Electro-Music Klee Sequencer Build and Applications Thread

Photon · Posted: Sat Nov 08, 2008 2:35 pm Post subject:

ok...I'm getting pulses on pin 15 of the CD4034s in time with clock signal, but it doesn't seem to be anywhere near a 15V signal, perhaps more like 0.2V. (but than again my scope hasn't been calibrated since about 1977 or so. Very Happy

)

When I send an LFO signal into the external load jack I'm not able to see anything on pins 13 or 14.

The LFO into external load jack is causing the pattern LEDs to light. Clocking or pressing the manual step button repeatedly causes them to go off sequentially.

I'm going to try again to see if I can see anything at pins 13 and 14 with the external load input.

Photon · Posted: Sat Nov 08, 2008 2:49 pm Post subject:

ok, I've got pulse at pins 13 & 14 of the CD4034s with external load. I had to mess with the scope settings a bit.

over & out,
Papa Echo Tango Echo Romeo

Scott Stites · Posted: Sat Nov 08, 2008 3:05 pm Post subject:

Good! If the LEDs are lighting when you apply the external load pulse (and you're seeing the pulses) that means the CD4013 is doing its thang, and the CD4034s are receptive to it.

Now - if pressing your load key doesn't do anything, that means we'll have to address that, but first lets see if we can figure out why your LEDs are turning off sequentially.

If you've got all of your pattern switches on, so that the whole row lights up, then they sequentially turn off as you clock the thing, that would mean that your CD4034s are also clocking correctly and could be explained by the signal not getting back to their inputs. You can check that (if you haven't already) by loading only one LED, say the first one on Register A (Step 1). If that LED moves across the row before it disappears, that will tell us a lot right there. So - can you clock one illuminated LED across the row before it disappears?

Scott Stites · Posted: Sat Nov 08, 2008 3:15 pm Post subject:

Oh - wait a sec - are you still only getting 0.2V clock pulses? Is that on your scope or DMM, and if your scope, it's not AC coupled is it (should be DC coupled)? Just covering bases. Very Happy

Photon · Posted: Sat Nov 08, 2008 3:29 pm Post subject:

It seems the random switch was thrown. I returned it to the pattern position. Loaded Register A (Step 1) LED and applied ext. clock. In the 8x2 mode, LED moved sequentially up to 8, then repeated. In 16 x1 mode, they moved sequentially all the way to 16 then repeated. Good news. Very Happy

When the random switch is thrown they go off sequentially. not sure if that's proper. Also LED 13 seems to be not lighting. I'll check to see if its dead or wired wrong.

Scott Stites · Posted: Sat Nov 08, 2008 3:46 pm Post subject:

Wow! Sweet wiring job! Where are all the dead components and other crap laying around? Get with the program!! Laughing

OK, yep - random input will do that if there is nothing feeding the random input. If it's in 8X2 mode, just the first 8 LEDs will "walk off" and never return - the last 8 (register B) should keep recirculating. In 16X1 mode, they'll all walk off.

The LED that's not lighting: Due to my skilled proficiency with making wire harnesses, I never have to check that, no, never, not me, but, you know, if I did ever have to check that, I'd, um, check the pot associated with the LED. In other words, check the the outer lug of the pot for step 13 (the side that's not wired to ground) when LED 13 lights up. If you get a voltage on the pot, but the LED doesn't light up, then the problem is the connection between LED 13 and J9.

If you don't get that voltage on the pot for step 13, and the LED isn't lighting up, either, then you might want to check the output on the CD4034 to be sure it's doing it's thing (pin 4 of U7). Generally, though it never, ever happens to me, mind you, no, it's usually the connection to the connector (the signal from the CD4034 splits at that point - one goes to the LED and one goes to the analog board for scaling).

How about your Load key - is it working?

Luka · Joined: Jun 29, 2007 Posts: 1003 Location: Melb.

i think we need to start a inside-klee picture thread Smile

Photon · Posted: Sat Nov 08, 2008 4:04 pm Post subject:

Luka · Joined: Jun 29, 2007 Posts: 1003 Location: Melb.

though we might scare people away from future runs of the sequencer hehe

Photon · Posted: Sat Nov 08, 2008 4:17 pm Post subject:

Scott Stites · Posted: Sat Nov 08, 2008 4:49 pm Post subject:

Photon · Posted: Sun Nov 09, 2008 12:04 pm Post subject:

ok...the load switch works (electronically speaking). In other words there is continuity between lugs when I push the button. However it doesn't seem to load a pattern.

And things have gotten weird(er). Now the LEDs light up and STAY ON across the front panel (independent of pattern switch position as far as I can tell). when it gets to 16 (all on), they shut off one at a time, starting at 1. Then it starts again (lighting up, 1-16). If I switch to 8x2 it just happens to LEDs 9-16 (excluding 13 which doesn't ever light up).

If I throw the invert B switch, a group of 4 LEDS move across the panel. in 8x2 mode with invert B on I can get 2 different patterns in each half.

about LED 13:
I checked out Pot 13 and I'm getting a voltage at the outer lug when LED 13 should be on. I checked the J9 cable and it seems to be fine. Also I was able to get LED 13 to light by powering it directly, so the LED is good.

Hopefully my description isn't misleading. I'm even confusing myself. maybe I'll shoot a video of the symptoms

Scott Stites · Posted: Sun Nov 09, 2008 4:23 pm Post subject:

Photon · Posted: Sun Nov 09, 2008 5:55 pm Post subject:

Thanks Scott.
I'll read through the theory of operations thread a few times. Its been a while since I looked at it.
I'll also check through the stuff you suggested. If I get some time I'll try to shoot some video and get it posted. Hopefully there are a couple more weeks before the baby arrives. (yes, our first!)

baby=no time for synthesizering Shocked

Scott Stites · Posted: Sun Nov 09, 2008 6:39 pm Post subject:

Baby? Did I miss something here? Are you a new daddy?

Photon · Posted: Sun Nov 09, 2008 7:14 pm Post subject:

Yes, baby is due in the next few weeks. Very Happy

Disregard my last post. Part of my problem is a combination of things not working properly and me not completely understanding Klee operation. I'm going study up on all the great doc.'s you've provided, then I'll be better able to describe whats going on. Thanks for all your help & patience Scott.

Pete

Scott Stites · Posted: Sun Nov 09, 2008 8:12 pm Post subject:

sduck · Posted: Sun Nov 09, 2008 8:21 pm Post subject:

Don't worry - I did the same thing, asking about how to fix things that weren't broken, because I hadn't really understood the theory and operations. It's all good!

And there is a pic of the back of my klee on page 11 of the post your panel designs thread.

Funky40 · Posted: Sun Nov 23, 2008 11:31 am Post subject:

i'm not shure if i should make my Klee panel with an additional row of LEDs which just would show which steps are active.
Does this makes sense or do you allready have enough optical feedback when looking to the blinking lights ?
I'm not shure after looking to the Videos.

@Scott
i have drawn the A-B/B-A circuit into a little Board while waiting for the Epoxy to dry.
I assume it would be ok to post it here, is it ?
http://electro-music.com/forum/phpbb-files/pimped_klee_ab_424.png

Scott Stites · Posted: Sun Nov 23, 2008 9:31 pm Post subject:

Go ahead and post the circuit!

Not sure what you mean about the LEDs - do you mean over each pattern switch that stays static and shows which are on and which are off for a particular pattern? If so, might be kinda cool, actually. When I find a pattern I like (randomly or whatever), I'll stop the clock and program it in so I can get back to it. That involves flipping switches on under every lit LED and flipping switches off that are under every off LED. An extra row of LEDs would make that easier to do, especially in the dark - set the switches so that each row of LEDs is identical. Then start the sequence and the active row begins to move. Very Happy

Spiff. You could do it with DPDT ON-OFF switches instead of SPST ON-OFF switches for the pattern switches.

Cheerios,
Scott

Funky40 · Posted: Mon Nov 24, 2008 6:54 am Post subject:

plord · Joined: Dec 15, 2007 Posts: 21 Location: Charlotte, VT

Hi folks,

First off, let me say that the documentation for the Klee is awe inspiring. But I think I have found a bug. The description of the wiring harness for P213 on page 49 does not match the connection diagram for P213 on page 64. Looking at the schematics, it appears that page 64 is correct; pin 1 goes to Output B, NOT to optional output A; page 49 has it all reversed. Right?

I only discovered this because I am not including the optional outputs, so my wiring harness only had 3 wires in it...and when I got to p 64 they were the wrong ones!

I searched for P213 and got no hits. Am I the first to run into this?

Uncle Krunkus · Posted: Tue Nov 25, 2008 1:41 am Post subject:

Yeah, I think you're right plord.
And yes, I think you're the first to notice that mistake! Very Happy

Wasn't that the secret "Holiday in the Bahamas" Easter Egg mistake Scott? Laughing

Funky40 · Posted: Tue Nov 25, 2008 10:31 am Post subject:

puhhhh, allready 47 sites Shocked

My little Artwork for the A-B/B-A Klee addon from Scott stites is now posted in the Layout Factory.
It is untested.
http://www.electro-music.com/forum/post-216978.html#216978

it was mentioned bevore: it might be also interesting as a little standalone unit

Scott Stites · Posted: Tue Nov 25, 2008 8:16 pm Post subject:

My apologies, plord! I know what a drag it is to go to the trouble of building a cable. Then the damn thing has the wrong wires.

Thanks for reporting it - Build Issue 6 now corrects it.

Cheerio,
Scott

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electro-music Klee Build Document, Issue 6

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