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Luka
Joined: Jun 29, 2007
Posts: 1003
Location: Melb.
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Sebo
Joined: Apr 27, 2007
Posts: 564
Location: Argentina
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 Posted: Thu May 13, 2010 8:15 am Post subject:
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I alway measure the distance between IC pins before printing. If the distances
are wrong, I re-scale the graphic until they are right. Also I check If the
file is mirrored for p'n'p or not, and do the necessary changes.
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Sebo
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My Music:
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v-un-v
Janitor
Joined: May 16, 2005
Posts: 8932
Location: Birmingham, England, UK
Audio files: 11
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| Posted: Thu May 13, 2010 12:23 pm Post subject:
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| Sebo wrote: | I alway measure the distance between IC pins before printing. If the distances
are wrong, I re-scale the graphic until they are right. Also I check If the
file is mirrored for p'n'p or not, and do the necessary changes. |
Yes, but you shouldn't have to do that. When I first started my Soundlab project (which I still havent finished  ), I decided to make my own boards, but had utterly inconsistent results, because I came across the same problem outlined above. I just want these things to work. I think one of the problems was that some were printing from PC's where I use a Mac. I think times have moved on since then, but there was always this damn 72dpi vs 96dpi thing going on, which always resulted in wrong results.
One thing I wish people would do when publishing PCB layouts such as the one above, is to have a line on the board which is exactly 2.5cm (or 1 inch) long, so that images can be sized up against that line, using that length as a guide.
This is why, at the end of the day, I think it is best to go with Ian's Teezer and accompanying board, because all the proper R&D would have gone into it (Ian is a true visionary here on electro-music.com  )- plus you get none of this nonsense outlined above. You also know the thing's going to work properly!  
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ACHTUNG!
ALLES TURISTEN UND NONTEKNISCHEN LOOKENPEEPERS!
DAS KOMPUTERMASCHINE IST NICHT FÜR DER GEFINGERPOKEN UND MITTENGRABEN! ODERWISE IST EASY TO SCHNAPPEN DER SPRINGENWERK, BLOWENFUSEN UND POPPENCORKEN MIT SPITZENSPARKSEN.
IST NICHT FÜR GEWERKEN BEI DUMMKOPFEN. DER RUBBERNECKEN SIGHTSEEREN KEEPEN DAS COTTONPICKEN HÄNDER IN DAS POCKETS MUSS.
ZO RELAXEN UND WATSCHEN DER BLINKENLICHTEN. |
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synthmonger
Joined: Nov 16, 2006
Posts: 578
Location: flada
Audio files: 3
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| Posted: Thu May 13, 2010 12:25 pm Post subject:
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| Sebo wrote: | I alway measure the distance between IC pins before printing. If the distances
are wrong, I re-scale the graphic until they are right. Also I check If the
file is mirrored for p'n'p or not, and do the necessary changes. |
Same but for some reason I didn't on this one 
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Whacky tunes! |
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forbin
Joined: Jan 29, 2009
Posts: 120
Location: Fremantle, Australia
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synthmonger
Joined: Nov 16, 2006
Posts: 578
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| Posted: Thu May 13, 2010 8:13 pm Post subject:
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Guess I just overlooked things! Ah well no biggie. I'll post a build report as soon as I finish it.
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Youtube!
modular demos!
Whacky tunes! |
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andrewF
Joined: Dec 29, 2006
Posts: 1176
Location: australia
Audio files: 4
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| Posted: Thu May 13, 2010 9:23 pm Post subject:
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| forbin wrote: | Anyway I have generated another PDF directly from Altium with the ground plane pulled back which I will attach to this message.
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altium eh?
i have stopped using it now as my student license expires next month and i won't be renewing it.
but am curious - how did you get it to print out the layout with the thru holes marked on the pads?
i never managed to work that out and had to do it manually in photoshop  |
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forbin
Joined: Jan 29, 2009
Posts: 120
Location: Fremantle, Australia
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| Posted: Thu May 13, 2010 9:30 pm Post subject:
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| my favorite is to flip the board when i don't need to or forget to when I do need to! I have probably five or six boards with IC's on the copper side! |
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andrewF
Joined: Dec 29, 2006
Posts: 1176
Location: australia
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| Posted: Thu May 13, 2010 9:37 pm Post subject:
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Bernie would approve  |
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forbin
Joined: Jan 29, 2009
Posts: 120
Location: Fremantle, Australia
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| Posted: Thu May 13, 2010 9:43 pm Post subject:
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Hi Andrew -- getting the printing right from Altium is a pain. The second PDF file here is printing directly to a PDF "printer" . The trick seems to be under "page setup" / "advanced" you need to make a print page with a "Bottom layer" & "Multi Layer" and make sure that the "holes" radio box is ticked. Not totally intuitive... I used to have a Gerber printer tool -- but that was even more convoluted...
I use Altium at work so I tend to do layouts at lunchtime rather than walk into town for food -- get's too expensive in Freo. I have tried quite a few other PCB tools and they all have idiosyncratic annoyances -- I suppose I have just got used to Altium! It has certainly improved over the last couple of years. I just wish the PCB tool would rubberband with components -- that is by far and away the biggest downside... |
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andrewF
Joined: Dec 29, 2006
Posts: 1176
Location: australia
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| Posted: Thu May 13, 2010 10:35 pm Post subject:
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thats the way i do it
just had a quick look
why have i never noticed the 'holes' box before? 
cheers |
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v-un-v
Janitor
Joined: May 16, 2005
Posts: 8932
Location: Birmingham, England, UK
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| Posted: Fri May 14, 2010 2:08 am Post subject:
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| forbin wrote: | Another reason is, that for me personally, to have this PCB in my hand probably costs about $5 to $7 plus a fair amount of work. Buying the Teezer blank board + shipping it is about $50 to $60 in Australian Dollars (exchange rate is a lot better than when I started this). Part of the tyranny of living on the edge of the world...
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Well this is it, and I must say that I'm in total agreement with you too. I haven't ordered a Bridechamber kit from the USA, because they are so damn expensive after import duty and so on. The pound is also not as strong as it used to be either. Someone needs to set up shop here in the UK, in Europe and in Australia and so on. Anyone for Phonosonics Mk2? 
_________________
ACHTUNG!
ALLES TURISTEN UND NONTEKNISCHEN LOOKENPEEPERS!
DAS KOMPUTERMASCHINE IST NICHT FÜR DER GEFINGERPOKEN UND MITTENGRABEN! ODERWISE IST EASY TO SCHNAPPEN DER SPRINGENWERK, BLOWENFUSEN UND POPPENCORKEN MIT SPITZENSPARKSEN.
IST NICHT FÜR GEWERKEN BEI DUMMKOPFEN. DER RUBBERNECKEN SIGHTSEEREN KEEPEN DAS COTTONPICKEN HÄNDER IN DAS POCKETS MUSS.
ZO RELAXEN UND WATSCHEN DER BLINKENLICHTEN. |
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Luka
Joined: Jun 29, 2007
Posts: 1003
Location: Melb.
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v-un-v
Janitor
Joined: May 16, 2005
Posts: 8932
Location: Birmingham, England, UK
Audio files: 11
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| Posted: Fri May 14, 2010 4:32 am Post subject:
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Isn't Elby supposed to be a no-no on this forum?
_________________
ACHTUNG!
ALLES TURISTEN UND NONTEKNISCHEN LOOKENPEEPERS!
DAS KOMPUTERMASCHINE IST NICHT FÜR DER GEFINGERPOKEN UND MITTENGRABEN! ODERWISE IST EASY TO SCHNAPPEN DER SPRINGENWERK, BLOWENFUSEN UND POPPENCORKEN MIT SPITZENSPARKSEN.
IST NICHT FÜR GEWERKEN BEI DUMMKOPFEN. DER RUBBERNECKEN SIGHTSEEREN KEEPEN DAS COTTONPICKEN HÄNDER IN DAS POCKETS MUSS.
ZO RELAXEN UND WATSCHEN DER BLINKENLICHTEN. |
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frijitz
Joined: May 04, 2007
Posts: 1734
Location: NM USA
Audio files: 54
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| Posted: Fri May 14, 2010 7:11 am Post subject:
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| forbin wrote: | | I noticed also that Ian has started experimenting with a "Ping Pong VCO" which with a few hacks this PCB would be ideal to also do some similar experimentation along those lines... |
You might even want to consider building in a way to reverse the ramp from an external signal. Possibly an OR between the 4070 and the 4013, and a little differentiator/CMOS interface for the new input? This could be used for a kind of sync also.
Ian |
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Rykhaard
Joined: Sep 02, 2007
Posts: 1290
Location: Canada
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| Posted: Fri May 14, 2010 2:26 pm Post subject:
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| andrewF wrote: | | Bernie would approve |
I just retired Bernie's method, a few weeks ago. I'd been using it since 1994.  It IS amazing though, how much faster boards assemble, NOT using Bernie's method.  (Parts preparation, always took so long.) |
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Luka
Joined: Jun 29, 2007
Posts: 1003
Location: Melb.
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| Posted: Fri May 14, 2010 4:41 pm Post subject:
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| v-un-v wrote: | | Isn't Elby supposed to be a no-no on this forum? |
what is that in reference to?
i did a search and couldnt find anything negative
does bridechamber sponsor this forum and we are not allowed to talk about other kit suppliers
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problemchild
melbourne australia
http://cycleofproblems.blogspot.com/
http://www.last.fm/user/prblmchild |
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Luka
Joined: Jun 29, 2007
Posts: 1003
Location: Melb.
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| Posted: Fri May 14, 2010 4:43 pm Post subject:
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| Rykhaard wrote: | | andrewF wrote: | | Bernie would approve |
I just retired Bernie's method, a few weeks ago. I'd been using it since 1994. It IS amazing though, how much faster boards assemble, NOT using Bernie's method. (Parts preparation, always took so long.) |
not having to drill etched pcbs is a dream ryk
what are you doing now?
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problemchild
melbourne australia
http://cycleofproblems.blogspot.com/
http://www.last.fm/user/prblmchild |
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forbin
Joined: Jan 29, 2009
Posts: 120
Location: Fremantle, Australia
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| Posted: Fri May 14, 2010 8:14 pm Post subject:
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Hi Ian -- i will try and do some tinkering with my prototype board and see what happens.
I think that Bridechamber and nearly all the suppliers of boards & parts do a great job for the Synth Community. I am sure that none of them are going to end up in the Bahamas on a yacht with what they make from all of us... It has more to do with your DIY ethic and how much spare cash you have to do some things and a lot to do with where you are and how easy it is to get bits.
I actually quite enjoy making the boards -- but then my wife often complains that while renovating the house I am quite happy to do everything from digging the footings and bricklaying to glazing the windows... I think her idea is to choose the paint colours and pay somebody else to do everything... probably leaves more time to actually enjoy it! |
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synthmonger
Joined: Nov 16, 2006
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2thick4uni
Joined: Feb 20, 2009
Posts: 113
Location: UK
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| Posted: Sat May 15, 2010 1:22 am Post subject:
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| v-un-v wrote: | | Isn't Elby supposed to be a no-no on this forum? |
Hi v-un-v, any chance you could enlighten us on why Elby is persona non grata here? I've built four of his projects - ASM2, Pixie, Monowave X and PolyDac and would be happy to join in discussions on them and help other builders where I can. Laurie always answers my emails very helpfully and I'm very pleased with his service.
I know Do*pfer is not welcome because some of his designs may have been "borrowed" from others without consent, however Elby modules which are designs by Oakley and Paul Maddox do seem to have the blessing of the original designers. |
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v-un-v
Janitor
Joined: May 16, 2005
Posts: 8932
Location: Birmingham, England, UK
Audio files: 11
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| Posted: Sat May 15, 2010 2:08 am Post subject:
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| forbin wrote: | | I think her idea is to choose the paint colours and pay somebody else to do everything... probably leaves more time to actually enjoy it! |
Same here!
"It's a woman's world"! 
_________________
ACHTUNG!
ALLES TURISTEN UND NONTEKNISCHEN LOOKENPEEPERS!
DAS KOMPUTERMASCHINE IST NICHT FÜR DER GEFINGERPOKEN UND MITTENGRABEN! ODERWISE IST EASY TO SCHNAPPEN DER SPRINGENWERK, BLOWENFUSEN UND POPPENCORKEN MIT SPITZENSPARKSEN.
IST NICHT FÜR GEWERKEN BEI DUMMKOPFEN. DER RUBBERNECKEN SIGHTSEEREN KEEPEN DAS COTTONPICKEN HÄNDER IN DAS POCKETS MUSS.
ZO RELAXEN UND WATSCHEN DER BLINKENLICHTEN. |
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v-un-v
Janitor
Joined: May 16, 2005
Posts: 8932
Location: Birmingham, England, UK
Audio files: 11
G2 patch files: 1
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| Posted: Sat May 15, 2010 2:13 am Post subject:
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| 2thick4uni wrote: | | Hi v-un-v, any chance you could enlighten us on why Elby is persona non grata here? |
I'm sure his service is very good (and why shouldn't it be?), but if you read my post, it was I who was asking the question.
_________________
ACHTUNG!
ALLES TURISTEN UND NONTEKNISCHEN LOOKENPEEPERS!
DAS KOMPUTERMASCHINE IST NICHT FÜR DER GEFINGERPOKEN UND MITTENGRABEN! ODERWISE IST EASY TO SCHNAPPEN DER SPRINGENWERK, BLOWENFUSEN UND POPPENCORKEN MIT SPITZENSPARKSEN.
IST NICHT FÜR GEWERKEN BEI DUMMKOPFEN. DER RUBBERNECKEN SIGHTSEEREN KEEPEN DAS COTTONPICKEN HÄNDER IN DAS POCKETS MUSS.
ZO RELAXEN UND WATSCHEN DER BLINKENLICHTEN. |
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forbin
Joined: Jan 29, 2009
Posts: 120
Location: Fremantle, Australia
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| Posted: Sat May 15, 2010 2:41 am Post subject:
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| Your not thinking of EFM and Tom Gamble are you? He came in for a bit of criticism a few years ago... This is just what I have picked up from reading various posts scattered through the forum... |
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v-un-v
Janitor
Joined: May 16, 2005
Posts: 8932
Location: Birmingham, England, UK
Audio files: 11
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| Posted: Sat May 15, 2010 3:32 am Post subject:
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I can't remember that well, but what I do remember was that someone was calling on the boycott of Elby, because he was publishing a circuit or circuits that weren't licensed.
electro-music.com is a big community, and while 99.999% of its members are honest and decent people, occasionally some bad apple rears its ugly head (or the maggot in the apple?). It's just a precaution to protect the integrity of the forum, as the last thing anyone wants is to be closed down. I also imagine that many great engineers like Ian would steer clear of a forum, if he or they felt that electro-music.com encouraged this kind of behaviour, and we really don't want that now, right?
Some people had a problem with Elby, as they also had with Doepfer, but I don't know if that has been cleared up by now?
_________________
ACHTUNG!
ALLES TURISTEN UND NONTEKNISCHEN LOOKENPEEPERS!
DAS KOMPUTERMASCHINE IST NICHT FÜR DER GEFINGERPOKEN UND MITTENGRABEN! ODERWISE IST EASY TO SCHNAPPEN DER SPRINGENWERK, BLOWENFUSEN UND POPPENCORKEN MIT SPITZENSPARKSEN.
IST NICHT FÜR GEWERKEN BEI DUMMKOPFEN. DER RUBBERNECKEN SIGHTSEEREN KEEPEN DAS COTTONPICKEN HÄNDER IN DAS POCKETS MUSS.
ZO RELAXEN UND WATSCHEN DER BLINKENLICHTEN. |
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