Anybody PAtched It OUt?

Wild Zebra · Posted: Thu May 12, 2005 9:12 am Post subject: Anybody PAtched It OUt?

So anybody out there have a patched out soundlab who can give
their comments, suggestions, tips? I'd like to patch mine out when I'm
done and would like to gather some advice before I do. I think I have a
pretty good handle on how it should be done, but its nice to be prepared.

i.e. jacks vs. banana (I've never used banana)
tap in points (just solder wire onto resistor, pot in scchemo?)

and anything y'all could think of

All right get pumped lets see some post here!! Razz

ladislaobiro · Joined: Mar 24, 2005 Posts: 105 Location: Italy

I didn't build my sound lab yet, so I really cannot be helpful... but I've just finished to build my personal idea of a WP20 (maybe I will post a picture)... it works with switches and I have to say I feel really comfortable this way, so I think I will build the sound lab with switches too... but if I had to patch it out, I would choose banana plugs... no special reasons... and maybe you can save room on your front panel as banana plugs should be smaller than standard jacks...
ladislao

dnny · Last edited by dnny on Sun Apr 23, 2006 10:21 pm; edited 1 time in total

mosc · Posted: Fri May 13, 2005 6:21 am Post subject:

Bananas also make better electrical connections and don't crap out over time like the 1/8" mini plugs, or even the 1/4" plugs, do. You can stack banana plugs too, so you don't need multiples.

Wild Zebra · Posted: Fri May 13, 2005 7:16 am Post subject:

Well, since jacks seem to be the topic so far. How bout more info on
these banana jacks. I've seen some pics. more ?'s

I will also need banana plugs right? they are specialized and don't except
normal cords. Also they will not be compatible with other non banana
synths unless I get an interface. So, are they really cheaper?

I haven't seen any good pics of the backs. What are their terminals like?
Do they have a "hot" and "ground" like a standard mono jack?

mosc · Posted: Fri May 13, 2005 7:42 am Post subject:

Click here for Info on banana jacks

I'm not sure about the relative cheapness. Banana jacks and plugs are a single conductor, there is no ground used with them. For short runs, like in a synthesizer, this is ok. If there is an good electronics store near you it would be worth the visit. Unfortunately, good electronics stores are very rare these days.

You will need converters to go to other systems, but these are very easy to make. I usually just make a special cable; a make banana plug on one end and a male whatever on the other. The wire connects just to the tip of the whatever.

Wild Zebra · Posted: Fri May 13, 2005 8:27 am Post subject:

I just saying this for the sake of it, but to my understanding the jacks must be grounded to the board.

from the soundlab pages:
"If you're wondering how to make a patched out version of the Sound Lab Mini-Synth instead of the normallized version here are some guidelines. I will be adding to this page as I have opportunity and ideas. Obviously this is just my first shot at this. I think if you have some electronics savvy you will be able to do whatever you want after reviewing these guidelines. You can use banana jacks or you can use phone jacks. Just ground the ground lead of the jacks to the ground of the unit and you will be fine."

also from my limited stompbox building experience all jacks must be grounded

thanks for the link

mosc · Posted: Fri May 13, 2005 9:41 am Post subject:

Well, you can not ground a banana jack since it has only one conductor. Laughing

Don't worry about this. There are many synths that use banana jacks. If this makes you nervous, then use some other kind of patch cords.

http://www.cyndustries.com/modules_minimac.cfm

http://www.serge-fans.com/

http://www.modcan.com/mount.html

Many more...

Mike Walters · Joined: Mar 24, 2005 Posts: 29 Location: Chapel Hill NC

The ground thing can be an issue if you want to interface with external gear. Unless they are both already grounded together through the audio outputs. Might be a good idea to have a banana jack dedicated for ground. I just have a grounded lug that I attach an alligator clip. I just haven't gotten around to doing the dedicated ground jack.

But yeah, patching out is the way to go! You can actually do both, with switches and patch points if you want. The advantage of patching is using external devices in fun and interesting ways!

Albut · Joined: Apr 09, 2005 Posts: 14 Location: England

Hi,
I personally would use mono switched jack sockets. Either 1/4" or 3.5mm. I think 1/4" are more reliable if you have the panel space.
They vary in price with quality, but even the cheep ones work fine if you buy the same make of plug to make your patch leads.

Cheap banana plugs and sockets can be a tight fit when plugging in and out, and good quality ones are expesive.

With switched jack sockets you can connect the the normaly closed (NC) pin on the socket to other sockets so that you can wire up your mini synth so that with no patch leads inserted it is connected. This is called "normalizing".

You could normalize VCO1 to Mixer input 1, VCO2 to Mixer input2, etc. Connect the Mixer output to VCFilter input, the VCFilter output to the VCA input. You could connect CV outputs to modulation inputs in the same way. When you plug a patch lead into one of the normalized sockets, it switches off the pre wired connection, and over rides it with the signal or CV on the patch lead. So you can still patch anything to anything if you want. This is a very versatile system and you can`t do this with bananas.

Hope this gives you some ideas.

Cheers
Albut

Wild Zebra · Posted: Fri May 13, 2005 10:44 am Post subject:

Thanks for all the info so far everyone. Now this is what I'm talking about
you're getting my sprockets rolling.

Albut, I like that Idea. When its not patched up it would be "hard-wired", for a lack of better words and then when I start patching it will disconnect. For me its like hooking the - battery terminal to a the input of a stompbox.
Jack plugged in sompbox on. jack out battery off. So I understand the concept.

Mike, a have a ? for you since yours is patchable. On the schematic do I just tap in to the point on the board i.e. like a resistor with some hook-up wire. I mean thats what I figure I do. Then for outputs put a 1k between the wire and jack.

thanks for the ideas so far I hope everyone else reads this and gains from you valuabe info.

can't wait to update on a finished product, but I'll be on vaca so it'll be a little before I smell solder fumes again.

take care

Mike Walters · Joined: Mar 24, 2005 Posts: 29 Location: Chapel Hill NC

Wild Zebra · Posted: Fri May 13, 2005 11:37 am Post subject:

Thanks Mike, One more ? I should of asked earlier and I think i'm well on my way. O.K. I got one wire from point on schemo I want 3 outputs. Just solder 3 resistors to the end and go to appropriate jacks? Man I'll tell you what you've been a big help and I'm gonna leave y'all alone for a while. I know these probably sound like like stupid ?'s, but I'm just reinforcing the ideas I already feel to be correct.

your site is great Mike very creative and interesting stuff

Mike Walters · Joined: Mar 24, 2005 Posts: 29 Location: Chapel Hill NC

Hey thanks!

Actually, I think you could just do 1 resistor to the 3 jacks, rather than a resistor for each. Since I used bananas, I only have single patch points that can be stacked. Essentially, that would be the same thing.

Wild Zebra · Posted: Fri May 13, 2005 12:18 pm Post subject:

Well, thank you, thank you

I think I can figure it out. Maybe a 1k in series then daisy chain the jacks if I use regular mono phone jacks?

I,m still confused about the bananas I wish I could see an inside view of the technique. I don't understand "stacking" and how you connect them.
I can sort of visualize it. Anyway, maybe that can be fielded later.

thanks for all the help

Wild Zebra · Posted: Wed Jun 22, 2005 7:24 am Post subject:

Allright I'm hoping soon I will have more answers than questions. So I'm wiring this sucker up. The pacthed out version. My ? is what about all the connections that get teminated due to not using the switches. Do they become obsolete, not used anymore. Or do they need to be hooked up.

I'm following the patch schem. Adding 1k resistors to my jacks at the locations. I'm guessing maybe some spots on the board won't get used anymore and the patches are going to make those connections.

Sorry if it sounds confusing

v-un-v · Posted: Wed Jun 22, 2005 9:36 am Post subject:

Hey Zebra,

I'm going banana(s) too. Went and got a couple from Maplin this morning (Blighty's version of Radio Shack). Forget jacks, bananas are definately the way forward imo.

I guess I'm lucky. I can visualise easily in 3-D. But heres a pickie to help you understand.

Tom

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Wild Zebra · Posted: Wed Jun 22, 2005 9:49 am Post subject:

Well to late I already got jacks. I got switching jacks so when its not patched I can use it like its normalized. As to my ? I been studying this schematic for about 2hrs and I think I'm starting to get the picture.

I guess thats what they call stackable banana jacks ?

So how close are you? I'm hoping tonight I may have everything wired and get some sound. Ran out of solder and need 2x2uf caps. Can't find any though figure I'll twist some 1uf's together

then onto the case. I can't wait to see a pick of that clear case Soundlab

v-un-v · Posted: Thu Jun 23, 2005 1:34 am Post subject:

Zebra,

I'm not as close as you are I'm afraid. Still quite a way off. But the box (the most important thing- the pcb is the easy part) is almost there :)

Tom