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 Forum index » DIY Hardware and Software » Lunettas - circuits inspired by Stanley Lunetta
Audio in to a 4093-based oscillator?
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loss1234



Joined: Jul 24, 2007
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 05, 2010 11:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

great job.

just so other people can understand what you are doing, can you clarify what your samples are a recording of? am i correct in assuming you used the 4069's to first SQUARE Up the guitar signal, and then you took that HIGH GAIN signal and put it into one input of the 4093 oscillator?

the sound you are getting sounds like you are SYNCING the oscillator to the guitar.


nice work

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Joined: Feb 02, 2010
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Location: California

PostPosted: Sat Oct 09, 2010 3:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

stolenfat wrote:
what are your guy's feelings towards running op-amp's out put through a schmidt trigger to square it up before slamming it into the 93'?

would that help?


Isn't the 4093 a Schmidt trigger already? Could try running through one of the unused gates.

I think getting it nice and loud and clipped off is still the best bet.

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corex



Joined: Mar 02, 2010
Posts: 114
Location: Las Vegas

PostPosted: Sat Oct 09, 2010 3:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

loss1234 wrote:
just so other people can understand what you are doing, can you clarify what your samples are a recording of? am i correct in assuming you used the 4069's to first SQUARE Up the guitar signal, and then you took that HIGH GAIN signal and put it into one input of the 4093 oscillator?


Sorry; I saw this several days ago and I keep meaning to draw it up but so far I haven't done that. Instead let me at least offer a description of the circuit.

What I've done is used two inverters of a 4069 (and some caps and resistors) to basically amplify the input signal. This circuit can be used to "square up" the incoming signal by clipping the shit out of it, but the goal is not so much to make the signal square but to get the peaks higher and lower than the 4093's Schmitt trigger thresholds. It should be triggering the gate at the fundamental frequency of the input signal, ideally.

The amplified input goes into one leg of the 4093 (the leg normally connected to logic 1/+V).

loss1234 wrote:
the sound you are getting sounds like you are SYNCING the oscillator to the guitar.


I think that may be what's happening. When the input signal is 0, the output is always 1, but when the input is 1, the output oscillates. When the input rises, the NAND gate switches to output 0 and then the RC input of the gate is fed by the capacitor for a small amount of time creating more or less a saw or falling ramp shape until this input finally falls below the trigger threshold at which point the gate outputs 1 again which begins to charge that cap, which eventually causes that input to rise to 1, etc.

The gate can be set to oscillate faster or slower than the input signal and that changes the kind of sound it makes. The high part of the input signal outputs the oscillation of the gate while the low part of the input signal outputs logic 1. In the audio sample that I posted, around 0:26 I changed the speed of the oscillator from faster than the input to slower.

I will post a schematic eventually when I get it drawn up.


image002.jpg
 Description:
4093-based oscillator for clarity
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image002.jpg



4093-wave.png
 Description:
The output of a 4093 oscillator with input from other oscillators.
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4093-wave.png


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electri-fire



Joined: Jul 26, 2006
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 11, 2010 7:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

corex wrote:
It should be triggering the gate at the fundamental frequency of the input signal, ideally.


I think then you best filter off the higher harmonics before squaring up the signal.
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slacker



Joined: Nov 18, 2007
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 11, 2010 10:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Don't know if this is of any use, but I've done a couple of CMOS based guitar pedals and found a pretty good front end, that boosts, filters and then squares the guitar signal.

http://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/forums.html?topic=55644.0

The first 3 opamp stages in the schematic in that link are what you want. The component values are not that critical any similar values will work fine.
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stolenfat



Joined: Apr 17, 2008
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 12, 2010 2:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

slacker wrote:
Don't know if this is of any use, but I've done a couple of CMOS based guitar pedals and found a pretty good front end, that boosts, filters and then squares the guitar signal.

http://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/forums.html?topic=55644.0



i get a dead link Sad

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slacker



Joined: Nov 18, 2007
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 12, 2010 9:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Works for me now, I think the forum does sometimes have connection problems though.

Here's a direct link to the schematic http://www.eskimo.plus.com/fxstuff/slacktave.png
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corex



Joined: Mar 02, 2010
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 19, 2010 11:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

Here's a schematic of the circuit I built with the 4069. The switch on the second gain stage is useful to get the guitar into the right range, though with the 100K resistor (R2), it's easy to get the noise floor up into the range where it is audible. It's quieter and better behaved with the 10K but for low signals such as guitar, you have to turn it all the way up.

So the output of this circuit just connects to the input leg of a 4093 oscillator in the examples that I posted.


Input circuit.png
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Input circuit.png


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kdowqo



Joined: Mar 10, 2011
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 03, 2011 6:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote  Mark this post and the followings unread

i used a simple npn to amplify the guitar signal and it deffintly works, i got everything from crazy octave up and down sounds to weird tremolo to extreme fuzz

a voltage sag on the VDD of the 4093 had great results to


ext gatead oscillator.jpg
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ext gatead oscillator.jpg


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