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mosc
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Joined: Jan 31, 2003 Posts: 18251 Location: Durham, NC
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Posted: Wed Jun 29, 2005 8:10 am Post subject:
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You're both very welcome. I admire your energy and enthusiasm for these projects. I used to do llots of building years ago. It's a great way to learn electronics and you can build instruments that a perfectly matched to your musical interests and abilities. Also, the DIY crew brings a refreshing diversity to the electro-music.com community. I wish we could get some circuit benders to use the forums here. I'd be quite happy to have a Benders' forum. _________________ --Howard
my music and other stuff |
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dnny

Joined: Mar 12, 2005 Posts: 519 Location: Helsinki, Finland
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Posted: Wed Jun 29, 2005 8:26 am Post subject:
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mosc wrote: | I wish we could get some circuit benders to use the forums here. I'd be quite happy to have a Benders' forum. |
you read my mind . . . i haven´t do lot bending but i would like to read "professionals" posts about it and then start to bend my diy-instruments...
i think i will start from MFOS: Weird Sound Generator
hope some bender´s get here soon...
daniel |
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v-un-v
Janitor


Joined: May 16, 2005 Posts: 8932 Location: Birmingham, England, UK
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Posted: Wed Jun 29, 2005 8:29 am Post subject:
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mosc wrote: | I wish we could get some circuit benders to use the forums here. I'd be quite happy to have a Benders' forum. |
LOL! I'd be careful how you phrase that mosc- you could upset a lot of people! ;)
I've done quite a bit of circuit bending in the past. The problem however with circuit bending is that not all toys are alike and where one may work fine with a certain type of modification, it may fry another on a similar looking circuit.
These toys were never intended for that purpose- as you most probably know :)
One of my very close friends Brian Duffy (Modified Toy Orchestra) is a genius at circuit bending. It's a shame that he never goes near lists. It's worth looking at his site- although it mainly features recordings available. (http://www.warmcircuit.com/web/)
Tom :-) _________________ ACHTUNG!
ALLES TURISTEN UND NONTEKNISCHEN LOOKENPEEPERS!
DAS KOMPUTERMASCHINE IST NICHT FÜR DER GEFINGERPOKEN UND MITTENGRABEN! ODERWISE IST EASY TO SCHNAPPEN DER SPRINGENWERK, BLOWENFUSEN UND POPPENCORKEN MIT SPITZENSPARKSEN.
IST NICHT FÜR GEWERKEN BEI DUMMKOPFEN. DER RUBBERNECKEN SIGHTSEEREN KEEPEN DAS COTTONPICKEN HÄNDER IN DAS POCKETS MUSS.
ZO RELAXEN UND WATSCHEN DER BLINKENLICHTEN. |
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s. t. Demas

Joined: Jun 21, 2005 Posts: 17 Location: Holland
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mosc
Site Admin

Joined: Jan 31, 2003 Posts: 18251 Location: Durham, NC
Audio files: 226
G2 patch files: 60
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Posted: Wed Jun 29, 2005 1:10 pm Post subject:
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OK, I have just created a Circuit Bending forum under Instruments and Equipment. Well see what happens. I think it's a great field.
I'm going to split this topic to make the first topic in the new forum. Thanks for your enthusiasm.  _________________ --Howard
my music and other stuff |
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s. t. Demas

Joined: Jun 21, 2005 Posts: 17 Location: Holland
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Posted: Thu Jun 30, 2005 3:01 am Post subject:
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mosc wrote: | OK, I have just created a Circuit Bending forum under Instruments and Equipment. Well see what happens. I think it's a great field.
I'm going to split this topic to make the first topic in the new forum. Thanks for your enthusiasm.  |
cool
i dont think a lot of people do it , but i think its fun stuff.
you got modding and bending , the difference isnt clear for me .
what is modded and what is bended ? the qoustion is also what can be modded and what can be bended.
i think the older stuff is better because for bending , some cheap casio s for sure |
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davep

Joined: Jul 05, 2004 Posts: 467 Location: Oakland, CA
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Posted: Thu Jun 30, 2005 10:17 am Post subject:
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s. t. Demas wrote: |
cool
i dont think a lot of people do it , but i think its fun stuff.
you got modding and bending , the difference isnt clear for me .
what is modded and what is bended ? the qoustion is also what can be modded and what can be bended.
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It seems to me that the difference between a mod and a bend is based mostly on what kind of equipment you are starting with, not what you do to it. If it's a real instrument, it's a mod. If it's a toy or something that was never intended for making electronic music, it's a bend. For example, adding patchpoints to an Arp Odyssey synthesizer is a mod, adding patchpoints to a Speak N' Spell toy is a bend. But Joker & the other guys who actually do this may have another view on this.... _________________ Dave Peck |
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v-un-v
Janitor


Joined: May 16, 2005 Posts: 8932 Location: Birmingham, England, UK
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Posted: Thu Jun 30, 2005 11:50 am Post subject:
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davep wrote: |
It seems to me that the difference between a mod and a bend is based mostly on what kind of equipment you are starting with, not what you do to it. If it's a real instrument, it's a mod. If it's a toy or something that was never intended for making electronic music, it's a bend. For example, adding patchpoints to an Arp Odyssey synthesizer is a mod, adding patchpoints to a Speak N' Spell toy is a bend. But Joker & the other guys who actually do this may have another view on this.... |
I don't know if I agree with you here Dave. A mod is definately something you do to enhance something- like for eg putting a feedback pot into a phaser without one. Bending is more like 'lets stick this here and stick the other end there and see what happens'. It's more about chaos and anti- theory than theory. Most people I know who bend circuits have no knowledge of electronics at all- apart from how to solder.
Traditionally (well traditionally I mean for the last few years of the circuit bending art) CB is done with battery operated toys because;
1. They're cheap
and
2. (most importantly) they are battery operated. This is because putting your fingers into a circuit which is connected to the mains- you could seriously harm yourself possibly even resulting in death from electrocution. (In fact it may be a good idea to put in a disclaimer that E-M excepts no responsibility whatsoever for people who may do just that!!!)
Good luck to you all!
Tom |
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seraph
Editor


Joined: Jun 21, 2003 Posts: 12398 Location: Firenze, Italy
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Posted: Thu Jun 30, 2005 2:45 pm Post subject:
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v-un-v wrote: | Most people I know who bend circuits have no knowledge of electronics at all- apart from how to solder |
wow! that's me you make me want to try it
v-un-v wrote: | you could seriously harm yourself possibly even resulting in death from electrocution |
well...maybe not  _________________ homepage - blog - forum - youtube
Quote: | Don't die with your music still in you - Wayne Dyer |
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v-un-v
Janitor


Joined: May 16, 2005 Posts: 8932 Location: Birmingham, England, UK
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Posted: Thu Jun 30, 2005 4:38 pm Post subject:
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seraph wrote: |
v-un-v wrote: | you could seriously harm yourself possibly even resulting in death from electrocution |
well...maybe not :wink: |
well funnily enough I did get quite a nasty shock from touching the flourescent tube in a speak and spell trying to bend the speak n spell board- and that's only 3 volts :-/
the basic rule is stay away from the mains unless you know what you are doing. And yes most people here are fairly wise and knowledgeable but you do get the occasional nutter!
It's worth having a look at this link;
http://censtron.com/resources/wave_vessel.php
(I'm sure this bloke was wearing rubber gloves before?) |
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dnny

Joined: Mar 12, 2005 Posts: 519 Location: Helsinki, Finland
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Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2005 1:24 am Post subject:
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woaah!
thats just awesome!
finally a god use to televisions - these days they only show crap
(at leasts here in Finland).
there should be some reality shows about different teams building up synts from used household electronics... that would make my day
daniel |
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seraph
Editor


Joined: Jun 21, 2003 Posts: 12398 Location: Firenze, Italy
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Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2005 2:27 am Post subject:
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dnny wrote: |
there should be some reality shows about different teams building up synts from used household electronics... |
you'd end up with a TV share below zero  _________________ homepage - blog - forum - youtube
Quote: | Don't die with your music still in you - Wayne Dyer |
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s. t. Demas

Joined: Jun 21, 2005 Posts: 17 Location: Holland
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Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2005 9:45 am Post subject:
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that tv bending isnt my thing , im lucky to survived my first bending.
i got some great shockes out of that thing, but i am stil alive
but its a lot clearer for me what is the bending and the modding.
basicly the bending you do it yuorself ,and the modding better leave that to the experts.
mabay thats the fun ,it are the sounds of the unexpected.
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paul e.

Joined: Sep 22, 2003 Posts: 1567 Location: toronto, canada
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paul e.

Joined: Sep 22, 2003 Posts: 1567 Location: toronto, canada
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s. t. Demas

Joined: Jun 21, 2005 Posts: 17 Location: Holland
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Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2005 2:15 pm Post subject:
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that should make some nasty noise  |
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v-un-v
Janitor


Joined: May 16, 2005 Posts: 8932 Location: Birmingham, England, UK
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Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2005 4:05 pm Post subject:
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paul e. wrote: |
take a good look around the site... these guys are having us on...it's a pretty clever joke tho...
uh..yeah...hehehe |
Oh Paul you do disappoint me! Sure it's about having a joke but a very funny -and very enjoyable joke too! But it's not at you but of exploring the other musical possibilities that these items weren't designed for. You just need an openmind and a GSOH :) You could call it a type of installation art if you want to?!
This bloke is the master- and the bloke who started it all- introducing..... Mr Reed Ghazala ;))
-highly recommended-
http://www.anti-theory.com/mainpage/
But if you do want to mess with circuit bending, get your toys to be bent from a car boot sale rather than ebay 'cos you'll end up defeating the whole object of the excercise!
if you've got a fucked-up old electronic toy that your cat pissed on a while ago but it still works , then why not take it apart a rewire the insides? touching 2 pins and some wire connected to them, to and from any other components, IC's etc. LSI chips and digital circuitry seem to work best. Analogue is a bit of a dead dog (and too bloody expensive too). Also' dot' IC's get hot really quickly when bent- so watch out. It's fun :)
The casio's are good to rewire for starters. you can pick those up for about 50p in car boot sales. The SA range (I think it's the SA-100 which is really fun to bend?) are the best- especially the ones with the mini keyboards. A lot of people also go for the Casio SK-1's- although those too are getting quite expensive now- which is a shame because they are pretty crap.
I think this is why attention has moved to even cheaper and more bizarre things and especially more visual stuff- like the TV.
Also, most of the time, don't expect the bent keyboards to make any musical sound at all while being bent. They should however - especially if you wire in on-off switches - return to normal with all switches at the off position _________________ ACHTUNG!
ALLES TURISTEN UND NONTEKNISCHEN LOOKENPEEPERS!
DAS KOMPUTERMASCHINE IST NICHT FÜR DER GEFINGERPOKEN UND MITTENGRABEN! ODERWISE IST EASY TO SCHNAPPEN DER SPRINGENWERK, BLOWENFUSEN UND POPPENCORKEN MIT SPITZENSPARKSEN.
IST NICHT FÜR GEWERKEN BEI DUMMKOPFEN. DER RUBBERNECKEN SIGHTSEEREN KEEPEN DAS COTTONPICKEN HÄNDER IN DAS POCKETS MUSS.
ZO RELAXEN UND WATSCHEN DER BLINKENLICHTEN. |
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seraph
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Joined: Jun 21, 2003 Posts: 12398 Location: Firenze, Italy
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Posted: Sat Jul 02, 2005 12:11 am Post subject:
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v-un-v wrote: | if you've got a fucked-up old electronic toy that your cat pissed on a while ago but it still works , then why not take it apart a rewire the insides? |
I would call it a stinkin' project  _________________ homepage - blog - forum - youtube
Quote: | Don't die with your music still in you - Wayne Dyer |
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mosc
Site Admin

Joined: Jan 31, 2003 Posts: 18251 Location: Durham, NC
Audio files: 226
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Posted: Sat Jul 02, 2005 12:12 pm Post subject:
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You should never bend or play bent devices that are powered from the AC mains. Always use batteries. _________________ --Howard
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dnny

Joined: Mar 12, 2005 Posts: 519 Location: Helsinki, Finland
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Posted: Mon Jul 04, 2005 10:22 am Post subject:
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i got it ready
i will start new topic about modifying TVs to Analog Visualization Unit -
it might be dangerous but it can be done
daniel |
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s. t. Demas

Joined: Jun 21, 2005 Posts: 17 Location: Holland
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Posted: Mon Jul 04, 2005 12:49 pm Post subject:
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dnny wrote: | i got it ready
i will start new topic about modifying TVs to Analog Visualization Unit -
it might be dangerous but it can be done
daniel |
cool , does it make a soumd or just the picture , no mp 3 ?
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dnny

Joined: Mar 12, 2005 Posts: 519 Location: Helsinki, Finland
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Posted: Mon Jul 04, 2005 1:31 pm Post subject:
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s. t. Demas wrote: |
cool , does it make a sound or just the picture , no mp 3 ?
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just picture - no sound (sofar)- soon i will have videoclip of it |
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s. t. Demas

Joined: Jun 21, 2005 Posts: 17 Location: Holland
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Posted: Mon Jul 04, 2005 2:33 pm Post subject:
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its a cool tv , kind of painting for a dark room .
looks bizzarre  |
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gsga

Joined: Jul 22, 2004 Posts: 267 Location: allentown, pa
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Posted: Thu Sep 08, 2005 3:11 pm Post subject:
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Just saw this. Great idea to have a dedicated forum. Does anyone have any DIY links for beginners like me? Or any other resources? I want to get started on this ASAP, as I have alot of toys/toy synths at my disposal.
Xyn? Anyone? _________________ "Pop music is for sheep and we are wolves disguised as shepherds." |
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zynthetix
Joined: Jun 12, 2003 Posts: 838 Location: nyc
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Posted: Thu Sep 08, 2005 7:51 pm Post subject:
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I used some of Reed Ghazala's diagrams when wiring up a Speak n Math. His site is here:
http://www.anti-theory.com/soundart/
I was looking for those useful but weirdly drawn circuit board schemes on his site - they look like planets with pin numbers and lightning bolts connecting them to represent wires to add for bending... I couldn't find these schemes, but I noticed he has a new book out...maybe he took them off the site and put them in the book?
From what I gather, its a kind of hit or miss process when bending an instrument. Take it apart, make some sound (however the device does normall), and touch random parts of the circuit board to see if the sound alters. If the sound does alter, play with those areas more and try to precisely find which pins or components on the circuit board are affecting the sound. Once you find some of these "hot spots", you can solder seprate wires to them and figure out how you want to access these hot spots once the thing is back together. You can solder a switch or push button to the newly added wires, or solder thumb tack finishing nails to each wire and mount them to the outside of the case. (you'd be touching the head of the finishing nails with your fingers from the outside of the instrument to warp the noise). You can also add a resistor or a knob inbetween the wires you've soldered to vary the too. Its basically a whole whole lot of experimentation to see what happens.
I think and of the Texas Instruments Speak &.... devices are good to start with, since those are gauranteed to have some good results and theres a lot of people who have played with those and posted tips on the web.
Does anybody remember Joker's "circuit bending tool" he had at electro-music 2005? It was a little red box with a one row of resistor knobs (varying strengths) and one row of capacitor knobs, a set of pins for each row. He would connect the wires of two "hot spots" on the toys to the pins and play with the knobs to see what capacitance or resistance number made the best sound, then solder a seperate capacitor or resistor or knob to the hot spots when done. It was damn fine tool, makes it quicker to experiment and adds some method to the mayhem. |
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