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 Forum index » Clavia Nord Modular » Nord Modular G2 Discussion
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Wout Blommers



Joined: Sep 07, 2003
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Location: The Hague - The Netherlands
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 21, 2007 11:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

cappy2112 wrote:
Wout Blommers wrote:

I haven't used G2ools yet, due to some computer failures


What problems are you having Wout?
Why not post the error messages or screenshots?

The Mac people are running g2ools now, I'm sure we can get you on your feet too. No need to buy another computer just for that Smile

Well, my computer dates from 1998 and also runs the same named Windows version AND is completely overloaded with files (Just cleaned 1.5 Giga by deleting all the digi photographs which I don't want to keep and I have another computer which is infected by some virus, so I have to clean that one...

Wout
who needs to refill the power by using burning charcoal...
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Wout Blommers



Joined: Sep 07, 2003
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 21, 2007 11:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Wout Blommers wrote:
... the last banks (J) contains 40 Prophet V presets. ...

Hmmm... Clavia surely can't count Very Happy

Wout
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cappy2112



Joined: Dec 24, 2004
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 21, 2007 11:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Wout Blommers wrote:
The complete Prophet V isn't there, only 40 of 120...
Of course, these will be converted to the G2 too.
If there is someone who knows their original names?
Wout


Yes, but trying to figure out which 40 of the 120 will be a project in itself.
The Prophet 5 patches were stored in 3 files, each file consisting of 40 patches. Each "file" of 40 were organized as 5 banks of eight.
Since each file only had 40 patches, I don't know how one would coordinate those numberings with the numberings from the NL2 patch sheet, since several of them are higher than 40. It is highly unlikely that the patches that were programmed in the NL2 were selected sequentially from the P5 list, as opposed to specific ones by the patch creator(s).

Attached is a zipfile with JPG screenshot references to the P5 patch sheet.


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cappy2112



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PostPosted: Sat Apr 21, 2007 11:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Wout Blommers wrote:
[cleaned 1.5 Giga by deleting all the digi photographs which I don't want to keep and I have another computer which is infected by some virus, so I have to clean that one...

Wout


My misunderstanding- I thought you were referring to problems running G2ools, not just computer problems in general.
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Wout Blommers



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PostPosted: Sun Apr 22, 2007 12:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

cappy2112 wrote:
My misunderstanding- I thought you were referring to problems running G2ools, not just computer problems in general.

How much space on my harddisk do I need to run Python and G2ools?

Wout
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Wout Blommers



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PostPosted: Sun Apr 22, 2007 12:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

cappy2112 wrote:
Attached is a zipfile with JPG screenshot references to the P5 patch sheet.

Thanks. In the museum there are three Prophets, so now I can describe which is which (most have still the factory presets)

Wout
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cappy2112



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PostPosted: Sun Apr 22, 2007 1:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Wout Blommers wrote:
cappy2112 wrote:
My misunderstanding- I thought you were referring to problems running G2ools, not just computer problems in general.

How much space on my harddisk do I need to run Python and G2ools?

Wout


Very Little

The Installer for Python 2.5 is 10MB, and I estimate G2ools is only a few MB or less. However, installers are usually compressed, so the real requirement may be more. When you run the installer, I believe it tells you how much space is required
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cappy2112



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PostPosted: Sun Apr 22, 2007 1:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Wout Blommers wrote:
cappy2112 wrote:
Attached is a zipfile with JPG screenshot references to the P5 patch sheet.

Thanks. In the museum there are three Prophets, so now I can describe which is which (most have still the factory presets)

Wout


Is this museum in The Netherlands?
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cappy2112



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PostPosted: Sun Apr 22, 2007 1:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Wout Blommers wrote:
cappy2112 wrote:
Attached is a zipfile with JPG screenshot references to the P5 patch sheet.

Thanks. In the museum there are three Prophets, so now I can describe which is which (most have still the factory presets)

Wout


Here is much more information on the P5
http://users.telenet.be/prophet-5/main.htm
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Wout Blommers



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PostPosted: Sun Apr 22, 2007 1:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

cappy2112 wrote:
Is this museum in The Netherlands?

Yep, in my home town.

http://www.gemeentemuseum.nl/forums.html?id=031816&langId=en

Wout
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Wout Blommers



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PostPosted: Sun Apr 22, 2007 9:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Well...
S**t...

The values of the Envelopes are not the same, at least, working with the ModEnv. I have to do the Filter and the Amp, so I'm a little afraid...

Wout
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Wout Blommers



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PostPosted: Sun Apr 22, 2007 9:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Does someone has a good solution how to measure the Filter and the Amp Envelopes? For the LFO's and the ModEnv I used the Pitch, because I could search for the lowest or highest wave, but pitch is unusable in this configuration... Most difficult is the Decay...

Wout
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cappy2112



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PostPosted: Sun Apr 22, 2007 9:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Wout Blommers wrote:
cappy2112 wrote:
Is this museum in The Netherlands?

Yep, in my home town.

http://www.gemeentemuseum.nl/forums.html?id=031816&langId=en

Wout


I thought you were referring to to a synth museum, because of ther talk of the prophets.

But this place looks very interesting as well. Klee, Van Gogh, Monet, et al.

I saw Van Gogh's Sunflower painting (original, not a copy) in Philadelphia, when I was visiting my family a few years ago.
(edited:too inflammatory)
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qfingers



Joined: Nov 16, 2006
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 22, 2007 10:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Wout Blommers wrote:
Does someone has a good solution how to measure the Filter and the Amp Envelopes? For the LFO's and the ModEnv I used the Pitch, because I could search for the lowest or highest wave, but pitch is unusable in this configuration... Most difficult is the Decay...

Wout


Why can't you use pitch for the Filter Envelope? Set the resonance to max, and sweep. The Amp Envelope should be done with a very high pitch sine wave. That way the pitch of the sine doesn't interact with the envelopes frequency content. Then you can apply a low pass filter set high enough for the speed of the envelope but low enough to completely filter the sine wave. If you can, apply a rectifier (absolute value) on the signal before you filter. Then you get the exact filter envelope.

q
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ian-s



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PostPosted: Mon Apr 23, 2007 1:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I had a few minutes to play with a lead 2X today. Just wanted to test some assumptions.

The noise on osc2 has two distinct modes. Regular, which is just like the G2 noise osc, where the semitone control = noise colour.
Sync mode (when sync and noise are both selected) sounds just like a G2 RndClkA, driven with 48K osc on the clock and Osc1 driving the sync input. The seed value comes from a quantized semitone knob. To be strictly accurate, you would need to find 12 seed values that matched the sync wave as close as possible, and have these in a table.

The rest of the synth sounds very close in character to a G2 IMHO. The few factory presets I tried were nice enough, but a little cliché for my taste.
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Wout Blommers



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PostPosted: Mon Apr 23, 2007 2:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

g2ian wrote:
IThe noise on osc2 has two distinct modes. Regular, which is just like the G2 noise osc, where the semitone control = noise colour.
Sync mode (when sync and noise are both selected) sounds just like a G2 RndClkA, driven with 48K osc on the clock and Osc1 driving the sync input. The seed value comes from a quantized semitone knob. To be strictly accurate, you would need to find 12 seed values that matched the sync wave as close as possible, and have these in a table.

In the TryOut patch I used a OcsPhaseModModule in a feedback loop, just because of the patch load and voices available. I think the patch has to have at least 12, but better 16 or 15 voices on an expanded G2, including the Unison.

Just take a look and listen...

Wout
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ian-s



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PostPosted: Mon Apr 23, 2007 7:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Wout Blommers wrote:
Just take a look and listen...


The combination of the self-modulated oscPM and 18dB filter does sound very close.

I think the noise osc color knob would do though and it maintains a more even level through it's range.

Here is a rough patch (which looks a lot like your one) with the noise done as a combination noise osc or clkRnd, depending on the sync setting.
Just squeezes in to 50%mem

The unison is interesting. I read somewhere that it did not affect polyphony but the manual says that it does. Perhaps it is just down to voice allocation, in which case a slightly more complex base patch could be used for unison presets.


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cappy2112



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PostPosted: Mon Apr 23, 2007 10:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

dorremifasol wrote:
I agree, most of the G2 presets are not very useful.
!


You can say this about almost any synth. Most of the factory patches I've ever heard are real sleepers. (although, I've never heard any Waldorf gear in person, but would imagine their sounds to be somewhat exciting)
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Wout Blommers



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PostPosted: Mon Apr 23, 2007 11:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

g2ian wrote:
I will check your G2 patch later.

At first glance I miss the Ring Modulator.

Wout

Sorry, I 'edited' the mail instead of 'quote'.
Now I miss the original mail... Mad

I thought it was about the unison, which has on the NL3 a special DSP only to the unison, where the Leads2(X) have a devided voice allocation. (by half) and where the unison has to be placed: in the FX or in the voice area.

Last edited by Wout Blommers on Tue Apr 24, 2007 1:35 am; edited 3 times in total
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Wout Blommers



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PostPosted: Mon Apr 23, 2007 11:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

cappy2112 wrote:
You can say this about almost any synth. Most of the factory patches I've ever heard are real sleepers. (although, I've never heard any Waldorf gear in person, but would imagine their sounds to be somewhat exciting)

And of course the use of the sound isn't known. Besides drones and noodles all patches have to be heard in their musical context. Sequences, like Dasz creates them, also speak for themselves.

Wout
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Wout Blommers



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PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2007 2:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Wout Blommers wrote:
At first glance I miss the Ring Modulator.

Although the LFO routings are not as on the Leads, which is of course one of the reasons why this emulation on the G2 is so interesting, to make changes in the architecture, I miss the LFO2 direction to the Amp modulation. Using the AmpMod input of the results in silence when the LFO isn't connected... That's why I used a LevelModulator module.
Clavia did the same in the Lead>Classic conversion.

Wout
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MitchK1989



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PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2007 3:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

The NL2/2x does in fact lose polyphony from unison. It is the NL3 that doesn't.

Is there a way to make the G2 trigger multiple detuned voices with each keypress? I suppose it could be done in performance mode (disabling slots B, C, and D to not use unison, disabling slots C and D to do poly unison, and enabling all slots to do mono unison minus one voice... the NL2 in mono unison has 2 voices on each side of the stereo spectrum plus one in the center...)
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ian-s



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PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2007 11:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Quote:
The next approach is to dump the switch modules and MODEG/LFO1/2 level controls, and simply replace the mod destination mixers with Mix4B modules. NL2G2 then just sets levels based on the routing in the NL2 patch. A side benefit is that you can now do things the nl2 can't, like have lfo2 modulate fm amount and filter freq at the same time, with independent levels.


I like this approach. It get's the job done, and like you say, allows even more to come of it. I would also suggest 2 "base" patches - one for unison, and one for "normal" operation. Then the converter should be able to convert:
A) unison NL2 -> G2 unison (typical unison)
B) non-unison NL2 patch -> G2 unison (add unison)
C) unison NL2 -> G2 non-unison (remove unison)
D) non-unison NL2 -> G2 non-unison (normal)


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jksuperstar



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PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2007 11:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

I think there's a forum issue here Wout...I just "Quoted" Ian (and made sure I clicked quote after reading your message), but I think it edited things as well.. I'll see if howard or stein can fix this.
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jksuperstar



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PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2007 11:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

jksuperstar wrote:
I think there's a forum issue here ....


Testing...

[edit] - now editing
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