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 Forum index » Instruments and Equipment » WREN
Compatibility with Jack Audio Connection Kit
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marioisaac



Joined: Jan 24, 2016
Posts: 26
Location: Panama

PostPosted: Mon Feb 01, 2016 11:36 pm    Post subject: Compatibility with Jack Audio Connection Kit Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Hi Blue Hell, this seems to be a great synth; I would like to experiment with it and record the results. For that I need to route the Audio back to Ableton.

Currently I'm running Windows 7.

Most of my Apps are recognized by JACK but WREN is not.

do you think this could be implemented?
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blue hell
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Joined: Apr 03, 2004
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Location: The Netherlands, Enschede
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 02, 2016 4:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

To be honest, I have no idea ... I will have a look at it.

Thanks for the suggestion.

_________________
Jan
also .. could someone please turn down the thermostat a bit.
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marioisaac



Joined: Jan 24, 2016
Posts: 26
Location: Panama

PostPosted: Tue Feb 02, 2016 11:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Hey thanks for the prompt reply.

It is strange that it is not recognized, because JACK uses Portaudio for Windows, and I see WREN also uses Portaudio, so I guess they should be compatible.

This is ideal, as it would enable WREN to be interconnected with other applications.

Thanks for having a look at it. Lest us know if it could work Smile

Much appreciated.
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blue hell
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 03, 2016 1:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

What i tried is:

- installed jack, the mixed 64/32 bit version

- followed the Installation and Configuration instructions from http://jackaudio.org/faq/jack_on_windows.html

- Set jack to run at the same sample rate as that I run Wren on, this eems to be needed or Wren will not open the JackRouter connections.

- Started Wren, and then from Setup/Devices (in Wren) selected the ASIO API, and then for both the Input and Output devices I selected JackRouter.

- Then for the ' In channels' I selected all four that were present and for the 'Out channels' likewise. The number of channels is configurable for Jack, four being the default.

With this I was able to get audio out of Wren into Jack and out of Jack into Wren .. and it looks like I get an excact copy of what I send in channels 1 and 2 back in the inputs 1 and 2.

The Jack output sound now happens to come from my laptop speakers ... but that seems to be just a configuration thingie ...

So I think its working OK here, not noticing hickups or crackle or other odd stuff ... anyway, does this help?

Wren has no native Jack support of course ... I'll look into that as well, but that would be a long term project.

EDIT: To see some error reporting in Wren you can hit F5 there, it may give a reason for not being able to connect.

EDIT2: I've added a how to use JACK section to the Wren FAQ, essentially listing the same info present here.

_________________
Jan
also .. could someone please turn down the thermostat a bit.
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marioisaac



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PostPosted: Wed Feb 03, 2016 8:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Yes, your info is helpful. Thank you.

It was my bad; it happens that in my system I have to run JACK and all Audio Apps in Administrator Mode, otherwise Audio Apps won't be recognized by JACK.

Now that I setup WREN to run in Administrator Mode it is recognized by JACK, and I can stream Audio to my DAW.
Not that I care (but others might) is that although I can select JACK as Input and Output Device, the Input and Output channels are not available inside WREN. This is no problem for me, because inside JACK all the Inputs and Outputs of WREN are displayed and available for me to wire them wherever I want.

To send MIDI from my DAW to WREN, I use loopMIDI http://www.tobias-erichsen.de/software/loopmidi.html, to create a virtual MIDI Port. This is great as it enables MIDI interconnectivity between WREN and other Audio Apps in Windows systems.

*I found this bugs in WREN:

In the F3 Settings page, I change the localhost name to be the same as the one I had on NETMIDI, and I enabled the autoconnect on WREN.

Next time I opened WREN a million pop-up Windows started to appear one after another in series saying something along the lines of "WREN could not connect to MIDI".

I connected the Output of Oscillator to both the Input and the Control Input of the Voice Filter, and this created scary jumps in Amplitude.


**I have some suggestions:
-Double click on a cable has the same action as Ctrl+click on a cable. eg. disconnecting or rewiring a cable to another input/output.
-Shift+click on parameters adjusts the sensitivity of the mouse on the fly for fine tuning.


Again, thank you Smile
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blue hell
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 04, 2016 1:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Ah, good you got it working anyway Smile

No idea why the channels would not show up in Wren though Confused

Also thanks for the bug reports, looked into it, and was able to fix them both (for the next release).

Actually .. the Formant filter modulated with the same signal as the input can give some pretty nice weird sound now Laughing but i did have to reduce the maximum modulation update rate in order to get it stable. It now updates no faster than 1/160 of the sample rate ... 1/80 was a bit too much on the edge to my likings.

_________________
Jan
also .. could someone please turn down the thermostat a bit.
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blue hell
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 04, 2016 1:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Oh .. and the suggestions .. will think about the double click .. and re. fine control .. the idea is that you use the cursor up/down keys for fine control.
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also .. could someone please turn down the thermostat a bit.
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marioisaac



Joined: Jan 24, 2016
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 04, 2016 3:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Blue Hell wrote:
Ah, good you got it working anyway Smile

No idea why the channels would not show up in Wren though Confused

Also thanks for the bug reports, looked into it, and was able to fix them both (for the next release).

Actually .. the Formant filter modulated with the same signal as the input can give some pretty nice weird sound now Laughing but i did have to reduce the maximum modulation update rate in order to get it stable. It now updates no faster than 1/160 of the sample rate ... 1/80 was a bit too much on the edge to my likings.


Great that you got to match weirdness and stability Smile

Quote:
Oh .. and the suggestions .. will think about the double click .. and re. fine control .. the idea is that you use the cursor up/down keys for fine control.


-Double click (at least in my case) improves workflow considerably as it gives the Mouse complete independence from the Keyboard to patch and repatch.
-Shift+click is a nice add-on if you are more Mouse oriented, and it doesn't interfere with the up/down idea Smile
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blue hell
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Joined: Apr 03, 2004
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Location: The Netherlands, Enschede
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 05, 2016 1:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I've looked at the code, and the double click not working really is a bug ... I had intended that to work .. except it was only looked for when the mouse got released, and it needs be looked for on the mouse down event.

I've changed the code for that, but can not really test it .. as I do not have a real mouse ... but a mousepad only (which is far superior of course Laughing )

Anyway, the change will be available in the next release, and I hope it will solve the problem.

Edit: turns out I can actually test it - it works.

Fine control with a shift modifier is not so easy ... the available resolution is set by the number of steps for the knob (which is set at module design time .. although there are some exceptions to that rule), meaning that there are no 'inbetween values' available.

It would mean a couple of changes ... not only would the knobs need more resolution, but it would also change the patch format .. as the knob position rather than the value is stored into a patch. Or maybe I could add a fine control setting to the patch .. this could be made one way compatible with existing patches (in that they could still be read then).

In an earlier version I' ve had it the other way around, the patch storing actual values and knob positions being calculated from that - it was clumsy ... I dont really see a good solution for this, but will keep it in mind, as it seems to be very usable to me.

_________________
Jan
also .. could someone please turn down the thermostat a bit.
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Last edited by blue hell on Sat Feb 06, 2016 1:05 am; edited 1 time in total
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marioisaac



Joined: Jan 24, 2016
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 05, 2016 7:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Cool. Hope it works, Double-click will definitely enhance the workflow Smile
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