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 Forum index » Instruments and Equipment » MIDI Controllers and Interfaces
Fantasy MIDI controller
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Dovdimus Prime



Joined: Jul 26, 2004
Posts: 664
Location: Bristol, UK
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 02, 2005 2:35 am    Post subject: Fantasy MIDI controller Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Hi all

I have this idea for a great MIDI controller. I don't know what's out there, so I was hoping someone would be able to tell me if it, or something like it, exists.

Okay, so it's a box with some knobs on, like a PhatBoy or similar. Each of the knobs can be assigned independently to any MIDI parameter on any channel of any device in the MIDI chain. Each knob has a read out to show the parameter value, either a numeric one or a dot of light which moves around the knob. If the parameter value is changed elsewhere (e.g. by the sequencer), the readout changes on this box too. Each knob also has an LED display where you can type in a parameter name, an existing one or a made-up one (e.g. 'Wibbliness').

Here's the crucial bit. At the end of a session, if you have changed the settings, you can dump them via Sysex to your sequencer. Similarly, at the beginning of the session you dump settings from the sequencer and this baby's ready to go, all parameters named and all readouts displaying the current parameter values.

So tell me, does this thing already exist? If not, what's the closest thing? Any MIDI hardware manufacturers want to take me up on building this thing?

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Kassen
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Joined: Jul 06, 2004
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 02, 2005 6:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Hi, Dovdimus, I think there are quite a few modern ones that can do this but I'm not completely up to date in that field so I'll leave naming them to others.

I did move this to the "midi controler" section because the "midi controler" section was all sad and lonely by itself.

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gomidas



Joined: Jul 09, 2004
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 02, 2005 6:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I think a BEHRINGER BCR2000 could do the job.
http://www.behringer.com/BCR2000/index.cfm?lang=ENG
Wink
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mosc
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 02, 2005 7:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

The BCR2000 does it all, but there is no LCD panel to indicate the name of the parameter. But there is an erasable strip you can write on.
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mosc
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 02, 2005 7:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

This one may be just the ticket. http://electro-music.com/forum/topic-1140.html
Posted Image, might have been reduced in size. Click Image to view fullscreen.

Or, probably the best one is to get a G2 keyboard. At bit more expensive, but look what you get with the MIDI controller. Cool

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Dovdimus Prime



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PostPosted: Tue Aug 02, 2005 8:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Thanks guys! That was really really helpful. I think the Behringer jobby is reasonably priced, but being able to name the parameters would be really useful.

The other one looks well good, but I couldn't believe how expensive it was! I don't see how it will compete in the market with the Behringer. I haven't even worked out how to save up for the soft synth I want to control with it yet!!

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jksuperstar



Joined: Aug 20, 2004
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 02, 2005 8:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I just finished this controller last night, designed by yours truely, with the OS designed by a friend. 4 buttons, 4 knobs, 1 joystick...4 pages of controller info. MIDI dumps is (currently) how we store it's data.


lil_buddy2.JPG
 Description:
Lil' MIDI Buddy : Custom MIDI Controller w/ 4 btns, 4 encoders, 1 joystick
 Filesize:  66.24 KB
 Viewed:  8812 Time(s)

lil_buddy2.JPG



Last edited by jksuperstar on Tue Aug 02, 2005 8:51 am; edited 2 times in total
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mosc
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 02, 2005 8:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

The good thing about the Behringer is that there are millions out there already. If an instrument developer is going to support external MIDI controllers, they most probably will include Behringer. They have become the gold standard very quickly. Congrats to them for that.
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mosc
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 02, 2005 8:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Woah, Mr, Superstar. Tres cool. Cool
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jksuperstar



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PostPosted: Tue Aug 02, 2005 8:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

The neice thing is that it fits in that "Red" space on the G2 Smile Smile So I have a Joystick now, and 4 volume controls (1 for each slot) always accessible.
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mosc
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 02, 2005 9:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Are you going to share the design and the software? Looks like you have a nice general purpose DIY MIDI controller platform.
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Kassen
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 02, 2005 9:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Dovdimus Prime wrote:

The other one looks well good, but I couldn't believe how expensive it was! I don't see how it will compete in the market with the Behringer. I haven't even worked out how to save up for the soft synth I want to control with it yet!!


Actually I think the 10controll is priced quite reasonalby. Basically that box is the difference between a G2 engine and a G2 keyboard except for the kyboard (which isn't realy a very expensive part). Considdering that and considdering that it has two more knobs I think it's priced right.

Displays and endless knobs are simply very expensive parts, there's no way around that.

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jksuperstar



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PostPosted: Tue Aug 02, 2005 10:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

mosc wrote:
Are you going to share the design and the software? Looks like you have a nice general purpose DIY MIDI controller platform.


This was an "experiment" to get our feet wet, and get some experience with these (how they work, etc). The board I designed is overly modular, making it a pain to turn it into anything specific, but nice to do many various things with (ie- we are using one of these boards to fire flame throwers and lights on a Bus going to the Burning Man festival).

But, my plan is to use a beefed up processor to allow for more algorythmic tasks (currently using an 8bit processor with 2K RAM), with more memory and a USB interface, and design a specific system around that. Once that's running, and we get a flexible/stable OS running on it, we'll open it up to sell as kits, parts, or schematics, and have the OS open for public consumption.

However, I do have enough parts to build & sell one or two more of these at the moment.
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Nodular



Joined: May 05, 2005
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 04, 2005 7:00 am    Post subject: Re: Fantasy MIDI controller Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Dovdimus Prime wrote:

... Each of the knobs can be assigned independently to any MIDI parameter on any channel of any device in the MIDI chain.

yes indeed
... and also wrote:

... Each knob has a read out to show the parameter value, either a numeric one or a dot of light which moves around the knob.

Rolling Eyes no way, but read on
... and also wrote:

... If the parameter value is changed elsewhere (e.g. by the sequencer), the readout changes on this box too.

yes indeed
... and also wrote:

... Each knob also has an LED display where you can type in a parameter name, an existing one or a made-up one (e.g. 'Wibbliness').

hmmm ... quite similar ... yes indeed!
... and also wrote:

Here's the crucial bit. At the end of a session, if you have changed the settings, you can dump them via Sysex to your sequencer. Similarly, at the beginning of the session you dump settings from the sequencer and this baby's ready to go, all parameters named and all readouts displaying the current parameter values.

and yes indeed
... finally wrote:

... So tell me, does this thing already exist?

...kind of...
... and in the end he wrote:

If not, what's the closest thing?


Apart from the mad talk about a display for every control (you don't need it so badly if you have a 2x16ch display that jumps to the values as you tweak them - ok for naming feature), if you change the word "knob" with "fader" (and you'd like 24 of them), you're definitely talking about the REGELWERK by Doepfer.
I've bought it three days ago. Very Happy
I can't imagine a better MIDI controller.
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Nodular



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PostPosted: Tue Oct 04, 2005 8:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

by the way ... I was asking myself: why people seem to prefer knobs over faders?
I absolutely prefer faders as you can immediately tell what parameter they are on.
And about the Regelwerk again. It has this "Hook mode" IN / "Catch mode" OUT feature that's perfect if you can't afford so many motorized faders or if you don't want to rely on motors anyhow.
It's great!
You get one of the 64 presets you saved.
RW prepares itself. Let's say faders are all in the wrong position.
Two rows of 24 led just over and below the faders start to flash.
They are telling how far from the good one, every fader position is, depending on the flashing rate (XMAS TIME !!!)
You adjust the faders and go.
Through the midi chain some values, that are controlled by the RW's faders, change according to other events on other devices...
The new values enter the MIDI IN of the RW, and the fader values are updated, BUT you can avoid value jumps thanks to the hook feature.
The changed value can't influence the actual CC# value passed by RW, until they are the same (or just similar, there's a threshold parameter to declare for this Hail the Master).
The same goes for the manual fader move.
If you are in "Catch mode", no values are changed until you reach actual CC# value.
Not to mention the RW's 8 tracks analogue sequencer!
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rylos



Joined: Sep 06, 2004
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Location: missouri

PostPosted: Sun Apr 09, 2006 8:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

The ability to pull up a preset, and have all the control values instantly snap to the right settings is something you get used to real quick. Makes it so you can just pull up a preset & go.

You just can't beat living beyond menus.
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