfortunately there is no direct support in Ableton for NRPNs. (Which is a shame, because many other synthesizers use NRPNs these days -- optionally, in some cases like the DSI gear -- to get around the 7 bit limitation for CCs.)

I see that someone has created a Max For Live patch for handling NRPN *transmission*, and I found a small NRPN to CC translator. Maybe these will help.

That being said, if you don't need to directly manipulate the data (which would be kind of difficult unless you can instantly think in MSB / LSB terms Smile ) and your DAW can capture *any* arbitrary CC, all you would need to do is capture and re-transmit 4 MIDI control change numbers: 98, 99, 6, and 38.

2) I guess the first question is, what is the envelope behavior? Two voices may be used in poly mode even though one voice is triggered (if the other voice is decaying). Only one voice should be triggering at a time though unless you've got unison detune or a MIDI loop going on...
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pixel



Joined: Jun 03, 2014
Posts: 6
Location: Israel

PostPosted: Thu Jun 05, 2014 12:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Thank u Soundwave ...
ya , it is an Ableton limitation ... quite the bummer .
i could record and playback the a6 knobs in cubase without any probs ...

so, trying to get a way around that :

that M4L device should handle sending NRPN from Ableton to the A6 , but i couldnt find where to get the list of parameters and their corresponding values . any idea if I can somehow monitor it ? in Ableton or cubase ...
same goes for the other NPRN device .. it is a kind of a converterto CC ...
so ill ned to have the NRPN table for using it .

about my other issue - u were right it was some kind of a midi loop ... note data was being sent twice at the same time , from the A6 keyboard and from the Daw (monitoring the midi) .. Thnaks for that tip :


Edit : Ok , I found the NRPN PARAMETER CHART PDF
trying to figure out to use it without any luck yet ....
so for example i wanna automate filter 2 cutoff :
in the pdf it has 2 values :
Parent(MSB) - 19
and Child(LSB) - 0

i tried puttin 1900 or 190 as NRPN ctlr# but no movement received on the a6.

Im certain that the a6 side is configured right cuz it works on cubase both sending and receiving ...

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soundwave106



Joined: Nov 24, 2004
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 05, 2014 10:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

pixel wrote:
in the pdf it has 2 values :
Parent(MSB) - 19
and Child(LSB) - 0


If you have to convert this to a single number, I believe that the formula you would use is (MSB*128) + LSB.

So in this case the parameter number would be 2432. (eg, ((19 * 128) + 0).)
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pixel



Joined: Jun 03, 2014
Posts: 6
Location: Israel

PostPosted: Sun Jun 08, 2014 3:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Yes !!!

Thanks for the input ...
i can control now every parameter on the A6 !
and record automations thru any midi controller (not the A6 tho)

so , Im building now an Ableton midi effect rack to function as a controller / editor for the A6 , with almost all of the panel's knobs ...

ill share it here in a day or 2 Smile

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sonik777



Joined: May 29, 2014
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 09, 2014 7:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

!

Ableton 9 is really the only DAW I use. If you get that effect rack working I'd love to give it a try. Very cool pixel!

I initially came here looking for an editor/librarian for the A6. Still kinda curious what the best options are out there ???
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pixel



Joined: Jun 03, 2014
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Location: Israel

PostPosted: Sat Jun 14, 2014 4:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Sonik77 , Sorry i was out of the studio all week ...

So , Ya - i git it to work ... yay Smile

the M4L device i was using for it had a little bug that was causing strange behavior on a long automations ...

i wrote the the guy who made it and he fixed it ... now i just have to reprogram it ... ill post it here asap Smile

Cheers ..

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pixel



Joined: Jun 03, 2014
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 15, 2014 11:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

ok , Here a Midi effect Rack to Control the A6 ... Using M4L device to send NRPN (by Gostavo Bravetti)

Each chain in the rack is like a "page" with 8 knobs :

OSC page :
Osc1 : Semi , Pitch Env , FM , Pre mix Volume
Osc2 : Semi , Pitch Env , Sync , Pre mix Volume

Filters :
F1 : Cutoff , Res , Env , Post mix level
F2 : Cutoff , Res , Env , Post mix level

Post Filter mix : LP1 , HP , BP , LP2, Pre filter

Envelopes (1-3) : A , D1 , D2 , S , R1 , R2


At the moment there is that bug ,
When u draw a long automation line It overloads the A6 with data ( i think) and gets it to some kind of a weird "slow motion behavior"
if anyone have any idea how to fix that : PLEASE DO

( i guess it needs some kind of a NRPN transmiting Filter , like the one in the Global - Panel page)

other then that it works perfect for recording knob movements from any midi controller or the actual Macro knobs (via the mouse)

hope u find it useful ...
Cheers .


Andy remote.zip
 Description:
A6 Midi effect rack for Ableton

Download
 Filename:  Andy remote.zip
 Filesize:  28.37 KB
 Downloaded:  24 Time(s)


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sonik777



Joined: May 29, 2014
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 15, 2014 11:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Thanks pixel you rock!

I'll test it out and let you know if I have any issues. Unfortunately I know next to nothing about coding.
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pixel



Joined: Jun 03, 2014
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 21, 2014 6:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

My pleasure ... Smile

Are u experiencing that slow motion thing as well ??
im wondering maybe its behaving different with different midi interfaces /setups ... let me know pls ..

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ProFete



Joined: Aug 29, 2012
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 05, 2014 3:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

exellent, i will try now
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sonik777



Joined: May 29, 2014
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Location: Detroit

PostPosted: Sat Jul 12, 2014 4:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

pixel wrote:
My pleasure ... Smile

Are u experiencing that slow motion thing as well ??
im wondering maybe its behaving different with different midi interfaces /setups ... let me know pls ..


I've been out backpacking for the past few weeks so haven't had a chance. Now I gotta catch up on other stuff, hopefully soon I can really try it out.
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sonik777



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PostPosted: Tue Jul 29, 2014 4:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Damn, still haven't had a chance, and now I'm going up north for a couple weeks. Always somethin!
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sonik777



Joined: May 29, 2014
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 20, 2014 10:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Ok I gave it a shot.

I must be doing something wrong because while the device will load the device knobs don't transmit to my A6.


Dumb question, but what exactly is the step by step install process for this?


I'm running my midi through a hub.


Thanks!
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